Radical Health Future: AI, Longevity, and Living with Dr. Eric Topol

What this episode is about

Dr. Eric Topol discusses the integration of AI in medicine and emphasizes the importance of focusing on health span rather than lifespan, highlighting actionable strategies to enhance overall health. He addresses the inevitability of aging while advocating for preventive measures to combat major diseases like Alzheimer's, cardiovascular issues, and cancer, urging a more proactive approach to health management.

Key takeaways

• Forget lifespan; prioritize health span—living better, not just longer, is today's medical mantra.
• Dr. Toppel's super-agers defy genetics, proving lifestyle trumps DNA in the quest for longevity.
• In medicine, we lag behind—innovation waits decades while preventable diseases claim lives unchallenged.
• Embrace the evidence: anti-aging myths crumble; it's diet, exercise, and community that truly matter.
• Want a healthy old age? Forget pricey clinics—nature, purpose, and sleep hold the true keys.

Who speaks in this episode?

• Mick (Host) · 10 min speaking
• Dr. Eric Topol (Guest) · 14 min speaking

What is discussed, and when

1. 0:00 – 5:00: Dr. Eric Toppel, Alzheimer's, Super A's, UC San Francisco
2. 5:00 – 10:00: Alzheimer's, Artificial Intelligence
3. 10:00 – 15:00: Alzheimer's, Artificial Intelligence
4. 15:00 – 20:00: Alzheimer's, Ground Truth
5. 20:00 – 23:45: Super A's, Ground Truth

Notable quotes from "Radical Health Future: AI, Longevity, and Living with Dr. Eric Topol"

• Hey everybody, this episode with Dr.

  about Dr. Eric Toppel · at 0:00

• Passion of yours to make change and to make impact? Well, I guess when I was training, I was at UC San Francisco and I was in the middle of really a revolution in cardiology…

  about UC San Francisco · at 2:24

• Same fate. So, I've always been interested in genetics and health span, lifespan. And we did a study we called the elderly. And the elderly basically another name for them are…

  about Super A's · at 4:32

• Which if this was a drug people would be taking this left and right and you know Alzheimer's is probably the most feared dreaded disease of all people. So we have something and…

  about Alzheimer's · at 8:21

• Yeah. Well, there's kind of three big parts to that story which you know I agree with you. Firstly, there's the ability to improve accuracy of diagnosis. We've already seen that.

  about Artificial Intelligence · at 9:32

• I waited till we were live together to tell you this ground truths your newsletter. My mom who will unsubscribe to any and everything in the world, right? The one thing that…

  about Ground Truth · at 15:38

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

• Dr. Eric Toppel — Person · Main guest · 2 mentions · first at 0:00
  Primary interview subject discussing AI in medicine, prevention-focused healthcare, and extending healthspan; he also promotes his newsletter and upcoming book on 'super agers.'

Books & papers

• Super A's — Book · Primary recommendation · 2 mentions · first at 3:44
  Dr. Eric Toppel's new book discussing evidence-based strategies for health span extension and disease prevention.

Companies & orgs

• UC San Francisco — Company · Referenced expert · 1 mention · first at 2:29
  Mentioned as the institution where Dr. Eric Toppel trained, highlighting its role in medical innovation.

Products & tech

• Ground Truth — Product · Secondary_owned · 3 mentions · first at 15:41
  Dr. Eric Toppel's newsletter providing the latest medical advances and insights.

Concepts & topics

• Artificial Intelligence — Concept · Core topic · 2 mentions · first at 8:57
  Central theme of the episode, discussing the impact of AI in medicine and health span extension.
• Alzheimer's — Concept · Key argument · 7 mentions · first at 1:57
  Discussed as a preventable disease with the potential for significant impact through lifestyle and medical interventions.

Full transcript with timestamps

0:00 Hey everybody, this episode with Dr. Eric Toppel is amazing. We go into AI in medicine. We talk about, you know, why we should be looking at our health span versus our lifespan. We we're going to talk through some numbers that are going to be mind-blowing, but Dr. Eric's going to give you a lot of tips that you can use right now to increase your health span. We don't talk about or believe in reversing aging. We just need to make sure that we understand that it's going to happen. But what can we do um to have a prolonged health span? So without further ado, this is my good friend and someone that you're going to get a lot of wisdom from, Dr. Eric Tel.

0:45 This is Mick Unplugged. Let us uncover the because that thing that drives you. That thing that fuels you. I'm ready if you are. Let's go. Ladies and gentlemen, welcome to another exciting episode of Mick Unplugged. And today I have someone who I've been wanting to talk to for a long time. Somebody that has really shaped a lot of thoughts that I have around AI and discipline and health and strategies. He is none other than the amazing, the brilliant, the guy that's going to change your life today, Dr. Eric Toppel. Dr. Eric, how you doing today, sir?

1:23 Well, thank you. That's an awfully kind introduction. Very much appreciated. I mean I mean every word of it. You are definitely doing some gamechanging things out there. I love to talk to my guests about their because that thing that's deeper than your why, right? That passion that drives you. And you've done so much in your illustrious career. What's your because today? Why do you keep doing the things that you do? I just think we can do so much better to prevent the major diseases, not just the area that I've been in for my career, cardiovascular, but also neurodeenerative, preventing Alzheimer's and also preventing cancer. We are not taking advantage of all the golden opportunities, the knowledge, the advances, the innovation, and we should be doing it. It's frustrating, but we will. Eventually, we'll get there.

2:13 Yeah. Yeah. I love it. And again, you're doing so much. You have done so much. and you continue to do groundbreaking things in your industry. When did you know that that was going to become a passion of yours to to make change and to make impact? Well, I guess when I was training, I was at UC San Francisco and uh I was in the middle of really a revolution in cardiology where the beginning of angoplasty and clot dissolving therapies and all sorts of things are happening very quickly. And that gave me a sense that well that's not a one-off, you know, why don't we do this more often? Why don't we why don't we start to really take medicine to levels that are not the status quo, which is typical. It's a slowmoving field and we need to get on the accelerator and there's too many people that are suffering that are dying or have whatever disability and that could be as is cleaning up the problems of

3:12 medical errors or it could be coming up with new strategies to prevent diseases and we're just not doing that. everything we do essentially in medicine is you know treat treat where is the prevent prevent prevent uh and so we now are empowered to go that route um and it's a lot like what I experienced in the early 80s which is you know um when when a field within medicine went through a radical change we need to do that more frequently than every decade or two

3:42 you know again all the things that you're doing you have a new book coming out the super aer Um, and and what I love about this book and the things that you're talking about, it's evidence-based, right? Like, you're not just giving hyperbole, you're not giving theory, you're not doing the what-ifs, you're not trying to scare people. You're talking about evidence-based uh topics and and and help. Could you for the viewers and listeners talk about super aers, where the idea come from, and what do you want people to get out of this? Yeah, I think many people um in your audience are like me where they have a terrible family history.

4:21 When I was growing up, I think I remember the most is going to all these funerals of my relatives and my aunts and my uncles, my grandparents dying all at young ages. And I figured, well, [clears throat] I'm condemned to the same fate. So, uh I've always been interested in genetics and you know, health span, lifespan. And uh we did a study we called the elderly. And the elderly basically another name for them are super aers. We we were able to find 1,400 people who were average age 89 who'd never been sick in their lives and they were on no medications. Now that's a rarified group. And we did whole genome sequencing on these people. and we found very little from their DNA sequence to account for their welderly super age or status. Now there's a small genetic component but it's far less than we ever had assumed. And so that actually felt that's liberating. I might not have to you know succumb like my

5:21 road is and I think it's an eyeopening finding and then the question is what does account for healthy aging and we do know as you mentioned the evidence the the the the body of evidence of course supports healthy lifestyles you don't have to go to longevity clinics or take these anti-aging supplements that have no data or other very expensive things like you know plasma feres is unproven stem cells, all kinds of, you know, supplement stuff. Actually, first first off is concentrating on healthy anti-inflammatory diet and lots of physical activity, not just aerobic, but also strength resistance training and sleep quality. Really important, but the list goes on about being out in nature, having a purpose, you know, having lots of social engagement. So we've learned a lot about lifestyle factors. It's not all about that. The other thing we learned uh that I reviewed in super aers is the immune

6:23 system is really big. We need to keep our immune system healthy because as we old this term imunosiness it's prone to promote inflammation another term inflammaging which is what sets off these age related diseases to occur. So, we have to get on top of that and not let our immune system lose its integrity as we age. Some people, the super aers, they're just naturally got a great immune system. But most of us, we have not the ideal progression as time goes on where our immune system loses some of its protective capabilities or it gets disregulated. We got to prevent that if we're going to get our health span extended to the max.

7:06 Yeah. So, speaking of that, with the immune system, for those that are watching or listening, what are one or two things that we can do to improve our immune system or help out our immune system so that we can become one of those super aers?

7:20 Well, one great example, I mean, you're young, but if you're over 50, you better get a a shingles vaccine. It's actually pretty incredible. Now as of this week there will be four studies natural experiments large countries US Canada Wales Australia you know with collectively millions of people and the people who got the shinkles vaccine had 20% or more reduction of dementia most of course is Alzheimer's about 80%. And then today is a report about how shingles vaccine slows the aging process in people. Now these are not related to that that it's having a big effect through the herpes zoster which is what causes shingles but what we've now seen is that the immune system is really amped up. It's made healthier and that's what accounts for this slowing aging and less risk of developing Alzheimer's disease. So we got one thing right now which if this was a drug people would be taking this left and right and you know

8:26 Alzheimer's is probably the most feared dreaded disease of all people. So we have something and we're going to build on that you know medications other vaccines maybe there'll ultimately be a vaccine just to prevent uh neurodeenerative disease but uh that's a big jump in our knowledge base and it's really exciting and it goes beyond of course lifestyle factor.

8:50 That's awesome. You know one of the things that I've been passionate about as our society continues to evolve is artificial intelligence. of AI. I personally believe that in the health space, in the longevity space, AI is actually more powerful than it is in any other spaces because people forget the intelligence part of AI, right? Like a lot of times when we're thinking AI, we're thinking of bot or we're thinking of automation, but that's not really AI. Those technologies have existed for years and years and years and years and actually decades and decades. But in the health space, AI is is making huge impacts. How how are you viewing AI for the good, for the bad or for the indifferent?

9:32 Yeah. Well, there's kind of three big parts to that story which you know I agree with you. Firstly, there's the ability to improve accuracy of diagnosis. We've already seen that proven for images like mammogs and colonoscopy picking up polyps and many other forms of imaging of scans. So that's one that is very clear-cut that the AI sees things that human experts can't see, won't see, ever see. So that's one. The second is the ability to give the gift of time back to clinicians because they're very much burdened with data clerk functions and they're not even looking at patients. They're typing on a keyboard.

10:18 And now we're seeing how natural language processing and all the other downstream functions of an automated synthetic note. So there's total attention being paid one to one eye I eye to eye and there's a presence back. But moreover we're seeing randomized studies show that it provides a gift of time. It's a big morale booster. So we're getting back that patient doctor relationship gradually and that's going to be big. But the one I think is the biggest contribution in the future is using AI to prevent diseases. That is taking all the data of a person many layers of data and using that to know who's at high risk and getting all over that person so they never get a important age related disease. This these are the three big areas. Now it doesn't mean that AI is perfect. There's liabilities of course, but I'm very sanguin about all three of these being a big deal.

11:14 Yeah. You often emphasize the importance of of not just lifespan, but you talk about the health span. Break that down for us for those that are listening or watching. Well, the average American uh health span ends at age 64 because they have a major uh chronic disease, mostly age related diseases, cardiovascular, a cancer, beginning of a neurodeenerative disease. Um the lifespan, as you know, in the US averages about 79, a couple years more for women than men. So that's a 15-year age gap between the end of a person's average health span to the end of their life. Now that 15 years shouldn't be. It should be that the health span and lifespan are close. That big loss of nearly 15 years, that's what we have to start to, you know, people want to have longevity and live to 120.

12:11 That's not worth anything if you're basically demented and frail. I mean, we can do that today. We could put you on a life support system and keep you alive forever, but you're a functional. What what good is that? So, we have to get this maximal extension of health span and stop and stop this terrible gap that exists today between health span and lifespan. And this longevity craze is wrong. We shouldn't be going after longevity. We should have a health span interest. That's the primary objective.

12:42 How do we how do we achieve this, right? like how do we I I mean I know you're doing your part in articulating this message, but but how do we really just let people understand that this is a thing and and and steps that they can take in order to improve their health span.

12:58 Yeah. So, first of all, we could accept that we're going to age. You know, that's kind of a normal process.

13:03 Yeah. Instead of trying to block aging and, you know, reverse aging, you know, we're going to age, but let's not accept the age related diseases. So in the weeks ahead we're starting the first prevention of Alzheimer's trial by taking all the data in high-risisk people and that go randomizing to very intensive continuous lifestyle improvement versus just providing some educational materials and then in 1200 people who are at high risk for Alzheimer's we'll we'll be be able to tell whether we're making headway and then we'll start with different medications that have a lot of promise on top of lifestyle. So, we believe Alzheimer's ultimately will be a preventable disease as will be most common cancers and heart disease, but it's going to take a while. You have to have the proof of concept. You have to have compelling evidence. But we have to get started on this. And you couldn't do this without multimodal AI because you

14:02 got to take the data from all these different layers and that includes genes and proteins and biomarkers. It's not very expensive, but it relies on great analytics. And I think that's what's the that's why I'm so excited about the new era of prevention.

14:17 So, in your estimate, and this is about to be a bad question. And I shouldn't even ask it in the way that I'm getting at, but so I went to the doctor for a regular checkup a few weeks ago. And I was asking him and the team about using AI to help with diagnosis or with symptom prevention and all this and he said that's not something I'm I'm comfortable with and I don't want to experiment with that. Like why is that mindset still there and how do we change that mindset? Yeah, it's very hard to change anything in medicine as I've learned over four decades.

14:51 Unfortunately, there's lots of resistance among physicians to incorporate AI, especially when it's proven. I mean, there's many things that we're still waiting for, you know, the that kind of compelling evidence. But it's sad because well, there are things that should definitely be part of daily routine medical practice and care. There's just a gap that's time and it's just really unfortunate because it's not delivering state-of-the-art care for patients. Oh wow, the AI is going to take over my role. Doctors are typically control freaks. They want to control everything. And here AI is coming in and encroaching their control uh factor. I mean, there's lots of things here that account for this reluctance to accept or embrace AI.

15:37 So, here's something you don't know. And I I waited till we were live together to tell you this ground truths your newsletter. My mom who will unsubscribe to any and everything in the world, right? The one thing that she subscribes to that she can't wait for the latest and greatest is Ground Truth. I'd love to give you the floor to talk to us about Ground Truth, your newsletter. I'm going to make sure we have links to that and obviously links to the book as well, too. But I'd love to talk about that newsletter because my mom loves it. Oh, well that's that's fantastic. Uh, thanks so much for passing that along. Well, uh, four years ago, I started um reluctantly to do this newsletter, which is now kind of newsletter and podcast kind of alternating uh weekly uh or if not more frequent. And uh what I learned was so much better than using Twitter or these other social media because you can really express yourself. it's not like

16:35 you know 240 characters and I started to realize that um this was helping people you know get the latest medical advances or talk hear from the you know the leading figures in the world of biio medicine and it's been fun for me I really I love doing it I have one another one I'm going to work on this week is the the big jump in new uh shingles vaccine that's happening just this But, you know, I really want to have people aware. Most of the time it's stuff that's not covered in the media and there's big things happening and a lot of people these days are are not very optimistic for various reasons, but I try to show, hey, you know what, we're making great progress and we're going to get to the point of preventing these dreaded diseases and, you know, a whole different practice of medicine. you know, whether that's changing how we screen for cancer, how we prevent cancer, all the things that we can do to

17:35 get on top of preventing heart disease. I mean, there's something every day. I have to pick the things that each week that deserve uh spotlighting, but it's it's fun. It takes some time to do it, but it's so great to get the feedback from your mother. No. Again, my mom will unsubscribe to anything, but she she loves the fact that what you send out is informative. And this is me and me only. I'll say it because it's the truth. A lot of folks that have newsletters, they're trying to show you how smart they are or getting you to click into something else where you're there. Like, she feels like you were genuinely in your heart is to help people and to give them information that can help them. And so, that's kudos to you.

18:17 Well, thanks. No, I really appreciate it. means a lot to me because, you know, I don't have any uh there's no sponsors, there's no ads, you know, it's free. It it it's something that is the main purpose is to spread, you know, the word, spread what's really important going on in medicine that a lot of people might not know about. Like for example, the breakthrough test about Alzheimer's disease that still today, you know, I go into a giving a a talk and there's several hundred people. I say, "Anybody hear of the PTA 217 test?"

18:50 Like one person raises their hand, you know, uh, but you know, I've written at least two newsletters about I say, "Anybody heard of organ clocks?" You know, two people raised their hand. Well, you know, it's just so much stuff going on that's exciting and people don't know about it and it's not covered elsewhere. So, that's what I try to do.

19:08 Awesome stuff. So, what else do you have going on? What else are you What else are you excited about? any projects? I know the book and like I said, we'll have links to the book, but what else is is Dr. Eric working on?

19:21 Well, there are doing that starting up that trial Alzheimer's prevention. We just enrolled a thousand people with long COVID to try to prevent or treat long COVID, which is not there is no treatment validated. And we're testing a GLP1 drug uh bound uh for people versus placebo. So, this is a direct to participant trial. All of our clinical trials are direct to participant. We don't involve any medical centers, you know, we just go right to the people and that's what we should be doing and we shouldn't be doing trials like the old way. They cost too much and they're very inconvenient and very slow and extremely costly and we can cut 90% of the cost just by going direct to participant. So that's something we do. But you know basically the AI analytics that is our main thrust is being able to take many layers of data including sensors able sensors and bring that together to extract the most meaning so that we live

20:24 in a new era now everybody's talked about the information era for decades. Well we're in a hyperinformation era. We're in a tsunami of information but no one really is analyzing it very well. So that's one of the things that we really uh work on.

20:38 That's awesome. That's awesome. So Dr. Eric, where can people find and follow you and and keep up with the latest greatest of you?

20:44 Well, thanks. I mean, Substack ground truce. I named it ground truce has a a double meaning. One is it's a big term in AI, how you tell whether the AI is performing versus the truth, the ground truth. But it's also I'm on the ground that I'm trying to tell the truth. you know, I'm trying to get out there things that people should know about. So, that's one thing. And, uh, you know, that's easy to find, ground truth. Uh, Super A's book is the fourth book I've written about the future of medicine and one I'm really, you know, as I mentioned, very keen about preventing diseases and otherwise, you know, we're publishing quite a bit in the in the main, you know, journals. And, you know, that's that's kind of what we believe.

21:26 You got to have the evidence. You got to have peer review. Don't give me these influencers that are hawking supplements and other crap. You know what? If you're hawking something, then that means you're not credible. You know, you're never gonna find me selling a supplement or anything. So, you know, that's I think something really important. And I wish we had, you know, a lot less of that stuff because it's got people very confused out there. They don't know who to believe. being a trusted source. That's something you, you know, you have to work hard at getting that trust and maintaining it. Um, so that's what I try to do.

22:02 And you do an amazing job. Again, I'm honored to to have you on. I'm a huge supporter and follower of all the things that you do. Just just truly blessed to to have you here in the wisdom that you have, man. So, I I could talk to you forever, but I don't want to do that. But what I'm going to do is this. I want to think of the right way to do it, but I want to provide 20 copies of your book to someone. So, I will make sure I purchase them. But the first 20 people that message me, whether it's LinkedIn, Instagram, my phone, whatever, the first people that message me, super agers, I'm going to send a copy of this book. How about that?

22:38 Oh my gosh. Well, thank you. Yes, sir. And I thank your mother for me because um that that's really wonderful to hear that she's a she's a reader, an avid reader and yeah, I mean that's what it's all about is connecting with people and trying to share worthwhile information and perspective.

22:56 You got it. Again, I'm honored to have you here. For everybody that's watching or listening, make sure you go to the show notes of the descriptions. I'm going to have links to everything that Dr. Eric has going on. Trust me, you definitely want to subscribe to the newsletter. If you're not on Substack, go on Substack right now just for him. Forget anyone else because he's an amazing writer and information sharer as well too. And for all the viewers and listeners, remember you're Because here's your superpower. Go unleash it.

23:24 You've been plugged into Mick Unplugged. Don't just listen, take action. Rate and subscribe. Follow me on social and get the full experience at mickhuntofficial.com. Keep building, keep leading, and most importantly, keep dominating.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Radical Health Future: AI, Longevity, and Living with Dr. Eric Topol"?

Mick (Host), Dr. Eric Topol (Guest).

What is "Radical Health Future: AI, Longevity, and Living with Dr. Eric Topol" about?

Dr. Eric Topol discusses the integration of AI in medicine and emphasizes the importance of focusing on health span rather than lifespan, highlighting actionable strategies to enhance overall health. He addresses the inevitability of aging while advocating for preventive measures to combat major diseases like Alzheimer's, cardiovascular issues, and cancer, urging a more proactive approach to…

What is mentioned in this Mick Unplugged Podcast episode?

6 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Dr. Eric Toppel, Artificial Intelligence, Alzheimer's, Super A's, Ground Truth, UC San Francisco. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Radical Health Future: AI, Longevity, and Living with Dr. Eric Topol"?

The episode runs 24 min; the transcript is about 4,126 words in 38 timestamped sections.

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