Transcript

Dangerous Anti-ICE Rhetoric, Golden Globes Hacks, and Shock Actor Allegations, w/ Geragos & Murphy

From Megyn Kelly · Episode page · Watch on YouTube

· 2 h 19 min · 24,083 words · 263 timestamped sections

This is the full, timestamped transcript of "Dangerous Anti-ICE Rhetoric, Golden Globes Hacks, and Shock Actor Allegations, w/ Geragos & Murphy", an episode of Megyn Kelly published January 12, 2026 (2 h 19 min, about 24,083 words). It mentions 28 people, works and ideas, including Renee Mlin Good, ICE, Timothy Busfield, Melissa Gilbert, Tom H. Holman.

What this episode is about

The discussion centers on the recent allegations against actor Timothy Busfield, who is wanted in connection with child abuse charges involving two young boys. Additionally, it examines the hypocrisy of his wife, actress Melissa Gilbert, who publicly criticized others for their views on abuse while she was aware of the investigation into her husband's serious charges.

Key takeaways

  • When virtue signaling collides with scandal, hypocrisy often emerges—celebrities should tread carefully.
  • The Golden Globes: where shining stars may hide darkest secrets—moral grandstanding isn't just for the big screen.
  • Police body cam footage reveals moments of fear and confusion, challenging narratives spun by mainstream media.
  • Caught on tape: when your partner's encouragement leads to resisting arrest, the line blurs between victim and accomplice.
  • In the age of social media, scandal and virtue can coexist, but public scrutiny inevitably sees through the facade.

Who speaks in this episode?

What is discussed, and when

  1. – 15:00: Renee Mlin Good, Alpha News, Melissa Gilbert, Minnesota Star Tribune
  2. – 30:00: Renee Mlin Good, Reena Shaw, ICE, Jacob Fry
  3. – 45:00: Renee Mlin Good, Dan Goldman, ICE, Dave Aronberg
  4. – 1:00:00: Portland, Renee Mlin Good, Donald Trump, Antifa
  5. – 1:15:00: Cam Higgby, Renee Mlin Good, Golden Globe, Timothy Busfield
  6. – 1:30:00: Timothy Busfield, Donald C. Murphy, Golden Globe, Mark Garagos
  7. – 1:45:00: Timothy Busfield
  8. – 2:00:00: Timothy Busfield, Donald Trump, Melissa Gilbert
  9. – 2:15:00: Melissa Gilbert, Renee Mlin Good, Timothy Busfield, Mark Garagos
  10. – 2:18:33: Timothy Busfield, Melissa Gilbert

Notable quotes from "Dangerous Anti-ICE Rhetoric, Golden Globes Hacks, and Shock Actor Allegations, w/ Geragos & Murphy"

  • Have a lot to cover this morning, including an in-depth legal discussion on Hollywood actor Timothy Busfield's child abuse allegations. A warrant for his arrest was issued…
    about Timothy Busfield · at
  • And what his preference was in terms of women he attacked or young girls he attacked, while knowing full well that her husband was being investigated by police for allegedly…
    about Melissa Gilbert · at
  • The moral hypocrisy from the usual Hollywood crowd. We're going to get to into all of that coming up with our legal dream team of Matt Murphy and Mark Garagos. that moral…
    about Donald C. Murphy · at
  • Organization. Alpha News got and released video it obtained showing the shooting of 37year-old Renee Good from the perspective of the ICE officer who fired the shots. It was…
    about Renee Mlin Good · at
  • Go to any of these lunatics are out there. They're they'll all be happy to put it on. Go to NPR. They could not be more in the tank for you. she won't.
    about NPR · at
  • What he's doing there is a mission given to him by his boss Christine Nome and President Trump and her feelings about it are totally irrelevant.
    about Donald Trump · at
  • Fuzzy about her? And by the way, for what it's worth, and maybe it's not worth anything to the detractors, Tom H.
    about Tom H. Holman · at
  • Were used and she was shot and killed in this way to me is the most horrifying part. Why does an ICE agent have a gun?
    about ICE · at

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

  • Renee Mlin Good — Person · Core topic (deceased subject of incident) · 19 mentions · first at
    Her fatal shooting by an ICE officer in Minneapolis is the episode’s dominant news story, used to argue about self-defense, media framing, and anti-ICE rhetoric.
  • Timothy Busfield — Person · Core topic (subject of legal segment) · 21 mentions · first at
    Second major segment centers on allegations of child sexual abuse and an arrest warrant issued in New Mexico; discussed with legal panel.
  • Melissa Gilbert — Person · Referenced person (spouse; hypocrisy narrative) · 10 mentions · first at
    Discussed as Busfield’s wife and as having criticized Megan Kelly about Epstein while allegedly knowing of the investigation into her husband.
  • Tom H. Holman — Person · Referenced official / spokesperson · 10 mentions
    Quoted describing contact with the officer and urging people to let investigations play out; used to support the host’s argument about threats and rhetoric.
  • Donald C. Murphy — Person · Legal panelist (co-host/guest on segment) · 5 mentions · first at
    Provides prosecutorial perspective on Busfield allegations, evidentiary issues, and corroboration standards.
  • Donald Trump — Person · Referenced political figure · 4 mentions · first at
    Presented as directing ICE’s mission; also referenced regarding claims about whether an ICE agent was 'run over' and as a target of protest rhetoric.
  • Mark Garagos — Person · Legal panelist (co-host/guest on segment) · 4 mentions · first at
    Introduced as part of the legal team to analyze Busfield case; referenced as experienced in such cases.
    Hollywood crowd. We're going to get to into all of that coming up with our legal dream team of Matt Murphy and Mark Garagos. that moral hypocrisy, by the way, on display last…
  • Jacob Fry — Person · Criticized public official · 2 mentions · first at
    Minneapolis mayor criticized for disputing baseline facts and portraying Renee Good as blameless; used to illustrate political rhetoric around the incident.
    All these new videos, the Minneapolis mayor, Jacob Fry, what a cretton he is, continued with the narrative that Renee Good played no role, none in what happened to her.
  • Dan Goldman — Person · Criticized politician · 3 mentions · first at
    Presented as amplifying a narrative that Renee Good followed orders/was given conflicting instructions; host criticizes his shift 'far left'.
    But he's not alone. Dan Goldman, who I'm I'm embarrassed to say I ever platformed while I was NB NBC. he was like a commentator at NBC News when I was there for my very brief stint. And we they.
  • Reena Shaw — Person · Criticized media commentator · 3 mentions · first at
    Quoted on MSNBC segment questioning why ICE agents have guns; host uses her as an example of 'inane' commentary.
    Here's Reena Shaw on MS Now with another equally probing question in Sop 48.
  • Cam Higgby — Person · Referenced independent journalist (with Sorder) · 3 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as accompanying Nick Sorder during protest coverage and being threatened by protesters.
    Was brutally attacked and now it's happening to Nick Sorder who was there with another independent journalist Cam Higgby trying to cover this. And just a thought, okay, when CBS relaunched its evening news with the with Topra.
  • Christine Nome — Person · Referenced official (ICE chain of command claim) · 2 mentions · first at
    Cited as the ICE officer’s 'boss' (spelled 'Nome' in transcript) to argue the officer was executing a lawful mission.
    Tom H. Homeman and Christy Gnome have these guys out there trying to clean up Joe Biden's mess, his 10 to 12 to 20 million illegals he opened the southern border with and let in. And they're.
  • Dave Aronberg — Person · Referenced legal commentator · 2 mentions · first at
    Credited with a 'Rorschach test' analogy about interpreting the video; also cited as an example of a 'normal' liberal.
    Honestly, like I realize, who was it? Dave Aronberg said that the tape is like a roar shark test. I guess that reveals either you're conservative or you're left-wing bonafites and you see what you want to.
  • Caitlyn Kalinsson — Person · Referenced eyewitness (via NPR) · 1 mention · first at
    NPR cites her as videotaping and claiming Renee Good received conflicting instructions; host disputes this claim.
    Caitlyn Kalinsson was there and videotaped the shooting. She says good was in her car and received multiple conflicting instructions from officers.
  • Brandy Zadrgnney — Person · Criticized media commentator · 2 mentions · first at
    Quoted questioning why the officer filmed; host attacks her competence and bias.
    Well, one thing that stands out to me is the question that was just brought up. Why is this person filming? And Ross did testify in December at the during the trial in December…
  • Laura Ingalls Wilder — Person · Referenced cultural figure (via TV role) · 1 mention · first at
    Mentioned because Melissa Gilbert is described as known for playing Laura on Little House on the Prairie; used to identify Gilbert for audience.
    The West Wing. He's married to actress Melissa Gilbert, best known, and let's be honest, really only known for playing Laura Les on Little House on the Prairie. Laura Ingles…

Companies & orgs

  • ICE — Company · Core topic (law enforcement org in incident) · 3 mentions · first at
    ICE officers are central to the Minneapolis shooting narrative; the episode debates their authority, use of force, and public/media rhetoric about them.
  • Alpha News — Company · Referenced media outlet (source of video) · 4 mentions · first at
    Credited with obtaining and releasing the ICE officer iPhone video; positioned as a trusted alternative to local mainstream media.
    Disgusting Minneapolis Star Tribune and therefore it's hated by that organization. Alpha News got and released video it obtained showing the shooting of 37year-old Renee Good…
  • NPR — Company · Criticized media outlet · 3 mentions · first at
    Used as an example of allegedly inaccurate framing ('conflicting instructions') and as a Golden Globes podcast nominee criticized by the host.
  • Antifa — Company · Referenced protest movement · 2 mentions · first at
    Invoked to characterize protest activity and threats against ICE and journalists; used rhetorically as 'Karen-tifa'.
    Antifa. Antifa Karen. She needs to be arrested. Like she's definitely going to get herself arrested. You don't get arrested for being alone. But if she acts on any of that weird anger toward.

Places & events

  • Golden Globe — Event · Referenced event (culture/media critique) · 7 mentions · first at
    Used as an example of 'moral hypocrisy' and politicized messaging; also discussed for adding a best podcast category and NPR nomination.
    Legal dream team of Matt Murphy and Mark Garagos. that moral hypocrisy, by the way, on display last night at the Golden Globes, too. More on that coming up. But first, news out of Minneapolis continues to dominate.
  • Portland — Place · Referenced comparison location · 4 mentions · first at
    Appears in a clip of a confrontation with Portland police, used to illustrate antagonism toward law enforcement.
    I'm an officer with Portland police. I'm an ECIT officer.

Media & podcasts

  • Minnesota Star Tribune — Media · Criticized media outlet · 2 mentions · first at
    Contrasted with Alpha News; accused of biased coverage and of not publishing potentially exculpatory video from Renee Good’s wife.
    Video? She was videoing the police officer and that hasn't been made public. Why didn't she leak that to the Minneapolis Star Tribune if it helps her, right? She's not going to go to Alpha. Okay, go to Star Tribune, go to MSNBC,.
  • Little House on the Prairie — Media · Referenced media credit · 2 mentions · first at
    Used to identify Melissa Gilbert’s best-known role and connect to Laura Ingalls Wilder reference.
    Melissa Gilbert, best known, and let's be honest, really only known for playing Laura Les on Little House on the Prairie. Laura Ingles Wilder, she recently in November, it was…
  • Melania — Media · Advertised media · 2 mentions · first at
    A film promoted in an ad segment about the 20 days leading to the 2025 presidential inauguration.
    Before the ceremony, before history is made, every detail is chosen. From Amazon MGM Studios comes Melania. This new film takes you inside the 20 days leading up to the 2025…
  • 30 Something — Media · Referenced media credit · 1 mention · first at
    Mentioned to contextualize Timothy Busfield’s fame for younger audiences.
    Appears to be on the Lamb. the reporting this guy, for the younger audience, you may not know him. He was huge on 30 something back in the day, the West Wing. He's married to…
  • The West Wing — Media · Referenced media credit · 1 mention · first at
    Mentioned as another notable Timothy Busfield acting credit.
    Audience, you may not know him. He was huge on 30 something back in the day, the West Wing. He's married to actress Melissa Gilbert, best known, and let's be honest, really…

Sponsors

  • Amazon MGM Studios — Company · Advertiser / sponsor content · 1 mention · first at
    Mentioned in an ad read introducing the film 'Melania'.
    Facebook, and X. Before the cameras, before the ceremony, before history is made, every detail is chosen. From Amazon MGM Studios comes Melania. This new film takes you inside…

Full transcript with timestamps

Hey everyone, I'm Megan Kelly. Welcome to the Megan Kelly show. Oh my gosh, we have a lot to cover this morning, including an in-depth legal discussion on Hollywood actor Timothy Busfield's child abuse allegations. A warrant for his arrest was issued Friday. He has yet to turn himself into police. This arrest warrant came out of New Mexico where he is accused of having molested a young 7-year-old boy. and inappropriately touched and abused his brother, another 7-year-old boy. This is amazing. He appears to be on the Lamb. Uh the reporting this guy, for the younger audience, you may not know him. He was huge on 30 something back in the day, the West Wing. He's married to actress Melissa Gilbert, best known, and let's be honest, really only known for playing Laura Les on Little House on the Prairie. Laura Ingles Wilder, she recently in November, it was November 15th, which will become relevant, had

the gall to take shots at yours truly over factually accurate comments I made about Jeffrey Epstein, uh, and what his preference was in terms of women he attacked or young girls he attacked, while knowing full well that her husband was being investigated by police for allegedly molesting two young boys. She knew her husband was being investigated by police for child molestation when she took to her Instagram trying to generate news coverage about what a fierce warrior she was about abuse victims. What a liar. How disgusting is this? It happens every time these people who feel the need to virtue signal.

I'm a good person and you're not. That's what virtue signaling really is. They I mean, you can take it to the bank. They have something to hide. Take it to the bank. How many times does this happen where then later it comes out that that person has some criminal background, some perversion, some disgusting scandal within their family that they're feeling anxious or embarrassed about. This isn't even about her attack on me. It's it is the moral hypocrisy from the usual Hollywood crowd. We're going to get to into all of that coming up with our legal dream team of Matt Murphy and Mark Garagos. Uh that moral hypocrisy, by the way, on display last night at the Golden Globes, too. More on that coming up. But first, news out of Minneapolis continues to dominate.

Don't miss a moment. Subscribe to this show on YouTube, and follow me on Insta, Facebook, and X. Before the cameras, before the ceremony, before history is made, every detail is chosen. From Amazon MGM Studios comes Melania. This new film takes you inside the 20 days leading up to the 2025 presidential inauguration through the eyes of the first lady herself. Where fashion is not just style, it's strategy. Witness the image defining decisions made behind closed doors, a celebration of duty and glamour. Melania, only in theaters January 30th. I can't wait to see that.

On Friday night, right before we left air, Alpha News, which we love, it's out of Minnesota. It's more fair and balanced. It's the antidote to the disgusting Minneapolis Star Tribune and therefore it's hated by that organization. Alpha News got and released video it obtained showing the shooting of 37year-old Renee Good from the perspective of the ICE officer who fired the shots. It was from his iPhone camera that we'd been waiting for. Well, after the show, our producer Jake Whitman pointed out something most in the media missed. Right as the agent was about to be hit by her car, he screamed, "Whoa!" You can hear his fright. You can tell he's getting hit by a car. He's scared, as he should be, for his life.

Watch. You will hear the agent scream it 41 seconds into this clip. That's fine, dude.

I'm not mad, boy. Show your face. I'm not mad at you. It's okay. We don't change our plates every morning. Just so you know, it'll be the same plate when you come talk to us later. That's fine. US citizen. You want to come at us? You want to come at us? I said go get yourself some lunch, big boy. Go ahead. Get out of the car.

Get out of the car. Okay, there's so much there. So, first of all, you could hear him. Whoa. Whoa. And then the gunshot simultaneously as he's obviously being hit by the car and fearing for his life. I mean, it's all right there on the tape and and you hear not once, not twice, not three times, four times the officers say, "Get out of the car. Get out of the car. Get out of the car. Get out of the car." Four times. Remember when the left tried to tell us that they gave her conflicting instructions that they also told her to drive away? No, they didn't.

It was her wife who says at the end of that clip, "Drive, baby. Drive." The wife told her to drive and she did. Running over, almost running over this cop, hitting him and almost running over him. That's what happened. The cops were totally consistent. These officers, these ICE officers, who by the way do have arrest authority four times. Get out of the car. Get out of the car. Get out of the car. Get out of the car. The wife says, "Drive, baby. Drive." And she listened to the wife who should be arrested. That wife should be under arrest. She should she was aiding and abetting the resisting of arrest and and a fleeing from a crime scene. I that she's she's committing a felony. You could make a good case for felony murder here. She should be in custody right now. That woman. And by the way, where's her video? She was videoing the police officer and that hasn't been made public. Why didn't she leak that to the

Minneapolis Star Tribune if it helps her, right? She's not going to go to Alpha. Okay, go to go to Star Tribune, go to MSNBC, go to any of these lunatics are out there. They're they'll all be happy to put it on. Go to NPR. They could not be more in the tank for you. Um, she won't. She hasn't. Why is that? Do you think if that videotape actually helped her side, she'd be keeping it private? I don't think so. I think we all know the reason that she hasn't made it public the way clearly the officer involved in this thing did. And now you have these lunatics out there saying, "Why was he videotaping?" I think we have that. Do we have that, Deb? There there's media personalities upset about the fact that the officer was videotaping this incident. By the way, it started with him with the iPhone cir circling around her car. He was videotaping her car and her license plate as ICE has been doing

to make a record of these nerdwells who are breaking the law. Renee Good was parked perpendicularly blocking traffic. I'm going to get to that in one second, but you just tell me if you went out in your neighborhood and you decided to park your car perpendicular to the oncoming traffic, do you think somebody might pull you aside? Do you think you'd be in trouble with law enforcement? That you think you'd be complying with the law? Uh, I don't think so. That's why he was videotaping the vehicle, including the license plate, which the wife knew because she became antagonistic with him. And how about the antagonism, by the way? Okay. How about the antagonism?

People, the left is literally saying, "Oh my god, Rene's last words were, "Have a good day," or, "I'm good." Whatever her cheery little comment was there. Um, that wasn't a cheery little comment. She was very clearly antagonizing the police, trying to be Haven't you ever done this? I've done this. You know who I do this to? When somebody honks their horn at me and I'm driving, nine times out of 10, I put on a big smile and I give them a big wave like I'm confused, like I think they're they're saying hello to me. It's just kind of fun to antagonize somebody who's trying to upset you. I would never do it to a law enforcement officer. Can we rerack that tape that we just played?

Let's rerack it and play it again. Okay, listen for her. It's an antagonistic cheerfulness she's unleashing on him as evidenced. I'm not mad at you. I'm not mad at you. She says, "I'm not mad at you." Right? It's exactly what I do when I wave at the people who honk their horn at me. Except it's not law enforcement and and a potentially dangerous situation where you're blocking traffic. Listen for that. Listen to for the four times the cops tell her to get out of the car. Listen for her wife antagonizing the cop over videotaping and the license plate and then saying drive. Okay, listen.

He's walking over to the car and he's videotaping it. That's fine, dude. I'm not mad.

Show your face. I'm not mad at you. It's okay. We don't change our plates every morning. Just so you know, it'll be the same plate when you come talk to us later. That's fine. US citizen. You want to come at us? You want to come at us? I say go get yourself some lunch, big boy.

Go ahead. Get out of the car. Get out of the car. There it is. I mean, it's pretty clear, right? So, you see, um, that's fine, dude. I'm not mad at you. Oh, she's so sweet. She's so innocent. That's fine, dude. I'm not mad at you. Which of course is meant to telegraph, off. Everyone understands that. Literally, everybody sane knows that. And the leftists know that, too. They're misrepresenting it. And then you have the the wife antagonizing. You want to come at us? You want to come at us? you want some of this is basically what she's saying to him. And he was well aware of that and maintained his dignity and professionalism.

But the the nonsense that this was like some sweet stay-at-home mom just like out for groceries. Like, hi, I'm not mad at you. First of all, what is she? She She has nothing to be mad at him over. She's breaking the law, antagonizing law enforcement, and trying to stop a lawful police operation. No one really cares whether she's mad at him or not. But secondly, uh she has no business interacting with him in the first place. What he's doing there is a mission given to him by his boss Christine Nome and President Trump and her feelings about it are totally irrelevant.

Um that is not what you would glean if you watched any of the mainstream news. Okay. The Democrat party has an ex account that put out a screen grab of her showing her with her and her her fake smile. It's It's She's not actually happy to see him. They actually want us to believe she was like this sweet like, "Hi, I'm not mad at you. I'm so sweet." What a lie. That's so obvious. And here is what the caption of their post reads. Newly re newly released footage reveals Renee Nicole Good's last words. Renee Nicole Good. quote, "That's fine, dude. I'm not mad at you.

Gunshots ice colon That is disgusting. That is pure propaganda. That is exactly the kind of thing that's amping up the temperature in Minneapolis and elsewhere. And that is going to get an ICE officer killed." That's what I'm worried about. I'm sorry that Renee Good is dead. I genuinely am. But she brought it upon herself. You You don't You don't do this. Everyone knows that you don't antagonize cops in the middle of a law enforcement operation. I think I've told you guys this before, but my brother's a cop. Uh he made it all the way to lieutenant in Albany, New York, and now he's retired. And one day when he was training, he was a young cop, still foot patrol. And I was in law school in Albany, and I just taught an aerobics class, which I did to help put myself through law school. So, I was wearing sort of like an aerobics outfit. Kind of inappropriate, but whatever. I was in it all the time because I was paying my

bills that way. And I went by, there was like the Patty wagon there with my brother Paul who was making an arrest with other cops. And I was just so excited to see Paul on the job that I pulled over and got out of my car. I did have a long winter coat on, but underneath it was an aerobics outfit. And I was like, "Paul, Paul, hi. Hi." Like an idiot. And he's like, "Meg, get back in the car. I can't talk now. like this is not a good time. You do not want to walk into this like a dope like I was just excited to see my brother there doing his thing. But imag like he knew he had the good sense to say civilians beloved or not are not welcome into a situation like this. It is charged anything could happen. Well times 1000 in the situation into which Renee Good voluntarily put herself. She was the antagonist. She was about to be the arrestee and she was resisting arrest.

She knew very well what was about to happen to her. That's one of the reasons potentially why she tried to floor her accelerator. There's a big debate about whether she was just trying to get away or run over the officer. I have to say I don't care. It doesn't matter legally. All that matters is his point of view. And her reasons for almost running him over are irrelevant. All that is relevant is he genuinely believed he reasonably believed that he was about to be run over by her. But here you have the Democrat party putting out this little ad that suggests she said, "I'm not mad at you." And he shot her in the face and called her a By the way, it's now been reported uh by I think Alpha News as well and others that the the officer who used that term was not the officer who fired. It was a different officer who's obviously emotionally upset over the fact that she had just tried to kill a fellow officer.

All right. So, and at this point, they don't know what's happened to the woman. I'm sure the officer had no idea that she had died at that point. But look, it these officers are human beings. if he was feeling steam after the fact that she in his view almost killed at least two of these cops because one had his arm in her car. Who could blame him for not feeling totally warm and fuzzy about her? And by the way, for what it's worth, and maybe it's not worth anything to the detractors, Tom H. Homeman has said he's been in in touch with this officer. We've chosen not to name him and put his picture all over the board because people are doxing him.

They're threatening his family. This is ridiculous. Um, but he's spoken with them and said he's distraught. Here's Listen to Tom Hman here.

He's concerned. He's, you know, I've seen today his face all over social media. He's been doxed. People are threatening to kill him. Uh, so he's not good. You know, he fears for him and his family. And uh, again, let the invest let the investigation play out before you say you want to execute this man. Let the investigation play out. This officer is not in a good spot emotionally for his family.

Is he upset about what took place? Of course he is. I mean, any law enforcement officer who uses any sort Look, I I've I've been around a long time. Even if it's it's less lethal force, if you have to put hands on somebody and take them down, it affects you.

Of course, the guy's only human. But now you have these morons in the media looking at him and wanting him to have superhuman skills. They they say, "Oh, she reversed the car and then as she went forward, her front wheels for a second turned left and he was more to the right." Okay. He was in front of her car, right in front of the driver's side headlight. Uh uh either way, left or right, this guy was about to get run over. And the notion that he was able to look at the tires instead of the massive vehicle coming at him is absurd. Deb, can you recue the poor female officer in Baltimore who got run over? I'm going to first I'm going to play you while we get that. I'm going to play you the media commentary about how why was he walking around with a cell phone? How as though this is somehow nefarious? Listen here.

Well, one thing that stands out to me is the the question that was just brought up. Why is this person filming? And Ross did testify in December um at the the during the trial in December that he did they do not wear um cameras on their body. They do not wear body cam and they do not have dashboard cams as well. Not saying that that has anything to do, but I'm just they don't have cameras. So, his cell phone would have like possibly been the only camera he had. Um You know, I've seen a lot of these um videos from every angle now and um I I'm looking at JD Vance's tweet and he says, you know, that many of you say that the officer wasn't hit by a car, wasn't being harassed. And I I just I don't I still don't see him being hit by a car.

It's amazing that that wasn't the only inane media commentary. I mean, by the way, why isn't she happy he has a phone? She's not happy because she knows that the video exonerates him. So, now she's pissed. Wasn't it all these crazy leftists and their demands that everybody wear a body cam that's a police officer that led to this being the law in many places, regulations and other places, but not for ICE agents. So, what does this guy do? He he videotapes it. He's videotaping evidence of a crime. And then when everything goes down with Renee Good, he continues videotaping. He videotaped all the way until he was hit by her car as you can also see because he clearly drops the phone. Why'd he drop the phone if if there wasn't a calamity happening in the moment? Obviously, he wanted that on tape. You You can't please these people.

No, no body cam. Okay, I'll I'll videotape it myself. There's something suspicious about you. Something's wrong with that. And that's not the only point. that was on MS Now. Her name was Brandy Zadrgnney, who really should be ejected from any obvious commentary about this issue. I mean, clearly this woman's an idiot. I mean, even for MSNBC, truly they they go super biased, but they don't always go super dumb over there. She's too dumb. Even for MS. Here's Reena Shaw on MS Now with another equally probing question in Sop 48.

This was a mother. This was a woman that even said, "Hey, I'm not mad at you." Literally seconds before she was shot.

If they had the ability to get out of the way, they have a duty to get out of the way and not discharge their firearm, endangering

and and law enforcement officers are not supposed to be in front of people's cars.

The world is watching and the world knows that America has an issue with guns. I'm And police of course, but the gun thing, the fact that she was shot like this for what almost hit hitting this agent. I mean, the fact that guns were used and she was shot and killed in this way to me is the most horrifying part. Why does an ICE agent have a gun?

Oh my god, another idiot. Her name is Reena Shaw. I don't know what her background is, but once again, too dumb even for MS Now. May maybe MS yesterday, but MS Now really needs to up its game given their ratings over there. And I got I'm here to tell you, Reena Shaw, pro tip, is not the answer to your problems. Why does an ICE agent have a gun? You've got to be kidding me. They're law enforcement, madam. They are federalized law enforcement officers who are arresting murderers and child molesters who are under increasing threat to their own lives every single day thanks to your side of the aisle telling people that they're murderers, telling people that they're kidnapping people off the street, which is a lie. They are making lawful arrests and all of the people arrested will have their chance to contest the arrest in a court of law.

That's what's happening. Th this is getting out of control. All right. Now, back to the the scene. This was not the only new video that we just showed you, the from Alpha News, from the officer's iPhone camera of Renee Good's actions the day of the fatal shooting. Now, this next video has really got the left spinning. It was obtained by Town Hall and it shows Renee Good laying on the horn and blocking traffic. She appears at the beginning of this video to be dancing in her in her driver's seat. She's enjoying it and blocking traffic for over three minutes in that perpendicular position before these ICE officers even show up at the scene and to confront her. She's having a great time. She's the smiley, antagonistic, middle finger, off, ICE, and all anybody trying to arrest these illegals, social justice warrior. And we told you on Friday she had been trained at her son's woke school, reports the New York

Post, to do this, like a lot of training. Training on how to take down an officer, how to have a physical confrontation with an officer. And the thing with the cars is their their go-to breadandbut trick in trying to stop ICE arrests. Renee was trained and that training cost her her life. Look what she was doing.

That's her car, the marine one facing the wrong way on the road. All the others are honking. It's a means of harassing Ice. Now the confrontation's happening at the back of the car. The officer who's filming is moving toward the front of the car. Ice is moving over to the driver's side and then it cuts out. The rest Yeah, the rest you've seen. Um it is amazing. notwithstanding all this tape. I mean, honestly, like I I realize, who was it? Dave Aronberg said that the tape is like a a roar shark test. I guess that reveals either you're conservative or you're left-wing bonafites and you see what you want to see. I genuinely genuinely have tried to check that. And there that's why I say she accelerated the car into him. Now, that's true. That's just true. You don't have to put a motive on it. You don't have to say she tried to run him over, though. That's that's that's a strong case. You can make a strong case for it.

You don't have to say she was trying to do something else. I mean, I think it's clear she was trying to flee. At least that's the bare minimum of what she was trying to do because she had her foot on the accelerator and she was accelerating when she hit him. So, or when she ran into him, however you want to put it. The left is even disputing that he was hit. Well, it's strange because when you see his body camera, he yells, "Whoa!" He sounds scared. He fires a shot. He drops his phone, and you can see contact, what appears to be contact between the vehicle and his body. So, I mean, all of the evidence I I don't know how you'd prove that he was hit. Other than that, even the wide shots show at least clipped him. I'm not saying Trump said he she ran him over. That's too strong. But she at least clipped him.

There's just there's no disputing that. Um, but you still have leftists who are refusing to acknowledge the basic facts. The basic facts. You know, I I told you guys about NPR on Friday and how in incredible it was and how inaccurate it was. Let me just pull one S from that. Okay, I'm just going to pull Let's go with S 43. This is from NPR's Up First podcast on Friday morning. S 43.

Caitlyn Kalinsson was there and videotaped the shooting. She says good was in her car and received multiple conflicting instructions from officers.

She was told to get out of her car and she was also told to get out of the road. She was told to drive away. The ICE officer who ended up shooting her was in front of her vehicle and when she tried to get away because someone was pulling out her door, the ICE agent who was in front of her shot through the windshield once and then twice through the side. Okay, so that person has no idea what she's talking about. And I did not hear a correction on NPR's Up First This Morning at all. There is no question that the law enforcement officers told her to get out of her car four times.

And her crazy ass left-wing trained to antagonite ICE wife was the one who said, "Drive, baby. Drive." That wife got Renee Good killed. That's the truth. It was more the fault of the wife than it was of the cop. She told her as as the car is surrounded by ICE agents now, at least three, two of whom are touching the car or one's touching with the arm in, one's right in front of it, is about to get run over and one's approaching it. Drive, baby, drive. That's what happened. But NPR would like to platform Meg Anderson who says she was given conflicting directives by the cops. No, she wasn't. You madam or hashtag part of the problem. By the way, I'll get to this in a bit, but we mentioned the Golden Globes. Um NPR's upfirst was one of the nominees. Their little Leila Falden, who is the one who tries to sex talk you in the morning like, "Hello, I'm Leila Falden. Hey, it's NPR news. [gasps] Hey, thank you

for doing it. She's so inappropriate. Um, she was like, "We were the only news show to be to be nominated." Okay, that's a lie. Uh, many of us were in the mix. But some of us who had the pride not to pay the thousands of dollars you had to to wind up in the final category had enough pride to remove ourselves from consideration. Leila. Um, and this is what will get you nominated by Hollywood as a finalist in the best podcast category for news. You just have to put on Meg Anderson saying, "Poor Renee Good was given conflicting instructions." And gee, who among us would know what to do? It's infuriating.

Okay, more on the Globes later. Despite all these new videos, the Minneapolis mayor, Jacob Fry, what a cretton he is, continued with the narrative that Renee Good played no role, none in what happened to her. The ICE agent was not run over as Trump stated. Uh you had a person that was definitively trying to just get out of there. They were trying to leave the scene

definitively. That is not a person that's trying to run an ICE agent over. You have a person that is trying to protect our city to look out for our neighbors. When there is debate about baseline facts, like for instance, did the ICE agent get run over? Guys, the answer is no. It didn't happen.

Okay, so there you have somebody being totally irresponsible with the facts. He knows Jacob Fry in addition to his other litany of talents, the the woke performances at the side of George Floyd's casket on his knees with the mask, his open struggle sessions with the far-left progressives in his city after George Floyd self flagagillating all of the BS I cop to this and I cop to that that the leftist woke progressives have to do to be accepted by their crowd. And now in a mad dash to cover up for the fraud that is rampant in his city that's now being unearthed by the Trump administration and independent journalists, he's on a mission to sound like he is he's he's the avenger. He's the one who's going to stand up for all the poor innocent victims that the big bad ICE is randomly shooting for no reason whatsoever. Okay, good luck with that.

But he's not alone. Dan Goldman, who I'm I'm embarrassed to say I ever platformed while I was NB NBC. Uh he was like a commentator at NBC News when I was there for my very brief stint. And we they used to give him to me for like our morning news roundt. I'm telling you, he wasn't this crazy then. Like back then before he was a congressman, he was just a lawyer. I believe he's a former federal prosecutor. He was kind of normal. He was more left, but I like that. As you know, I like to have a variety of viewpoints on the show. I had no problem with that. It th this would be as if Dave Aaronburgg went as crazy as Dan Goldman. Like I like Dan. He was kind of normal and now he's gone so far freakishly left. I don't recognize him anymore. This will never happen to Dave Aronberg. He's he's left and he's normal and he's awesome. And that by the way, we should be reminded every day that is totally possible. I thank God for my

liberal friends. I really do because they remind me that not everybody is like these lunatics. They're beautiful, lovely people who I'm got to be honest, except for my one friend, they're not woke and they're sane and they're not that into politics anyway and they're not even thinking about this crap. They like vote Democrat. Most of them are pro-choice. They like the environment and they want low taxes, you know, for like workingass and middle class people. That's generally kind of how they why they're Democrats. Any my point is simply there are normal Democrats. We should not forget that because the country does does need to remember that not everybody's bad on the other side.

But Dan Goldman, I'm sorry. You're bad. You you kind of are you're pretty bad. Um you you are not a gold man. I'm not sure what what we should be calling Dan Goldman, but it certainly rhymes with frier. Starts with an L. Take a listen here in one. as you said and as we've seen from these videos and we can go through all the different reasons. Uh it was very clear that she was following the orders of the ICE agent to leave the car. Get out of the car.

Get out of the car. That's buted obviously with some of the cops telling her, "Get out of the car. Get out of the car." Um it's it's dangerous what they're doing. And not just those videos. Okay, there's more to get to here. Uh, over the weekend, social media was flooded with leftist white women. This is a Karen Inifada. It is. Saw that online. So, right. It's a Karen Inifada. Leftist white women. I'm sorry. I'm just gonna put it on the line. All of whom are unattractive. Most of whom are overweight. The vast majority of whom clearly have no jobs nor any sex in their lives. Like that just seems really clear. Let's be honest, okay? If you're getting some at home, you're not this angry all the time. Like, don't we all kind of know that? Um they're pissed off. the there I'm there's a reason you don't see slim, fit, goodlooking women at these protests. They're off living their beautiful lives. Every single one of

these women is like they spent too much time with the laz potato chips and the little Debbies and not enough time getting some at home with some hot loving dude or a dude at all. Not that you can have you can have lovely lesbians. I haven't seen any of them in Minneapolis. Um, so that's part of what we're seeing here. It's on the Karen and Tifa. And these unhappy, empty-hived leftists are now vowing to take on law enforcement, pretending like they're both like a badass cop busting, you know, vigilante type and also they're the victim because they're already the next Renee Good. Here is one woman with her face painted with an ICE badge over her mouth. She cries and winces as she plays audio from Rene's Renee Good's shooting. Watch this.

NO. [screaming] NO. SHAME. SHAME. OH MY GOD. She's just sitting there staring at us. I can't unhear the

sound of the car crashing after the gunshots. Justice for Renee. Good. Okay. I mean, all the only real justice she's pushing for there is that she see herself on camera, that she become a little star, a little vigilante star. Um, that's not even close to all we've got. I mean, the crazy ass women. I mean, that that could take us a while. Um, hold on a second. Where is that in my sat sheet, Deb? Because there's so many. We got to go through it. Um, let's see. Man, there's a lot to look at. Okay, let's start here with S 20.

You know what we're going to right now? What? We are going to what's called a vigil. Do you know what a vigil is?

What? So, it's where you like hold candles and you sing and you pray and you think about someone who died.

Oh, like church. Like church kind of. And yesterday someone died. Baba. Not Baba. I know your baba died last year. Yesterday, a woman named Renee Good, she was killed by one of those ICE guys. Remember how we talked about the ICE police officers? Not the regular police, the ICE police.

Oh, some ice police. They killed this woman. Why? These ICE officers are just trying to take all of the immigrants. Remember we talked about that? Like the people daddy helps?

What are immigrants? I don't know. So, they're the people that come from other countries and then they live here and a lot of times they have different accents or they speak other languages, right?

Like Yeah. And they or they have different skin color, right? Maybe they have darker skin. Some do, some don't.

Are they up in the sky? The the person who died is up in the sky. Yeah. And does it matter where anyone comes from? Are we better than them cuz we come from America?

No. No. Nobody's better than anybody else. Doesn't matter what look like. Doesn't matter how they talk, right? And so

Yes. And so remember Trump, ICE works for Trump. And he wants all the immigrants to go away, especially the ones with darker skin. Is that the right thing to do?

Oh, all of them? No. All of them. So then there was a lady. She wasn't an immigrant. She was just a citizen. They weren't being respectful.

She was coming to help and those ICE officers shot her. Do you think that was the right thing for us to do?

No. So, it makes mommy and daddy very upset that this happened. But we want to make sure that America is a great country. You want to live in a great country that has peace, where people are respectful to each other and kind and loving.

Yeah. When Trump's not the president, when Trump's not the president anymore, maybe things will be better. But right now, he's still the president for a few more years. He's not doing what presidents are supposed to. So, you know what you do when presidents aren't doing what they're supposed to do?

What? You go to vigils like what we're going to where we hold the candles and you go to protest. Remember when we went to the protest? That's how we show that we're not happy with what America is doing.

I can't wait till you get to how you're supposed to behave at the protest. Really looking forward to that discussion. That is child abuse. Can you believe Can you imagine psychologically manipulating your child like that with lies? like I there there were too many to list. She was just trying to do something nice and a nice agent shot her. They're the bad guys. They're here for no reason. Trump's a bad guy. Um like that. That's the kind of thing we we're hearing reports now of some children showing up in daycare and school talking about how they're having nightmares about this.

It's because of their psycho parents. Truly, the psycho parents are the ones who are causing that. And and speaking of psycho, here's another one, another lady who decided to offer a little warning to Ice and added the tune by talking heads psycho killer. Um, just for added effect, she's not the only one doing this kind of crazy ass crazy ass threatening video. Let's watch it.

Good afternoon. Donald Trump. Today I was at the range and it'll do your heart good to know there was a lot of women there. I was there not with my but with the little one that I carry with me all the time. And I'm going to show you up here a little picture of what I was aiming at today.

You magga You might think that we're out here just sitting around wondering what's going to happen.

I wondering about I know what's going to happen. you. better run away. Okay, so for listening audience, she's got bleached out, like two bleached out blonde hair, no makeup, sitting in her car. They're all sitting in their car. They're all very brave. Um, sitting in her car playing Talking Heads, clapping her hands.

Yeah, I love the talking heads and also threatening ice. Yeah, good times. And um saying that she's going the to the shooting range, taking aim at this and then showing a picture of a male crotch. So very nice, very classy, sweetheart. Um my money's on ice, but I object to you endangering them to begin with. There's more. Here's saut zero. This is a man. There are some quote doing air quotes now. men out there participating in all of this. And here's one of them. Listen to this psycho.

Hey, so look, I'm just going to come out and say it. Um I don't really care about the consequences anymore. I don't care. We need to kill these people. There's there's just an alternative. I don't care if you say, "Oh, I've got the crazy eyes." Whatever. Yeah, I do feel crazy. They're Nazis. Payton said it best. They're Nazis. And the only way to stop this let's be honest, is going to be to get violent. We got to get violent, people. And I'm tired of denying it. And I'm tired of y'all being about it. Grow up. We're not going to get through this holding hands. Peaceful protest only works if your enemy has a moral obligation to listen to it.

They have none. Okay. So, he goes by Monkey D Beans on his Instagram and he wants you to know he loves his cat. Okay, thanks for that. I think this guy might be in the process of transitioning. Just taking a look at him. He's got blue hair. He's got pink hair. It's weirdly long. Um, he's starting to look a little feminine. Um, I'm a little concerned about you're convincing anybody monkey debs, but I could be wrong. You could just be an odd-looking man. Uh, but literally saying we need to kill these guys. We quote got to get violent.

Keep in mind throughout all this, there's so many videos like this. We only pulled like our favorites. But throughout all this, we were being lectured to by this leftist mob that we on the right, the team sanity are the violent ones. That we're the violent ones. They I heard I think it was Thomas Chatterton Williams who has been on this program and he's very much against the ICE officer, but he did this long post about how like people are downplaying or even laughing at violence. There's a lack of humanity. Like, yes, I agree with all of that. And it's leftists doing that. It's do we h have we already memoryhold Charlie Kirk?

Have we totally forgotten what happened in the wake of his assassination? Like the polls showing that some significant portion of leftists applauded it. Luigi Manion. Do we should we talk about that? I mean, it's amazing because a law enforcement officer defended his physical safety and that of his fellow officers in a split-second decision. They're now saying that it's the right wing that's violent. And again, I forgot to finish up this point, but they're also creating these impossible standards for people like this officer so that they can push that narrative because they can't have him be reasonable. They cannot have him be reasonable. That's why they don't like his video camera.

They're wondering why he held that iPhone. That's why they they won't acknowledge Renee Good's role in all of this. And that's why you have these people talking about how well what his tire her tire was pointed to the left at the time it impacted him and he was a little bit more to the right. So clearly she was trying to go a different direction than the officer. He was on the left. He was on her front left headlight. Okay. So like her turning left would have only rammed the remainder of the front grill into him. But whatever. Um and here is that video of the Baltimore. This is a viewer warning because it's disturbing of this Baltimore, Maryland officer who had a face-to-face confrontation with the driver of a car who she was trying to pursue. She pursued him into a culde-sac. He got out of the car. She had her gun drawn. She was trying to make an arrest and she believed he was complying with the commands and a second

later, I mean, it took him a second to get back into that vehicle and ram her. He was no farther away from her than this officer was from Renee Good. That's my armchair assessment of the video. And it took him a second to kill this young female police officer. Watch.

As the jeep continued to advance, Officer Caprio got off one shot. WJZ won't show the rest, but a somber jury saw and heard Amy Caprio dying from massive, crushing injuries. I'm so forgive me. I just want to show it one more time. I'm not trying to be sensationalist for this poor fallen officer, Amy Amy Caprio. God rest her. I just want you to see when we turn it on for the listening audience on the right hand of the screen, you see her cop car with the lights swirling. And then right off to the left, you can kind of barely see his darker car kind of blends in a little, but you can see the grill. And I mean, maybe I'll just count the seconds from like stationary to she's dead. It it happens in an instant. Watch.

As the jeep continued to advance, Officer Caprio got off one shot. WJZ won't show the rest, but a

that's it. So, from the second that car started moving toward her was two seconds and she was dead. These these law enforcement officers don't have the luxury of sitting back in the MS Now studio after they've been primped by hair and makeup. You too, Hillary Clinton. She's piling on this officer. Guarantee you she's at her sprawling estate in Chapaqua, New York, with her maid and her staff and God knows who Bill Clinton's got in the closets. um just passing judgment, just sitting there with her, but she still has protective detail. She doesn't have to worry about her life being on the line. She's good, right? As opposed to this female officer in Baltimore and officers like this ICE agent um who really do have to worry about dying every day on the job. Here's another insane man in s. This one's disturbing.

Dear Ice, here's a message from your friendly neighborhood leftist. Not all of us are going to stop at snowballs in the future. So maybe think twice before you just start randomly shooting into vehicles. And some of us aren't just going to randomly fire into things. Some of us actually know how to aim. So you don't have to take my advice if you don't want to. Um, but I'm pretty sure we're going to hit a tipping point pretty soon. And if you guys don't reconsider your tactics, you're going to start going home in body bags or Ziploc bags. I really don't give a either way.

We need to send the FBI to go speak with this gentleman because you speak like that and you show yourself with I don't know guns, but it looked like an AR at the shooting range shooting targets and with rhetoric like that, you you deserve a visit from the FBI. This is too serious. We're an ICE agent is going to get killed. He or she is going to get killed thanks to the atmosphere. All of these people, Democrat politicians and left-wing loons like that man are creating. They're doing their job. That's all they're doing. They have children. They have wives and husbands.

They have moms and dads. They don't deserve to be threatened to within an inch of their lives just for doing their job. This man did not show up on the job wanting to shoot Renee Good. He wound up that day out on the beat trying to do good. Trying to arrest child molesters and other disgusting violent criminals hurting the children and innocents of Minneapolis. That's what they're trying to do. And now guys like this and women like these loons are trying to endanger them so that their wives will be widows or husbands will be widowers.

It's irresponsible and Tom Hman is 100% right to try to dial it back. He's begging for people to dial back the rhetoric. I'll play you that sound bite and show you some more about what's going on when we come right back. We're not done. If you are looking to make smarter choices for your health this year, consider Riverbend Ranch. Their steaks are not only delicious, but they contain real high quality protein that helps fuel your body. You see the new food pyramid? Meats like steak are at the top now of what you should be consuming.

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I just wanted to show you a little bit more of these leftist loons, like the ones who really made our radar. Here is uh S 23. It's quick, but take a listen. And just so we're clear, if a masked man reaches in my vehicle or stands in front of it to block it, I'm I'm hitting the gas. I'm hitting the gas.

Okay. Want you to see how that's going to work out. It's probably going to work out for you the way it worked out for your friend Renee. And that's not so good. Do you have a family that you like to protect or anyone who cares about you? Unclear, actually. But either way, you probably shouldn't do that. Uh, you're playing with fire, madam. Here's SAT 24. And this is an example. I know. Forgive me for playing this, but if our ICE agents have to deal with it, so must we. Just to understand what it is they're having to put up with. This is happening all over Minneapolis. S 24

and you get and you take down the blacks and you get on video. That's false. Oh,

you don't think so? This is Portland, actually. Okay. Look at me. What? What training have you had regarding mania?

And you're good on your med medication then? Are you are you condescending? Are you talking down to me now?

I'm actually asking really are you on a new medication at all? No. Okay. I'm not.

Okay. Is there anything that's Who are you? Hastings. I'm an officer with Portland police. I'm an ECIT officer.

Oh, really? And you're really um a expert on mental illness, aren't you? Well, I mean, I'm not a psychiatrist or psych. Okay. And I'm the smartest person you have ever met.

So get the down off of my ass. Did you go to college, Hastings? Sure did. You did.

Literally just standing there. Social sciences. Oh, social sciences. Psychology.

Oh, minor. You know, you should know a little bit about it then, right? And Jamie, every time we just try to have a normal conversation with you, it just goes right to insults.

Um, is that against the law? Is it is against the law to insult a man in blue? Do you understand how it's not a normal conversation?

Uh, you guys get called all the time. Why we're concerned and you get and you take down the blacks and you get on video.

That's false. Oh, take down the blacks. Which blacks? Jamie. Jamie, we're leaving.

HAVE A GOOD DAY, JAMIE. We're leaving. I want him arrested for physical assault. You face. Jamie, I'm sure there are plenty of facilities that could help you. Like, look, it could it's probably a 1-800 number. Just get some help. Get the help you so desperately need. The screaming like somebody posted this online and said, "How how does this happen? Like, how do you how do you wind up like this?" And I said, "Bad parenting." Might have been this video, might have been another one, but like yes, right? Like we learn to control our tempers and we learn to be respectful of law enforcement when they're on the job.

She's like, "Are you're up my ass." Literally, the guy is standing there with a leg crossed over the other leg and his thumb hooked on his back pocket. Like, he could not look any more casual. By the way, these are all Portland cops. They They don't bust in the Portland cops just to work uh as a Portland cop uh from, you know, all from Mississippi. The odds are this guy's from Portland, just like the officer involved in the Renee Good case was from Minneapolis. Like, he's probably not actually a far-right guy. He's probably a leftist.

Probably center left, I'm going to guess. And she's treating him like he's Hitler. Um, and here's another one for you. Stop 25. I see a new video come out about um the that lady who got shot by the ICE um officers. Um, and I find it ridiculous that people are defending them, saying that she was crazy for hitting them when they're not even real officers, first of all, and they are a federally uh income. Like, they're they're being paid by the government to go do this. Um, it's terrorism, first of all.

And also, didn't Donald Trump say he was going to deport all the terrorists? Why don't you deport ICE? Like I don't I don't understand justice to that lady because she didn't deserve it. She was, you know, using her rights to drive away,

you know, using her rights, you know, I mean, look, on the bright side, our adversaries are really not the sharpest crew. I mean, this is good. This is actually good news in a way. Like, have you seen anybody who had to run off to their Mensa meeting after they issued their threatening video? I don't think so.

do not think so. I'm feeling good about where we are in the battle of the wits, but it only takes one twit to load a gun and try to do real harm to an officer or someone who supports them. And you know, I showed you the threatening videos before. That's where we're heading. That is why Tom Hman said this to Dr. Phil. I think it was Phil or was this his other interview? We got to stop the hate heretic. Saying this officer is a murderer is is dangerous. It's just ridiculous. It's just going to and it's going to infuriate people more, which means there's going to be more incidents like this because the hate rheetic not only continuing now it's tripled down and doubled down.

I'm I'm asking you to respond to the protesters who say they feel less safe less safe who say they're concerned for their neighbors

because they're looking at media reports and saying ISIS are terrorists or racists. They're they're the Nazis. They're listening to people saying that, you know, using the term disappearing people. It's because of the rhetoric, the hateful rhetoric. So that small population out there that's already half nuts, they hear this ric that ISIS races and and and and the Nazis and they're disappearing people that empowers them to do stupid things.

Right on. And not just that, but talk of civil war. Here's ST 27. It's civil war time. I I hope you guys Democrats need to stand up and start fighting. You better get ready to FIGHT OR YOU'RE ABOUT TO LOSE YOUR COUNTRY. DO YOU GUYS REALIZE THAT? Are you listening to what JD Vance is saying right now? Are you listening? I implore you to go watch the press briefing that JD Vance and KK Caroline are doing right now for the White House. I implore you to GO WATCH THAT AND THEN START DOING SOMETHING. WE are literally about to lose our country.

Do you Do you guys understand this? Do you guys understand this? It is not something for you to just turn a blind eye. This is not a TIME IF YOU WOULD LOOK A little [screaming] nicer. I wouldn't turn MY EYE AWAY.

NOTHING. THERE ARE two scenarios here. Okay, you've got two scenarios. You're either about to lose all your rights. You're going to lose all your rights. This country is about to turn into a dictatorship. And all the women are about to lose all their rights.

I need you to wake the up to that. Every one of them. You don't do anything. YOU DO NOTHING. THAT'S WHAT HAPPENS. IT IS TIME

WITH THE FINGER to fight the index finger. Civil War time. You guys need to wake the up. Stop being little and start fighting the back. It is time to fight.

Maybe it'll help if you yell at us. If Do we Do we feel like that could get it done, sister? I don't know. I'm pretty happy. My life's pretty great. I have a loving family. I have a lovely team I work with every day. I enjoy doing the show and a nice audience. I'm feeling pretty good. Um I don't know. I like I have a lot of working and middle class people in my family. They they would like prices to come down. We we should work on that. I don't think they're not really feeling civil warry. So maybe you gotta up your dasipam.

I think that might be in your future, my friend. Uh there's another one here. 28. Very angry group. And like I'm just curious. Are we great yet? Are we GREAT YET? ARE WE A GREAT COUNTRY? is this one is great.

Yeah, America their ass off 50, 60 hours a week to have nothing to for show to it.

Are we GREAT? IS AMERICA GREAT WHERE ICE AGENTS ARE SHOOTING citizens in the street and the government saying IT'S SELF-DEFENSE? ARE WE GREAT? [screaming] I'm sorry, but these hystericss are amusing. Like these people I have a lot. Okay. Inifat Karen needs to be arrested. Antifa. Antifa Karen. She needs to be arrested. Like she's definitely going to get herself arrested. You don't get arrested for being alone. But if she acts on any of that weird anger toward our ICE officers, yeah, that's what's gonna happen. And now here's this woman.

Okay. Thi here's this woman's wish because all these people think it's MAGA. Okay. So, it's and let's face it, most of MAGA is supportive of this. I am. I don't consider myself MAGA. I think I'm MAGA adjacent. Um, I'm a reporter, you know, I'm a journalist. I have to keep some arms length there. But, um, they're they're blaming MAGA. This is all MAGA's fault. This is all JOE BIDEN'S FAULT. ALL OF IT. THERE'S NOT AN arrest being made that doesn't start with Joe Biden. Tom H. Homeman and Christy Gnome have these guys out there trying to clean up Joe Biden's mess, his 10 to 12 to 20 million illegals he opened the southern border with and let in. And they're raping children. They're raping women.

They're murdering mothers of five. So yeah, they're going to get arrested. And everyone who gets arrested makes us a little greater. Lunatic lady, take a listen to South 30.

Don't ever come at me about forgiving Magga ever again. I will not forgive. Ever.

I don't know if this is a woman or a man. Forget ever. Okay. And your protest votes are just as bad. sounds scary or maybe that'll help. Let's see.

When this is over can be, but that does not mean forgiveness. There is no forgiveness after this. And those of you who are still clinging, I wish ego death upon every one of you.

Ego death? Ego death? What's ego death? I don't I'm not What does that mean? like you you like you you look at this ski mountain and you think I can't do it. What is ego death? I'm not sure what that means, but I think it's already happened to that person. Um here's just an example of who they've arrested in Minnesota ICE. Bill Malujin of Fox News got this and broke it uh in an exclusive. The most egregious criminal aliens that they've arrested during their surge in the sanctuary state of Minnesota. Um, I says all of these criminals were roaming freely in Minnesota prior to arrest and that these are the type of people that politicians and activists are referring to as their neighbors as they attempt to interfere with ICE.

Streidornne Pavan, a Loian illegal alien convicted of strong armed sodomy of a boy and strong armed sodomy of a girl with a deportation order since 2018. Tuvang, a Caitian illegal convicted of sexual assault and sodomy of a girl under age 13 and of pro procuring a child for prostitution. Once again, that is not a thing. A child cannot be a prostitute. That's called rape. Um with a deportation order since 2006. Chong Vu, a Loian illegal. They're big on the Loations in Minneapolis. convicted of the strong armed rape of a 12 12-year-old girl and kidnapping a child with intent to sexually assault her with a deportation order since 2004.

Gi Yang Loian, what's going on with the Loians? Uh, convicted of strong armed rape, aggravated assault with a weapon and strangulation with a deportation order since 2012. Pao Chowo Xang, a loian illegal, convicted of rape and child fondling with a deport. I mean, I'm sorry, but next time I see a loian, I'm running. I'm like, if I'm in Minneapolis, I'm out of there. small chat at like the kiosk and where are you from? Loia. Bye. Just kidding. I'm sure there's a lot of lovely people. Um, so that's who they're trying to clean the city of as they get called Nazis, fascists, and have death threats put on them every day. It's also gotten violent.

There's an independent journalist named Nick Sorder. Some of his his reporting we've brought to you on the Megan Kelly show. And God bless this guy. Can I tell you he's out there every night trying to document this stuff? He reminds me of Andy No, who put himself in the most violent, dangerous Antifa clashes without a care for his own safety and was brutally attacked and now it's happening to Nick Sorder who was there with another independent journalist Cam Higgby trying to cover this. And just just a thought, okay, when CBS relaunched its evening news with the with Topra Topra Doapool, I call him because he's always crying and trying to get all super soft and emotional. Um, I sent out a tweet saying, "Evening News is dead. Like mainstream media is dead. Like this is not going to succeed." And there was a report, a reporter who used to work for the Washington Post. He might still, I don't remember, uh, who tweeted

something to the effect of, "Now look, you know, she and all these other independent journalists will rely on the so-called dead mainstream media for for a week in this Minnesota story." That's actually not right. The only thing that people in the independent lane have been relying on the mainstream media for this week has been laughs and to mock you for your incredibly biased coverage. That I mean, you're right. I'd be sad if it went away because I I would miss doing that. But I don't need you. No one in the independent need lane needs you. We do need the Nick Shirley's of the world.

We do need the Walter Karns, guys like that, Chris Rufo and the Manhattan Institute, City Journal. Those are three that come to mind. Three or four who went out there and actually broke the man Minnesota fraud scandal that that we need that none of those is mainstream. Um and we need the Nick Sorders of the world who will go and report on the violence of this group in a way the Minneapolis Star Tribune never will. This was just posted um today. Hold on. You know, you take a screen I take screen grabs of this stuff for you guys on my phone and then I try to remember to bring it to you. Alpha News uh posted this. Liz Colin, who's great. She's the one who did that documentary on George Floyd or Derek Schovin that we brought to you, pointing out the Star Tribune today. This is what they're on. A mobile electronic billboard calling for the arrest of ICE agent and they say his name was parked Sunday evening across

the street from where Ross killed Renee Good on Portland Avenue in Minneapolis. and they show the billboard calling for him to be arrested and charged next to the other side of the billboard that reads RIP Renee murdered by ICE. This is what they consider responsible journalism. I'm sorry, you're wrong. We do not need the mainstream media for this crap, but we do need Nick Sorder and Nick Shirley and others like them. So Nick and along with Cam Higgby are in the heart of these protests last night where the cops are getting antagonized and in some instances actually attacked.

And that is what happened to Nick. They ran into another guy, a shitsterer who goes by Andrew Marcato who threatened violence against the two of them after stalking them in the town. Here's a bit of it in SAT 10. woman again. I am not Yeah,

hit a woman approaching his veg. I don't know what I'll get the whole steak on here.

I swear to God I will. You too. Shut up, Cam. You You can come out and get some, too, Cam.

Oh god. Get the out here. YOU CAN COME GET SOME TOO. TOUCH. SEE WHAT HAPPENS. SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

See what the happens. You two should just get the out of here. That's what you need to do.

Get the out of here. Your inside of the car. Look at you. You're a Yeah. That's what they do, bro. They hit women bro.

All right. Okay. So, they're demanding he get out of his car so they can hurt him. Nick Sorder wisely declines that uh invitation. And then the riers surround his vehicle. They get more and more antagonistic. They actually start hanging on the front of his car, on the hood, and on the grill and the front bumper. Here's a bit of it in SAT 11.

They're trapped inside. They're wearing riot gear. Nick and Nick Nick is at least, I think.

And all the guys outside are like a like a mob of animals. Cute. Get out of the way. Get out of the way.

They're jumping on his hood. Finally, he guns it and he gets blocked by another protester's car. He has to veer off the side. He's off-roading it in order to get away. He posted a follow-up video. Nick's order did of the aftermath. Listen to this 12.

So just so everybody knows here. So you have these frozen water bottles. These are the two that you saw. They they threw through

right there. There were headrests in the way. If these things spray paint, too.

Oh yeah, use right here. Actually, there might be fingerprints on that one. Yeah, leave that one. Actually, we need to bag that one out.

Spray painted. Uh but anyway, yeah. So these are frozen solid. still hours later and uh if they were to have gone through if they would have if I would not have driven away they would have thrown them through and they would have hit us straight in the head

and we both may not be here to but we found these in the in the in the truck later after we we drove away we ran to the Egon police station.

Unbelievable. I mean no one can help them because it's so chaotic. So, they really are risking their lives to go into the middle of this crowd. They're they're doing I'm sure, yes, of course, he's an independent journalist, so clicks are good. But he's doing it for us. He's doing it because he knows the Minneapolis Star Tribune will not do it. Now, here's Is this Andrew Marcato himself, Deb, or is is he is he talking in this? I'm not sure what what's 12b. We're gonna actually learn it. Okay. Okay. Here's Andrew's defense. He claims that Nick Sorder quote hit a woman. Let's watch 12B.

This is your final word. Final warning. You only talk to women. I'll explain it in a second.

Hey, they love hitting women. They love hitting women. Look at that. Oh, there he hits her again. You just hit her again, brother. Now she hit him and then he smacked her arm away.

Okay. So, see, that's the rule for these leftists is that a woman can go over to a man who's not hurting anybody who's just videotaping and she can hit him. She can slap him. She can punch him in the belly. She can slap him in the face. And the man is He didn't punch her. He makes it sound like he punched her in the stomach. That That would be bad. He's hitting her arms away. She's hitting him and he's hitting her arm out of his face. Um, okay. But you're not allowed to do that in Andrew Mardo's world. In Andrew Mcato's world, what needs to happen is only Andrew can hurt you. Um, well, now he realizes he's likely to be arrested for what he did to Nick's order. He really should be arrested. I genuinely hope he gets arrested. It's not too late. The whole thing is on camera. And here he is trying to save his ass in S 13. Well,

is that it? Is this his apology? No. Sorry. His apology was written here. I'll read it to you. Now he's scared. Now big tough Andrew is scared. He uh Okay. Writes the following. I should not have lost my cool tonight, no matter how tough it gets. I'm sleepdeprived, managing PTSD. Okay. Very little food and water. That's because you froze it all from the look of it to hurt people. Uh because federal agents murdered one of my fellow motans. That's false. MAGA agitators are best dealt with by ignoring them. Well, that's true. You should have ignored Nick Sord.

You would have been better off. It's difficult for me as a man to watch the same few agitators go from city to city, hitting women and instigating fights. Oh, he was the instigator. His mere presence, I would submit to the audience, was the instigation that Andrew was responding to. I apologize for losing my cool tonight and coming across as a different person. Tell it to the cops when they show up at your door, Andrew. I believe um you could soon be in custody and facing some serious problems with the criminal and at least civil law for all of that. All right, one more thing before we get to our legal panel and what happened with Timothy Busfield. Last night was the Golden Globes and it was so much nonsense. Actors like Mark Ruffalo showed up wearing a be good pin. That's an homage to Renee Good. Here's 14.

This is for her. This is for the people in the United States who are terrorized and scared today. I know I'm one of them. I love this country. And what I'm seeing here happening is not America.

God, he's the worst. He's just so bad. Then there's Wanda Sykes, um, female black comedian who got up there to present an award and made it all about herself. Listen here, South 15. Shout out to the Golden Globes for having me because uh, you know, there's some people pissed off that a queer black woman is up here doing the job of two mediocre white guys. It's so racist. It's so racist. Right. Like you've got to Okay, so if they were white and they were guys, you got to dismiss them as mediocre. Everybody sucks. But I am the oppressed queer black woman doing it all. Shout out from me. Like begging them to applaud for her. You're pathetic, Wanda Sykes. Do better. If you actually had maybe you had ego death, because if you had ego life, you would know you shouldn't. You don't need to do that in order to make yourself feel good about yourself. You just live your beautiful life. You'll attract positive energy. Negative will

come too because there's a lot of envy in this world. Um, but you handle it like a pro, like a classy lady, not somebody who's constantly mentioning essentially the fact that she has darker melanin and a vag. Um, she also hit Ricky Jerves, who is the greatest to ever host the Globes because he's been standing up for women's rights. And here's what she said about him. STOP 15 B.

RICKY JASE CUZ HE WOULD LIKE TO THANK GOD and his trans community. Ricky J could not be here, but we'll accept this on his behalf.

She's got to mention the trans. She He dedicates his win to the trans community. He doesn't. So disrespectful. How dare you? How dare you? Remember when they were just funny? Why does anybody watch this We don't. I mean, we have a team that watches it so that you don't have to, but like how pathetic, right? Like, okay, you're a tough girl. You stood up for the trans community and you ripped Ricky and diminished disparaged his win by mocking him. So, Golden Globes, she should never be allowed to present again. And then we got to the brand new category of best podcast which they just added because they want to be more relevant and you guys have heard this story. I among other podcasts were nominated our show. We pulled our name from consideration. They wanted us to you had to like fill out all these forms and actually pay a fee. And I said no, we're not doing that. They also wanted me to go to Hollywood and do interviews

with Golden Globes members, like behind the scenes in order to woo them into voting for me, which I said at the time, I'd rather put a bullet in my brain. no. Um, there's zero chance I was doing any of that. So, we pulled our show from consideration. Then, Variety, in writing up the story today, claimed we were snubbed. Variety, we were not snubbed. We pulled our names from consideration. And that's just the way some of us roll. Others buy huge billboards in Times Square to try to persuade Hollywood people to like them.

That didn't work out for our friend Ben very well, now did it? Um Amy Polar won. That's no shock, right? They gave it to one of their own Yeah. tracks. And it's because she really has a great a really really insightful podcast which you really feel enriched after watching. I mean, I've never watched it, but this is what I hear. And when I watched the clips, I thought, my god, what am I missing? And I'll just give you a sample of what you could be listening to every day. It's sought 17.

What time do you like to eat dinner? I like it at 6. Okay. Me, too. I make my reservations at 6:00 p.m.

So do I. I love it so much. So great. And I honestly sometimes I like to be the first person in the restaurant.

I I was last night. I did 5:45 last night. Incredible. Oh, they're so relatable. They have busy lives. They get tired early. Just like you. Stars like Wneith Paltro. Just like you. Riveting, right? Well, maybe she won because of her insightful interviews. No, wait, that wasn't it. The the preparation she does perhaps, you know, for this show. Trust me, it takes a lot of prep to find all those sound bites, to get a feel for the narrative, to present in a way in a way that tells a story and makes it easy and yet enjoyable for you to consume. The whole team puts a lot of hours into that kind of thing. And I think you know that.

Um, if somebody comes on, they have a book, we read the book. Um, we show them the respect of understanding what it is they're trying to say and giving them the time to do it and make sure that we know who they are and what they're there for. Um, Amy Polar thought Gwennneth Paltra was in Cold Mountain, which she wasn't. Sought 16.

Cold Mountain. How cold was the mountain? I wasn't in Cold Mountain. Oh, forget it then.

But thanks for thinking I'm Nicole Kidman. Bonus. I mean, I'm sorry. Like, they played it off like it was hilarious, but the truth is she didn't show Gwenneith Paltro the respect of actually understanding what her body of work is, recent body of work for them to discuss. Uh, so that's embarrassing and disrespectful and that's what wins you, yay, the award for best podcast. Also, in the final running, as I mentioned, was NPR's Up First. And here's the little Leila Fen talking about it this morning.

We were the one news podcast that informs the public often under intense pressure. Our journalists are around the world. Today we're going to be talking about

Iran and the Fed and all of these things. And I was just thinking about that when we were in this glamorous room that we were representing the difficult work of our journalists around the world. So self arandizing. Oh my god. Intense pressure. Wow. I don't know how we deal with it here at the MK show. Steve, Debbie, we got to give everybody raises. The intense pressure of having to report on Iran in the Minneapolis, the Fed. [screaming] How will we ever handle it? Literally, she makes it sound like she's a Navy Seal.

Oh my gosh. Speaking of our military, Dakota Meyer goes back into the Marines this week. He starts, I think, today back as a Marine Medal of Honor recipient and one of the greatest guys we've ever had on the program. And I'm proud to call him a friend back in the Marines. I mean, that's a true beloved, respectable American for you. The guy's already accomplished it all. He saved the lives of three dozen men and retrieved the bodies of the fallen. He had such a tough time when he returned home from service, almost taking his own life at one point. So depressed and upset was he and just trying to get through that postcombat period for a true warrior, which is a real thing. And he showed courage there too in talking about it. And he did he did that on this show in one of my favorite interviews.

And today he's not even 40. What does he decide to do? I mean, he could just be writing books. He could be on a self-help, you know, speaking tour. He decides to rejoin, to reinlist. And I think he's got to go through basic training again, which will be amazing for the fellow wouldbe Marines around him. They're going to be like, "Holy Dakota Meyer, tell us everything." And that's the right attitude. Watch. Watch and learn. Uh, men and women. We're gonna need you to be just as courageous as he is. All right, that's enough for the Golden Globes and that nonsense. Um, congratulations to no one because they're all bought and paid for.

That's what we learned in this process. Not a person got up there who didn't do the lobbying behind the scenes, who didn't buy and pay for their award, paying the thousands of dollars they require for you to even be considered. So, you remember that when you watch this. I think you probably already knew, but boy, we didn't know it quite the way we know it now. And, uh, move on. Okay, coming up, Gyraos Murphy on the Hollywood star director who is now reportedly on the Lamb as there's a warrant out for his arrest for allegedly molesting two 7-year-old boys.

He's married to Melissa Gilbert and we'll have thoughts on her, too. Let's talk about All Family Pharmacy. They do what pharmacies are supposed to do, just better. They get people the medications they need fast and at a fair price. When you don't want to wait in line or deal with insurance headaches and you want your medications delivered straight to your home, All Family Pharmacy makes it simple. When everyone around you is getting sick and you want to be prepared instead of reactive, consider All Family Pharmacy. And when your doctor refuses to prescribe medications like Ivormectin, even after you've done your research, All Family Pharmacy gives you another option. They've got antibiotics, antivirals tamlu ivormectin blood pressure medications, and a lot more.

You order online. A licensed doctor reviews your request and your medications ship straight to your door. It's that simple. Be prepared for the year ahead. Visit allfamilyfar pharmacy.com/megan and use the code Megan 10 to save 10% on your next order. That's allfamilyfarm pharmacy.com/megan. Code Megan 10 to save 10%. As we told you at the top of the hour, well, top of the show, a warrant in New Mexico has been issued for the arrest of actor and director Timothy Busfield on two counts of criminal sexual contact of a minor and one count of child abuse. As of this moment, he has yet to turn himself in. The warrant was issued Friday night. So now we are on day Well, if you conclude Friday, this is day four. 1 2 3 4 Three or four days where the man is at large. Where is he? According to a police affidavit filed in support of the arrest, two 11year-old boys, there are 11 now, who are related, alleged that Busfield

inappropriately touched them during the filming of the Fox crime drama. It's a crime drama. I'm just now learning that. Called the cleaning lady. Crime drama, Deb, I've got issues. I Okay, I got issues. I have Why would you call a crime drama The Cleaning Lady? Okay, I digress.

I guess she cleans up the crime scenes. Okay. Anyway, um this is a show for which Timothy Busfield was an actor and the executive producer and I and the director, I believe. And one of the boys says that Busfield, forgive me, touched his genitals starting back when he was seven. Uh and that it happened right on set. Now, Busfield hasn't spoken to this yet, but we know from the police affidavit that Busfield denied it and that his defense, we believe, if he ever shows up to make one, is going to be that the mother of both of these boys, their brothers, is disgruntled because the boys got terminated at the end of, I think, season two and plotted revenge and may have even told an actress, the lead actress on the show, that she wanted revenge against Timothy Busfield, though the lead actress is not cooperating. operating and would not tell police that statement. She appears to have told it to a Warner Brothers

investigator. So, that's where this case stands now, but there's a lot more. And the boy's testimonial to the police and to the authorities was clearly what resulted in the in the charges, which we'll get into. MK True Crime hosts Mark Garagos and Matt Murphy are here with me. Go and subscribe to see all of the MK True True Crime content on YouTube and all podcast platforms. Just go to mktrime.com mktrime.com or just go to the podcast app and type in mktrime and the podcast will come up if that's how you like to get your news. Uh and MK True Crime as I mentioned the other day is crushing it. So join the fun. Mark Matt, great to see you guys. This whole thing is so disturbing. So Matt Murphy, I mean you're a career prosecutor and um you know spent your life. Every time I turn on Deline, it's another case out of Orange County, California that Matt Murphy prosecuted. It's amazing. I'm like, I know him. Anyway,

you tell me what why you think they indicted or issued an arrest warrant for Timothy Busfield here.

Well, I think one of the reasons they did this, Megan, is he this isn't his first brush with accusations like this. um he's been accused twice before, I think, by actresses or or female actors that um accuse him of impropriy, but when you get into the details of those um I think the defense, if it was even admissible, could characterize it as uh basically awkward passes, you know what I mean? Like it wasn't wasn't particularly violent. He wasn't using weapons or anything like that. It was more like he was drunk and gropey. Um the uh the interesting thing and I think Mark will find this interesting. I actually did research on this which is always a little scary. In California, Megan, we have uh evidence code section known as um 11 1108 which stands for the idea that propensity evidence or other sex crimes are generally admissible and it's there's almost a presumption that it comes in. New Mexico does not have

that. In fact, New Mexico rejected that. So, um, this is this is actually a tough one. Um, based on what we've seen, he he said some things in his interview that were kind of weird. Like, um, like maybe I maybe I I tickled him, but I, you know, he's very sort of circumspect on that.

I was very playful with these young boys. He said, "I was very play admits to being playful with them on the set." Yeah. And he and he also says, Matt, this is Well, here's Let me tell you what I read. Like, what jumped out at me was he said he could not remember. He He said, "I I don't He He He denies, I think, the sexual assault, but he says he can't remember." And yet, you've got these young boys saying, "I remember. I remember the the boys, they were seven at the time, they're 11 now, are saying, "Forgive members of the audience, but that'll be explicit because this is sex crime. He touched my penis and my my rear end, my butt, over clothing on the set right after scenes were done when nobody was there. like the set would clear off and he'd go in there and I guess there was at least a couple of times where the the main boy it appears they're twin brothers um would still be in the bed and he'd come over and start

tickling him and then it would progress to you know abuse to feeling this boy and there's a whole allegation about the fact that they're supposed to have people watching the boys all the time on the set and that this woman was not there and that the police were able to verify that she was not there a lot but I mean if I came to you and said, "Have you ever fondled a a boy?" uh, you know, in any capacity, you certainly wouldn't say, "I don't remember." It would be a hard absolutely not. And so, that to me sounded like the most damning exchange in here. I'll I'll find the exact one and tell you what it is.

Keep going. No, I think you're right. That's the That's the tough part. So, when I my first day in sexual assault, I did four years in sex before I went to homicide. And my boss, uh, Chuck Middleton called me in and he said, "We don't file one-on- ones." So, in other words, every sex case you have to have some sort of corroboration. And it's almost formulaic, and Mark has has dealt with a million of these, too. It's you do covert calls where the victim calls the uh the the offender. Um, you get something good in an interview or you have some other form of corroboration.

Sometimes it's I mean, this is again graphic. Sometimes it's an STD that the poor little kid gets. Sometimes it is um it's in the form of other victims. California has significantly easier evidence laws for prosecutors than I think New Mexico does. Um so this is this is going to be interesting to see how it plays out. I don't know what's up with him kind of being in the wind right now. Uh because I think this based on what I've read, this is a this is a and I think Mark will agree this sounds like a a defensible case. And one of the things you encounter all the time, Megan, when you actually work these is you get, first of all, any sex unit, it's 90% sexual abuse of children. And you get case after case where you believe the kid. You you're certain that the kids are telling the truth, but you just don't have that um that corroboration to go after them. So um these are these are tough. It t it

psychologically takes a toll on on prosecutors. There here's the excerpt. So Warner Brothers had an outside investigator come in through another law firm and do an investigation. By the way, Warner Brothers does not look good in this whole thing at all. The police officer alleges that they delayed for months um giving him information and giving him access to witnesses all while there were still children on the Warner Brothers sets. And there was a real question about whether they were adequately protecting them. It's disturbing. Warner Brothers denies that and says that they protect all children. But um this is what the cop alleges um that Timothy and he had a conversation and he said, "I did ask Timothy if he ever had any physical contact with these boys and if he ever picked them up and tickled them." Timothy said it was highly likely that he would have. Timothy said it was a playful environment like he wanted.

However, Timothy said the dad would make these boys hug him and he didn't really want them to. Timothy then stated, quote, "I don't remember those boys." No, I don't. I don't actually. I don't remember if it happened. I don't remember overtly tickling the boys ever, but it wouldn't be uncommon for me. Now, maybe he's saying, "I don't remember if I ever tickled them." And maybe there was an explicit denial. Um, saying, "But I never molested them." One can assume he denied that. Um, but then he says, "Mark, I don't remember the boys at all.

I don't remember the boys." No, I don't. I don't actually. How does he not remember the boys who starred in this show from at least age seven to I think two years later? Two I think two years they start in this this show and they said this alleged abuse happened over the course of of possibly five to six times. As Matt will tell you, nothing makes a prosecutor happier than a uh accused deciding he's going to engage with an investigator and start talking. I this is uh this is just prime example exhibit ABC as to why you should never engage uh with this with an investigator because first of all you think you're going to talk your way out of it and you're reading from the uh report and I'm sure that's probably somewhat accurate as to what he said and it's susceptible to many interpretations and if an investigator's got uh uh his kind of agenda he's going to interpret it in a way that's uh most uh kind of

incriminatory. I will tell you the two things that bother me about this case, if true, and I don't know cuz I'm not involved, but I've read that at least the first person they went to or that the mother or their guardian went to was a lawyer and that it was lawyer referred. Uh I'm sitting here in the civil courthouse. I'll tell you one of the first questions that anybody gets asked in front of a jury is who referred you to your medical provider and if you say my lawyer did you should see the juror's curtain come down in terms of the credibility. That's number one.

Number two, I found it interesting about the way that you said Warner Brothers comes off on this because they did hire an outside investigator. My experience with these outside investigations is they almost always find culpability. They they especially on the individual and they go to the extent of exonerating the corporation. So I'm I'm fascinated by the fact that the outside investigation exonerated him. And if it's true

it did not he was not exonerated. Yeah. And if it that's too strong a word. Well, they they obviously didn't take action against him that I'm aware of and they and they did not I don't know and it would be interesting to know if they found something and it was inconclusive. Did they refer it to the authorities? Did they think that they had an obligation?

Doesn't sound like they did. Yeah, it doesn't sound like it sounds like what happened was the boys, the one boy who allegedly was like the main target came out and told his therapist that it had graduated beyond the point that he was willing to admit earlier. Now he's 11 and he, you know, came clean with it and that's when the police got involved more seriously the Warner Brothers. Um,

yeah, that's interesting that it was that it's a therapist who was who presumably is a mandatory reporter. If the therapist was consulted for some other reason, that tends to be consistent with a uh whether it's a fresh complaint, however you want to characterize it or um analyze it. But if it turns out that the lawyer referred to the therapist who promptly um then reported it, that becomes problematic.

The therapist what the way I read the complaint is that they they consulted a law firm when they got wind of these alleged misbehaviors and then the law firm uh referred the kid to a therapist kids and they they admitted that he'd been tickling them on their legs and their stomachs. That's what the boys said first. At least the one boy, but I think both. And then the cops said, "Well, we can't really do anything with that." I mean, all of us sitting here know how creepy and disgusting that is. No man would tickle another man's little boy on the legs and the stomach playfully. That is not a thing unless you're a groomer. but okay, let's just give him the benefit of the doubt because he's being accused of child molestation, so we don't want to get over our skis. So then the kids, at least the one main boy, continued seeing the therapist um from age eight, I think was when they first came forward to now

11. So for two or three years, and finally told the therapist that he actually had been touched on his private parts by this guy, Busfield. That was his allegation. And that's when they called the police again and said, "You have to do something about this." And it was the police. They did call the police to say, "This is wrong." Um, I did pull up the part about Warner Brothers. Here's what the police affidavit says. Warner Brothers made it very difficult to obtain information for this case and waited almost 3 months to comply with a court order to produce the independent investigation. Now, that is just wrong.

I mean, I'm sorry, but like Hollywood is already under suspicion for running effectively a pedophile ring given the number of issues we've seen coming out of there. And you can go back to Roman Palansky. You can certainly go to what's happened at Nickelodeon. Um Corey Feldman, child actors been jumping up and and down about this. And now you have Warner Brothers that gets a an accusation and they have a court order saying fork it over. Fork over the independent investigation. They wait 3 months to to comply. I mean like there are children on their sets right now.

That's why the police are upset. Warner Brothers used attorney Richard Wesling to advise me that I would need to go through his law firm to talk with any employees of Warner Brothers when I was trying to ensure the safety of additional child actors. When talking with employees of Warner Brothers, they were very afraid of retaliation from Warner Brothers if they talked to me. And again, Warner Brothers responds by saying, "The health health and safety of our cast and crew is always our top priority, especially minors. We take all allegations of misconduct very seriously and has systems in place to promptly investigate. Um, that's terrible. Warner Brothers, you need to do better. But there's more about on the allegations against Busfield and I'm going to get into it with Matt and Mark right after this break. Don't go away. I have a serious question for you. What's the smart way to protect your home and

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This month only, take 50% off any new system. This is one of the best prices you will ever see for Simplysafe. That's simplysafe.com/megan. Again, that's simil.com/megan and lock in your discount. There's no safe like Simplysafe. All right, let me just lay out some of what's in the affidavit because I don't want to leave this unclear. Um, here's how it began. On November 1st, 2024, and this is all via the police affidavit. That's my source for all this. So last November 2024, uh the the officer was dispatched to the hospital, the New Mex New Mexico New Mexico hospital after a doctor called in a sexual sexual abuse allegation.

Um the officer spoke with the boy's parents. The uh officer was told by the father that there had been multiple rumors that Timothy Busfield had been handsy with women. Uh the the dad informed the officer, sorry, the mother informed the officer that she had asked their children, who were 11 at the time, if anyone had ever touched them in a manner that made them uncomfortable. The children responded by asking, "You mean like Uncle Tim?" Then the dad went to a law firm that recommended that the two children that the two take the children to the hospital to be examined, which they did. It was reported that while at the hospital, the staff there advised that it appeared the children had been groomed. Um, Officer Osborne spoke with both children who did not disclose any sexual content contact at the time.

However, both boys advised that Timothy Busfield, whom they referred to as Uncle Tim, would tickle them on the stomachs and legs. Neither boy cared for the tickling. The officer contacted a detective with the crimes against children unit and they determined that the case did not meet their acceptance criteria at the time. That's where we left off, Matt, because presumably, you know, the tickling of the legs in the stomach is not going to be enough to make a busy sex crime prosecutor go after Timothy Busfield and can be explained though it's obviously inappropriate. It's not necessarily criminal or so so believed this sex crime investigator. He either believed that or he believed just not doesn't rise to the level to pull me away from my like really disturbing awful cases on not to diminish what happened to those boys. Allegedly on 103 2025. So now we're 11 months later. The parents called Child Protective Services and

they told Child Protective Services that her children both disclosed that there was sexual abuse by Timothy Busfield from November 2022 to spring 2024. She said her children were groomed and sexually abused by him. She advised that in September, the one son, SL or his initials, this is the main target allegedly, reported to his therapist that Timothy Busfield had touched his penis and his bottom. Then by October 17th, the cop called uh the parents and the mother told the cop that SL had disclosed to his therapist who's named uh that Timothy had touched these areas on him.

and she also advised that in September SL had disclosed the same to his pediatrician. Uh both both of those areas had been touched. Then the cop reviewed the therapist records and he found out that this therapist diagnosed SL, who was 10 years old at the time, with post-traumatic stress disorder. He viewed an incident report submitted in September, a month earlier, by the therapist that documented SL disclosing that a director of the series in which SL was an actor had engaged in inappropriate touching. Notes that previous disclosures were of being touched on the arm, chest, and back. SL disclosed that the director had also touched his penis, and buttocks. On 99205, this therapist documented SL disclosing having nightmares about the director touching him and waking up scared. SL also disclosed that the director had touched and rubbed him in his private areas three or four times and appeared

to be ashamed. On Halloween of 2025, both SL andVL, his brother, were taken to an advocacy center for children called a safe house interview. Cop says, "I watched both interviews recorded and conducted by a forensic child interviewer." SL told the interviewer the first time Tim touched him was when he was seven. He described it as his parents no longer having an iPad to watch the set. And when the director Tim said cut, Tim would come into the bedroom on the movie set and touch SL's private areas. SL provided a drawing to the interviewer, showing him how he was alone with Tim. SL said Tim would grab his waist with both hands while SL was lying on his back in the bed on the movie set. Tim would then touch all over SL's body, including his private areas, where SL described his private area as where he poops and pees.

SL said Tim touched those two areas over the clothing five to six times between sets. This is during one incident uh that he's describing. After the set was over or sets were over, SL said he was scared and he speedwalked to his father and hid behind his dad. Then there was another time he was touched when he was 8 years old. And SL describes the movie set same as the first said this time it happened three to four times, same two areas, and said he was very afraid of Tim and relieved when he was offset. Then you've got the interview by the Safe House interviewer of VL, the brother. VL explained that Mr. Tim started touching them for the first two years and he did not want to say anything because he did not want to be mean to Tim. VL said Mr. Tim would start touching him with his hands about his body while they were filming in the house. VL advised that it was about his body but did not disclose that he was

touched on his buttocks or penis area. Now, I mean, I think that just lends credibility to the family because if I were a mother looking to get a big payday from Timothy Busfield or Warner Brothers, I would do my level best to have both of the boys have a consistent story and double my money with both kids telling that they had been abused in exactly the same way to show a pattern, to show it was the most egregious stuff, to get criminal charges. I think it actually helps the family that the VL child did not make that allegation, but SL did. And Matt, the other thing we see from the police affidavit is witness after witness who worked on that set verifying that their the woman who's supposed to be watching them was not there, was frequently not watching them.

And also verifying that SL started his stint on this show as a bubbly, sweet, happy boy and progressively went downhill. seemed unhappy, depressed, more introverted, sullen, and clearly was not enjoying being on this set within the two years by the end of the two years on which he was in the show. Uh that he started acting differently. And on top of all that, there was an anonymous complaint about Timothy Busfield that um was was made to through SAG after the the union about an incident that happened on the set of the cleaning lady who claimed to have witnessed an incident in the hair and makeup trailer where Tim Busfield entered and kissed a minor male on the face as the minor was getting a haircut.

The anonymous complainant further alleged that there are pictures of Mr. Busfield tickling and caressing the head and body of minor boys. Um that we don't know for sure who that was, but there was a hair and makeup person who spoke with police and said she witnessed Timothy come into the trailer where she was working and kissed the two children actors, child actors on their foreheads, but noted their parents were present at the time. Um and this makeup artist said everyone knew to avoid Timothy because he was creepy. On the other side of the ledger, we have the fact that the boys didn't initially say that they were touched in the most violative of ways.

And we have the lead actress telling the Warner Brothers investigator, though not the police, that the mother was quote that she did not like her son's being terminated, she did not like what it brought out in her and that she would get her revenge against Timothy Busfield. Okay. So, what all that Matt says to you that this is not provable or that he didn't do it?

No, that it's it's a tough one. Um, and and first of all, look, I don't have any kids. I can't imagine anything less I'd ever want to do than spend time tickling somebody else's kid. So, but you still have to prove sexual intent for any contact. Okay? So, it's tough because often times the guy's 68 years old. A lot of times you'll get some corroborating evidence either kitty porn on a computer. You and I have talked about that a lot in in other cases. You

Well, I wonder if they're looking at that right now. Oh, I'm sure they are. And they're looking at cell phones and everything else. But at 68, if none of that has come forward, he's got they're going to argue that it's money grab. We saw a lot of that in Diddy. Um but this is that is your classic um affidavit, you know, that you see working these in law enforcement. Mark has Mark has read a million of them, too. It's like this is straight up the middle. The affidavit, the way the officer wrote that was was also spot on that these guys will often ingratiate themselves with families to get access to the kids. And I I think one of the one of the reasons why I think you're a lot of people in your audience are disturbed right now, Megan, is these cases are ubiquitous. You know, serial killers are relatively rare in in society. There there's a lot of them, but statistically they're rare. Sex offenders like this are not. In fact, we

have three different names, right? This is what would be known as pedophilia. And of course, this man is presumed innocent, but pedophilia is prepubescent kids. Hemophilia is kids that are going through puberty and aphibophilia are kids that are postpubescent like our friend Jeffrey Epstein. Friaking dirt bag right?

Just so just just to be clear for the record, Matt. So what you're saying is if you're a molester who's interested in the very young children, you're called a pedophile. But if you're into the more young teenage type, you're called an herbopile under the law.

It's in a feeophile. If it's postpubescent, and they're all monsters. They all they all run different risks. They're all all I mean, collectively, we can call them all perverts, right? It's any any child under the age of 18. And arguably some of the older ones are are even worse because they can impregnate their victims and you see a million of those.

But if I can make a quick connection here, if you don't mind as we sit in the in the green room ready to come on. Mark Mark's doing fancy things in court today. But um

but listening to some of the other speakers concerning Minneapolis, you know sex.

Wait, wait, we'll get to that. But Mark's got to leave in a second. So I do want to get hold your point. I do want to get the busy Garos in on this. The interesting thing that I think Matt was dancing around and I know Matt long enough and well enough to know this is this is a DA reject as we call it. um if this had been presented to Matt and um there's a lot of things there that is

but it's not now well it's not in New Mexico where this is but if this were Matt who is a very experienced probably the number one sex prosecutor in California at least in my experience he would have rejected a case like this and so it's interesting to me that in New Mexico this was filed I think that You know, we we remember not too recently in New Mexico another case that went off the rails with a celebrity and yeah, I I'm just not I'm not convinced right now that this is a this rises to the level based on even everything you've just read in that affidavit, which Matt is right. This is straight up the middle of a lot of most affidavit I see in these kinds of cases.

And a lot of that stuff is never going to see a courtroom. It's great for probable cause.

Okay, but I get it. Where's Timothy Busfield? I've got theories on that, by the way. I mean, if you're the defense lawyer for Timothy Busfield, this is a state court case. You've got the ability to challenge this case if you're not there at the time. He may want to challenge it, whoever his lawyer is. I can see where there is a where there's a some kind of a a negotiation going on for all we know between the prosecutor and his lawyer.

Here's the other possibility. Other boys are coming forward right now. Always the case. Always the case.

When it hits the news, if this has happened to others, guarantee you they're calling somebody and he's probably or a lawyer has been made aware of that, too. I'm not trying to condemn the guy before he has his day in court. I'm actually I'm very disturbed by Warner Brothers and by the fact that it appears this guy, these two kids were not protected, that they were allowed private time on the set with an adult 68-year-old man without anybody watching, which is not okay. And they've set themselves up for this kind of an allegation that the studio and Timothy Busfield. Um I also do find it very disturbing he's saying I don't know them. When the affidavit goes on to allege, Matt, that he and his wife, Melissa Gilbert, had been taking these boys out for dinners, that that he was being called Uncle Tim, that she was buying them gifts, including Christmas gifts, and now it's who are they? That's

So, there's a reason he's lying. Yeah, there's uh these things are always a collage, Megan. It's always a collage. And in the in the mind of the prosecutor, it's it's a it's an accumulation of evidence. It's almost like um you there's no bright line test. It's more of a feeling that you get as a prosecutor.

Sorry to interrupt you again, Matt, but stand by. Garrick has got to run. So Mark, thank you so much for being here and to be continued.

Thank you. I appreciate it. Bye, Matt. Megan. Thank you. Okay. Byebye. Okay. Keep going, Matt.

So it's every case is a little bit different on these, but they are fundamentally they're formulaic. Do you have what corroboration do you have? That's the main question. And then one of the one of the most common cases that you see in sexual assault and this is really a sad reflection of uh kind of the modern world

is you see custody disputes and you see allegations that um essentially are prompted by one parent or the other. You see a ton of those. And I had an old detective in his name was um uh he was out of Huntington Beach. great guy and I'm completely blanking on his name which makes me a bad person but he used to give me little yellow stickies with RNR written on the filing packet which stood for read and reject which meant and and you look and it's like okay custody dispute okay here's an allegation of sexual abuse by one parent or the other and and those are there's a ton of those okay and they're they're and they're sad because they're false accusations and a false accusation can destroy somebody I think this guy's career is probably done whether he did it or not. Um, but there's a lot of smoke here and it's accumulating and Mark was right when he was leaving it.

It it is so common that when the press hits, people will come out of the woodwork. We saw that with Diddy, right? And a lot of those a lot of the people that came out on Diddy, as bad as that guy was, I think I think some of them really were money grabs. They they saw an opportunity to get out some money. This one I I don't know. You almost always at the age of 68, this can't be his first rodeo if he's good for it. So with the media, you would expect to see it. But you know, there's so much emotion in this issue, as there should be. But one of the reasons why there's so much is that abuse of this kind is so common in in our society. One of the questions that the judge always asks when you're picking one of these juries, which is what Mark is doing right now, not on a sex case, but he's doing jury selection today. The one of the questions is, have you or anyone close to you um been a victim of of this or a

similar crime? And Megan, of the 12 jurors on the box, your your 12 potential deliberating jurors with a gallery full of other prospective jurors, I've had cases where every single hand in the box went up. Okay, so this is, as we know, this is everywhere. It is incredibly common. It's everybody. It's one degree of separation. Everybody in America, and I'm a little jaded after having done so many of these cases over the years, but everybody's either been abused themsel or somebody in their immediate circle has been. Okay? And and that is it's an incredibly huge problem, which in my mind, and here I go, should transcend politics, right? This is one area that everybody freaking needs to agree on because sex offenders don't get better. There's no treatment for them.

If if somebody crosses the Rubicon and they decide they're going to take action on their impulse to abuse children, whether that's pre during or postpubescent kids, they're a freaking monster and they're going to keep doing it again. And my my first week in sexual assault, buddy of mine, Ted Bernett, I asked him like, "What makes these guys do it, Ted?" And he's he was a cerebral guy and he said, "Uh, it's green worms in their brain is what he said. Nobody knows how the green worms get in there. Sure as nobody knows how to get the green worms out, but as long as they draw breath, they're going to keep doing it as long as they can. Okay? And and that was my experience. And and your first at the end of your first week in a sexual assault unit, you think you've seen it all by the end. And then after 4 years, I I rotated into homicide and I realized of all the depravity I witnessed in four years in that unit,

I'd only scratched the surface of of people's ability to pray on others, especially children. Okay? And I want to connect it because

what what an affable guy you still are. Like it's I I think if I had gone through that, I would have lost my light inside. But you haven't lost your light. You must have a very thick skin.

Yeah. You're you're assuming I'm sane after that experience. So I appreciate that. Maybe I'm faking it really well. Um but no, let me you do better than I think I would. But wait, I want to ask you a question about this because

we mentioned maybe they are looking on his home computer right now or but is that realistic because

can you get a search warrant? You can. So once you have an arrest warrant, what can what can you get as an investigator to go investigate?

That's exactly right. You can get um it's called a piggyback warrant. I'm sure they call it the same in in New Mexico. But what you get is you get um you'll get access to his computers. You will get access to his cell phone. They're going to get into whatever his porn history is on those computers. And by the way, going to dinner, you know, each case is unique, right? So maybe there's some reason why he's taking those boys to dinner or why he had an affinity. I mean, he's with his wife, but it's it it's certainly on the surface it sounds kind of weird. Again, presumed innocent, all that. But okay, one of the groups that you deal with all the time when you're prosecuting sex cases is you deal with the feds. You deal with federal task forces. They had one um they they do stings. They do internet child pornography stings. And that that's a it's a critical component of law enforcement against sex offenders

is working with the federal government. A lot of times it's with the FBI, but I'm here to tell you, and this is a word we keep hearing lately, a lot of times it involves ICE, right? And I have statistics that I want to share with you. Um, listening to those people in the previous segment as I'm sitting in the green room waiting to come on and the septum rings and all that, the railing against federal law enforcement, these are some of the people that are most dedicated to getting sex offenders arrested, putting them in prison, and then ultimately deporting them if they're not here legally. Right. And in 2023, um, ICE arrested 4,390 sex offenders. it's a part of their job.

That was the last year of Joe Biden and nobody said a friaking word because back then um shockingly we all kind of agreed it's a bit of a bipartisan issue. We're going to protect kids who aren't political at all. Children deserve the protection of all adults regardless of what side of the political aisle they're on. Right? So in 2024, last year, first year of President Trump, ICE arrested 16,552 sex offenders. And that is their priority. They they had a special operation in the state of Florida called Operation Dirt Bag. And that's the the federal law enforcement officials, the women and men that do that are critical to protecting our kids. And these people that that think it's a good idea to block their cars. They have no idea who they're going after. They prioritize sex offenders and violent felons and gang members. But particularly given how many there are, these federal agents in ICE

and other federal agencies prioritize sex offenders and there should be there should be no rational debate about that. So somebody that goes and drives

I wonder Matt if they said like I wonder if Tom Hommaning came out and Christine Gnome and said we're making an announcement we are now for the next six months only targeting child sex offenders only child sex sex molestator or molesters what would they do I mean it would be a very interesting experiment to see whether the same you know Karen Antifas would stay out there

you know what I I think they probably would because they're So these people are so crazy. I don't know if it's the septum rings that's making them mad cuz every time you look on it's like they got a ring hanging out of their nose.

It is related to being extremely homely. It is. Maybe. Maybe. So I don't know. But it's but as a look as a prosecutor, it is maddening to me because I know the work that ICE agents are doing as a sexual assault prosecutor. And same thing with the FBI. They devote a tremendous amount of resource to that. And the idea that somebody is blocking them again. like they think they're doing good. I think their motivations I want to believe that they're that they think they're doing the right thing, but they're so freaking stupid because they don't understand what ICE is actually attempting to accomplish. And at the end, the people who benefit are their own children. It's it is maddening to me.

Yes, exactly. I don't understand how a mother could get out there and try to stop these arrests of these molesters. All right, I want to keep going because I don't have that much time. I've got to ask you about Renee Good's wife. We played the video earlier of her antagonizing that cop. And now we know from his own camera on his iPhone that she was the one who said, "Drive, baby. Drive." She told the wife to do it. And we also know that the two of them had been working together to train to antagonize ICE. She was part of the perpendicular parking that the that Renee Good did earlier, we believe. So, could there be charges against Renee Good's wife?

Yes, there could be charges against her wife. Um, and and not even for for the aiding and abetting or the encouraging of driving forward, but this is she keeps being referred to as a protester and from a purely legal breakdown. Okay. Um, she comes from Colorado. I've read that she's a paid protester. I haven't seen the evidence on that or not. But when you get together with a group of people, including just one other person in your car, and you decide you're going to go out and you're going to impede federal agents attempting to arrest violent felons or sex offenders, that is that's a conspiracy. It's two or more people agreeing to go and commit a crime. And if it's federal agents and you cross state lines, it is a it is a federal felony. It's a conspiracy to do that. So before we even get to what she was yelling in the car, that by itself is is really problematic. Protesting in my mind is you're standing on a corner with

a with a bullhorn waving flags or signs that you've written with your Sharpie. That's

Wait a minute though, Matt. I don't know if she crossed state lines. They lived in Colorado, then they moved to Canada after Trump was elected, according to the reports, and then moved to Minneapolis. I I guess Canada wasn't all it's cracked up to be, but does that change things? Wouldn't the feds have jurisdiction anyway because it was a federal office?

They would absolutely have jurisdiction anyway. There's multiple theories to get there and and I and I don't know and again I I haven't I' I've only seen what the rest of us have what's been released online. I haven't been able to read any, you know, I don't think any real documents been released yet. But here's another thing just to keep in mind. A lot of the analysis on this, I I defend police officers now, Megan. That's that's the the bulk of my practice as you know. And the a lot of the a lot of the discussion out there is what was what was this woman thinking when she was driving forward? What was she thinking? Certainly, she wasn't trying to kill him. Legally, there's a case called Graham v. Okconor. It's a 1989 uh US Supreme Court case that talks about how we analyze use of force by police officers. And it is a seinal um it's a seminal case in American juristprudence.

And essentially it stands for the proposition that it must be viewed from the position of the police officer when he or she perceived the threat. Okay. Did they reasonably

subjective? It is it's a mix question. Only a lawyer would ask that. It is a mix of objective and subjective circumstances. Okay. And it is

I remember that from criminal procedure. That's right. It is. Can you just explain to the audience what that means?

It's Yeah. So it's known as the it's this is the it's the 2020 hindsight rule. colloquially that's what this case is known and that is we don't pick apart the actions or thoughts of that particular police officer you have to look at it objectively what would a reasonable police officer in the shoes of that officer feel as far as perception of a threat and she drove her car forward we got I saw that like she actually hit him with her car so it all boils down to any any shooting of a of a mother is is tragic right that's that is that is sad but the legal analysis of that is what would a reasonable police officer in the position of that federal agent feel as this woman and that federal agent had personally been dragged by another car within the last year and severely injured. Right? So, which would be relevant.

So, it is and it's a mix of that officer's individual experience, their fear of what's going on along with the objective um circumstances that the officer is faced with. And there there was a great clip. I don't know if you saw this. The the chief of Chicago PD of all places, and I was kind of surprised. He went on a rant talking about how if you're blocking federal agents intentionally, that's how people get ambushed. Like anybody, any of your viewers who are ever in the military,

we found out it was from October, but it was the point was totally well taken, right? But there was there's another Supreme Court case that says it doesn't matter if if the shooting if the first bullet was justified because cops are trained to shoot to kill. If if they're firing their gun, they're trying to kill. There's no shooting in the leg nonsense like we see in the movies. But there's another Supreme Court president that says you you don't start evaluating the second and the third bullet when they all come together like that. That's not because a lot of people saying, "Oh, but the second shot and the third shot, Matt, are the reason to charge this guy."

Yeah. And that's that number one, that is that's exactly what the Supreme Court prohibits. Okay? That that is hindsight 2020. That's dissecting something in a rapidly evolving situation that person has to make split-second decisions for their own safety and the safety of of other officers and the safety of other quote unquote protesters, too. So, it's a split-second thing. And the the next thought here, Megan, is what's the endgame? You know, there's a there's a thing known as officers who created jeopardy, which is something I've been dealing with on a case I have a homicide case in Los Angeles County right now where an innocent police officer has been has been charged with a homicide for shooting a gang member in 2018 because the guy high on meth sitting in a stolen car, murder suspect in a separate case, all of a sudden um reaches for what anybody would think was a sought-off shotgun. Later, it turns

out to be a BB gun. And BLM gets involved and they took a principled stand. Jackie Lacy, who's a friend of mine, former DA of LA, um took a principled stand, refused to file because he was innocent. George Gasone comes in, files that case. Now you got a a guy who is a model police officer, number one in his academy class. Um father of two kids, little league coach, one of the best cops I've ever worked with in 33 years, and he gets charged with a homicide. Imagine this for those circumstances. And I and I and I'm going to win it one way or another. We have a new DA, Nathan Hawkman, who who is solid. Okay. But and I and I I'm hoping they're going to dismiss it. But the but what is the endgame here? The the you've got the governor, you've got the mayor all calling for this for this agent to be prosecuted with murder. And first of all, there's a whole procedure that they're going to have to survive in

order to do that where where it's called a federal removal order. a federal judge gets to make the call of whether or not he was acting reasonably essentially in conformity with his duties, which I think that's going to be tough for any prosecution to get around. But these people who keep talking, freaking Tim Walls and all these people, it's we don't do mob justice in America or we're not supposed to anyway. And the mayor who keeps blabbing, like I I think that they at the very least if they're ever successful in getting a murder prosecution against him, there's no way that's going to be in Minneapolis. and it's going to be in some other county like we saw in Coberger where they where they have to remove it from the local area. Um but it is what's the next step?

So do we just start prosecuting our cops? Is that the idea? So and and so if we have a Democratic president who's trying to get sex offenders or or Somalian fraudsters out of the country, then it's okay. But if it's a Republican that we don't like, then all sudden the same agents and by the way thank god the feds have taken control of the investigation. The the locals are frustrated, but that's the way it needs to be. I got to run, Matt. I'm short on time. Love talking. Check them out. No, no worries.

MK True Crime is where you can hear more analysis from Matt and the guys. Thanks to Matt and thanks to Mark Garagos, too. Look, I do want to say a word about this case, this Timothy Busfield, Melissa Gilbert case. The allegations are deeply disturbing, and I'm sorry, but I I don't smell a money grab here. I don't. Um, I think the two boys are innocent. I think they came forward and this is not atypical to see them come kids who have been abused come forward and first admit a little only to later admit a lot. Now, I don't know. I'd like to know more. So, I'm going to keep my mind open and I don't want to prejudge Timothy Busfield's case before he's had the chance to defend himself. I find it extremely odd that he's not turning himself in and he is at large. Um, it's been again, we're on day four now. very strange. Um, and I also think it's interesting that people on the set saw the change in the one boy that somebody

not knowing these boys were making this allegation made an anonymous complaint about him and what she perceived as inappropriate touching of the boys. um that this is all that he's had two other cases in which not young kids, but a 17-year-old woman and then a 28-year-old woman accused him of in one case like physically assaulting her in a movie theater. So desperate was he to get in her pants and um they were on a date and she was basically saying he he went off on me. And then another woman, the specifics of which I don't know, the 17-year-old, but he tried to sue a law firm that represented her for defamation. He lost and a court ordered him to pay that firm $150,000 in their legal fees. And he also was forced to settle with that 17-year-old. So, I don't know. I don't know what happened.

But here's what I do know. Melissa Gilbert on November 15th when she decided to get online and start lecturing me about abuse cases knew full well that her husband had been accused of molesting two young boys. She knew it. And friends, that's why she did it. She went online and decided to try to make herself into a victim in the whole 15 year olds are also abuse victims which people claimed I never that I disagreed with which I would never disagree with. I have interviewed girls of that age who have been abused abused. I've interviewed girls who have grown from that age and tell me about the abuse when they were that age. In no world did I ever say that they weren't abused victims. I was making a distinction between the legal term pedophile and who it encompasses. And that is it. And these loons decided to run some campaign suggesting I was I didn't think it was a deal for a 15-year-old to get assaulted or abused.

Melissa Melissa Gilbert jumped on board. And this is not the first time she lectured me a couple months ago when I said if they're rebooting Little House on the Prairie, which they reportedly are, they better not wokeify it. and she got on and waxed poetic about how she she thinks Little House in the Prairie was woke and correcting me on my views that she didn't like. She's been lecturing Trump for years now uh on the abuse issue. Very holier than thou. And now we see why there there is only one reason she did that. And by the way, in her post that uh about me, she tried to paint herself as a 15-year-old assault victim, saying, "I I was only 15." She writes, "I was 15 um when, hold on, I'm trying to find it exactly. When I was expected to fall in love with and kiss a man on film who was several years older through the lens of today, this is shocking. I have no words other than to say I was a child. I was 15. Thank God

my mom and Michael Landon and so many others were there to make sure I was safe. Can you imagine if I hadn't had them all? I'm so fortunate. What are you saying? You're impugning Dean Butler, who was 23 and played Almanza Wilder when you were 15. So, yeah, there was an eight-year age difference between actors on a set that had the most benign kissing scenes ever. It was like, trust me, I watched every episode. There was nothing nothing that you couldn't show on a church altar. And what do you mean, thank God for Michael Landon? Who do you think directed that show? Who produced that show? Who was the star? Michael Landon. He was totally fine with everything he was asking you to do, which included kissing a 23-year-old Dean Butler. And why are you suggesting if Michael Landon hadn't been there and your mom that Dean Butler would have raped you in front of the film set?

What? What the is this? This is her trying to like paint herself into the prism of abuse both as an alleged recipient of it while she was on camera in front of the world and as an avenger of it. And my friends, I am telling you, she with the cooperation of People magazine, which is the new Gawker. That's how gross they've become, especially the digital version. I know the woman who runs it, and she's gone full tabloid. This woman begs me behind the scenes for little tips about anybody. She begs me for a crumb about any celebrity. She'll stick the knife into any celebrity and then go to their face and and say, "Oh, I'll do a lovely feature for you." But trust me, she's calling people like me for dirt on any celebrity she can find. So, People magazine decided to decided to blow this up and people ran with it because they made it about me, which is always fun.

Um, and Melissa Gilbert the whole time was obviously trying to cover up for the huge sexual molestation scandal that was about to break in her own marriage. She's mentioned repeatedly in the police affidavit on buying the presents for the boys in what the cop is calling an atmosphere of grooming. Uh so she's got to answer for some of these things too. And we now know she was on the phone call in which they outed all these complaints against Timothy Busfield by both boys and the touching of the genitalia. She heard it all. She heard it two weeks before she tried to cast herself as my moral better on the subject of abuse. Melissa Gilbert, you can sit the down. You have been exposed. Shame on you. Shame on you for that cynical ploy. Shame on you, People magazine, for going along with it. And shame on you, Timothy Busfield. Because if you touched one hair on the heads of those boys, I hope they throw the full

measure of the criminal and civil law against you. And I hope if there is anything on those home computers or any record about anything untored in your history, they find it. If you are innocent, you should come forward. you should turn yourself in and you should fight these claims aggressively the way Jay-Z did when he was wrongly accused. He gave a denial that sounded like that of an innocent man saying it didn't happen. There will never be anything to prove it happened and gave details. He was he ran toward the truth the truth which is the sound of a true fact lover of the truth lover. Uh I haven't seen Timothy Busfield do that so far. I haven't seen Melissa Gilbert do it so far. doesn't mean they won't. Uh, I look forward to hearing that and watching that case fall out or play out, it's kind of none of my business from this point other than as a news reporter. But what they tried to do to yours truly is

my business. And I think all of these magazines who participate in these and letting these Hollywood celebs be virtue signalers, especially around the issue of abuse, need to have their antenna up. It's too rampant in your industry not to have some pause. It's just too rampant. I'm sorry. There's too much reason to suspect why a Hollywood actor or actress would be gratuitously, spontaneously running to the Instagram or to the cameras to show everyone how virtuous they are in abuse. um because we've seen it happen time and time again where within days or weeks or months or more they're outed as one of the worst. Okay.

Uh I'm going to toss it to my friend Emily Jashinsky now who's got the rest of the hour. Thank you all for listening. Tomorrow we are going to be live uh at the US Supreme Court on one of the biggest cases if not the biggest case of the term. Should boys be allowed to participate in girls sports? It's on. See you then.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Dangerous Anti-ICE Rhetoric, Golden Globes Hacks, and Shock Actor Allegations, w/ Geragos & Murphy"?

Megyn Kelly (Guest), Matt Murphy (Guest), Mark Geragos (Guest).

What is "Dangerous Anti-ICE Rhetoric, Golden Globes Hacks, and Shock Actor Allegations, w/ Geragos & Murphy" about?

The discussion centers on the recent allegations against actor Timothy Busfield, who is wanted in connection with child abuse charges involving two young boys. Additionally, it examines the hypocrisy of his wife, actress Melissa Gilbert, who publicly criticized others for their views on abuse while she was aware of the investigation into her husband's serious charges.

What is mentioned in this Megyn Kelly episode?

28 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Renee Mlin Good, ICE, Timothy Busfield, Melissa Gilbert, Tom H. Holman, Donald C. Murphy. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Dangerous Anti-ICE Rhetoric, Golden Globes Hacks, and Shock Actor Allegations, w/ Geragos & Murphy"?

The episode runs 2 h 19 min; the transcript is about 24,083 words in 263 timestamped sections.

More from Megyn Kelly

About this transcript: the episode's spoken words as captioned on YouTube, split into timestamped sections. Reclip.Me locates every person, work and idea in the text, keeps the time it is first named, and quotes the words around it verbatim. Last updated January 24, 2026.