Transcript

Episode 707: The Tragic Death of Gloria Ramirez

From Morbid | Podcast · Episode page · Watch on YouTube

· 55 min · 9,953 words · 267 timestamped sections

This is the full, timestamped transcript of "Episode 707: The Tragic Death of Gloria Ramirez", an episode of Morbid | Podcast published September 11, 2025 (55 min, about 9,953 words). It mentions 25 people, works and ideas, including Gloria Ramirez, Dimethyl Sulfate, Riverside General Hospital, DMSO, Dr. Julie Gorchinski.

What this episode is about

The discussion centers around the tragic death of Gloria Ramirez, referred to as the "Toxic Lady," who became the focus of intrigue and speculation due to the mysterious circumstances surrounding her passing and the subsequent health issues experienced by medical personnel. The hosts engage in light-hearted banter and personal anecdotes while addressing the bizarre and puzzling elements of this case, highlighting both the strangeness of human experiences and the darker side of unexplained phenomena.

Key takeaways

  • Diet Coke: The refrigerator cigarette we never knew we needed, but it's definitely not for everyone.
  • Resale tickets: Capitalism's wild west. Too often, fans foot the bill for someone's scalping scheme.
  • Biden Nasty: Because sometimes it's okay to accept our inherent chaos with a little humor.
  • Spoilers are today's urban legends; they ruin plots faster than a catfish reveal on TikTok.
  • Gloria Ramirez: A reminder that labels can be toxic—let’s humanize the narrative, not sensationalize it.

Who speaks in this episode?

  • Ash (Host) · 27 min speaking
  • Elena (Host) · 27 min speaking

What is discussed, and when

  1. – 5:00: Adolf Ash
  2. – 10:00: Gloria Ramirez, Johnny Estrada, Cervical Cancer, Riverside General Hospital
  3. – 15:00: Gloria Ramirez, Dr. Julie Gorchinski, Nurse Moren Welch, Nurse Susan Kaine
  4. – 20:00: Gloria Ramirez, Sally Baldderas, Riverside General Hospital, Nurse Susan Kaine
  5. – 25:00: Gloria Ramirez, Riverside General Hospital, Sewer Gas, Algae
  6. – 30:00: Gloria Ramirez
  7. – 35:00: Gloria Ramirez, Brian Anderson, Dr. Julie Gorchinski, Riverside General Hospital
  8. – 40:00: Gloria Ramirez, Dimethyl Sulfate, DMSO, Mass Psychogenic Illness
  9. – 45:00: Dimethyl Sulfate, Gloria Ramirez, DMSO, Nerve Gas
  10. – 50:00: Gloria Ramirez, Toxic Lady, Frank Dos
  11. – 54:52: Gloria Ramirez, Toxic Lady, Olivewood Cemetery

Notable quotes from "Episode 707: The Tragic Death of Gloria Ramirez"

  • Yeah. All right. So, that wraps up Bit Nasty. now Bid nasty is done. Pinky swear. Let's go girls. today we are going to be talking about a very interesting case. and one that…
    about Gloria Ramirez · at
  • So the drugs started working their way through her system and in the meanwhile nurse Moren Welch began performing mouthto-mouth resuscitation with an ambu bag. This is cuz she was starting to really go intense.
    about Nurse Moren Welch · at
  • Moments after that, the entire emergency room at Riverside General was evacuated.
    about Riverside General Hospital · at
  • Yeah. Susan Kaine also continued to experience apnea in the days following and was hospitalized at Corona Regional Medical Center until her symptoms subsided 3 days later.
    about Nurse Susan Kaine · at
  • So. That and they were unfortunately never going to really get any. And in August, Dr. Gorchinsky filed a $6 million lawsuit against Riverside General Hospital, alleging that…
    about Dr. Julie Gorchinski · at
  • The DHS concluded the symptoms experienced by those who came in contact with Gloria was a case of mass psychoggenic illness, a situation in which symptoms of physical illness…
    about Mass Psychogenic Illness · at
  • Dimethyl sulfate. We have we there's so many dimethyls. There is in most cases dimethyl sulfate is used in small quantities in the manufacturing.
    about Dimethyl Sulfate · at
  • Oh. creating the highly unusual set of [ __ ] circumstances required to transform the DMSO into dimethyl sulfate.
    about DMSO · at

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

  • Gloria Ramirez — Person · Core subject (case victim) · 23 mentions · first at
    Her 1994 ER visit and death triggered a cluster of illnesses among hospital staff, driving the episode's mystery and later chemical explanations.
  • Dr. Julie Gorchinski — Person · Affected clinician / key witness · 2 mentions · first at
    Medical resident who handled the blood vial, became severely ill, and later sued the hospital; her symptoms anchor the severity of the exposure claims.
  • Brian Anderson — Person · Referenced expert (forensic lab director) · 3 mentions · first at
    Director at the forensic science center who explained the ammonia odor, identified DMSO, and advanced the DMSO→dimethyl sulfate theory.
    It was only when Anderson checked the chemical index text to review DMSO that he noticed an adjacent entry for a different chemical that seemed the most likely explanation for what had caused.
  • Nurse Moren Welch — Person · Affected clinician / key witness · 2 mentions · first at
    Performed resuscitation and handled the blood vial; later rejected the mass psychogenic illness explanation and pushed for re-review.
  • Nurse Susan Kaine — Person · Affected clinician · 2 mentions · first at
    Drew Gloria Ramirez's blood and collapsed shortly after; her symptoms and hospitalization are part of the exposure cluster.
  • Adolf Ash — Person · Host / narrator · 1 mention · first at
    Co-host of the episode who introduces the case, guides the narrative, and reacts to the investigation and theories.
    Yeah. All right. So, that wraps up Bit Nasty. now Bid nasty is done. Pinky swear. Let's go girls. today we are going to be talking about a very interesting case. and one that…
  • Sally Baldderas — Person · Affected clinician · 2 mentions · first at
    Helped move Gloria Ramirez's body and later became ill with burning skin and apnea, reinforcing the exposure cluster beyond the trauma room.
    Among those who helped move the body was ER nurse Sally Baldderas, who had been in trauma unit one and helped to collect the blood sample from Gloria. Once she'd returned to the parking lot after moving Gloria to where she needed to be,.
  • Dr. Alberto Ooa — Person · Attending physician / key comparator · 1 mention · first at
    He was deeply involved in resuscitation yet reportedly had no symptoms, complicating theories about exposure source.
    I was Yeah, how? As he continued his attempt to stabilize Gloria Ramirez, Dr. Alberto Ooa heard someone shout, Catch her. Catch her. Catch her. Okay.
  • Johnny Estrada — Person · Witness (boyfriend) / incident initiator · 3 mentions · first at
    He observed Gloria Ramirez's breathing distress, called paramedics, and provided initial information to responders.
    Paramedics as well who transported Gloria. All they knew was that they had been told by Johnny Estrada that her name is Gloria Ramirez. She's 31 years old and she was recently…
  • Robert Schwarz — Person · Referenced expert (environmental attorney) · 1 mention · first at
    Quoted criticizing the county's delays as destroying key evidence, reflecting public pressure and suspicion of mishandling.
    I could see why people would be curious like that. Robert Schwarz, an environmental attorney, told the LA Times, The county is destroying the single most important piece of evidence.
  • Tom Dantis — Person · County representative / spokesperson · 1 mention · first at
    Responded to public pressure by explaining the investigative approach of ruling out thousands of compounds.
    They're destroying Gloria Ramirez's remains by having delayed things this long. Tom Dantis, a representative from Riverside County, responded to the public pressure and said…
  • Frank Dos — Person · Referenced expert (toxicologist) · 1 mention · first at
    Cited to support plausibility that Gloria Ramirez could have used a large amount of DMSO, enabling the proposed reaction.
    That a reaction like that would have required an enormous amount of DMSO, Oregon State toxicologist Frank Dos pointed out in that stage of fighting for her life, Ramirez may have really overloaded on it.

Concepts & topics

  • Dimethyl Sulfate — Concept · Key explanatory concept (suspected toxic agent) · 6 mentions · first at
    Proposed as the compound responsible for staff symptoms; discussed as highly toxic and associated with chemical warfare/nerve agents.
  • DMSO — Concept · Key explanatory concept (suspected precursor chemi · 3 mentions · first at
    Presented as the substance Gloria Ramirez may have used for pain relief; central to the theory that it transformed into a more toxic compound under unusual conditions.
  • Mass Psychogenic Illness — Concept · Official explanation (contested) · 2 mentions · first at
    The California DHS study concluded staff symptoms were mass psychogenic illness; the hosts and affected staff criticize it as biased/insufficient.
  • Toxic Lady — Concept · Media label / narrative controversy · 4 mentions · first at
    A stigmatizing nickname applied to Gloria Ramirez; the hosts explicitly reject it and emphasize dignity and misinformation.
    After you hear the story, you'll understand why like that's, and her family does not want her to be known as the toxic woman.
  • Cervical Cancer — Concept · Medical background (cause of death context) · 3 mentions · first at
    Explains Gloria Ramirez's underlying illness and the autopsy conclusion that her death involved kidney failure brought on by cancer.
    She was only 31 years old. She was a mother of two, but she had been diagnosed with advanced stage cervical cancer about 6 weeks before this.
  • Advanced Stage Cervical Cancer — Concept · Medical background (severity) · 1 mention · first at
    Specifies the severity of Gloria Ramirez's diagnosis and contextualizes her rapid decline and pain-management choices.
    She was only 31 years old. She was a mother of two, but she had been diagnosed with advanced stage cervical cancer about 6 weeks before this.
  • Ammonia — Concept · Observed clue (odor) · 2 mentions · first at
    The ammonia smell from blood/body was a key early clue later attributed to medication breakdown by the forensic lab.
    Then she handed it to Moren Welch, the nurse, who immediately noticed that the blood smelled of ammonia.
  • Nerve Gas — Concept · Comparative toxic agent concept · 1 mention · first at
    Mentioned to convey the severity of dimethyl sulfate's history and the perceived chemical-warfare-like nature of symptoms.
    The chemical has an unpleasant history as one of the main components of this thing called nerve gas used in chemical warfare.
  • Insecticide Poisoning — Concept · Symptom comparison · 1 mention · first at
    Used to describe the tremors, apnea, and burning skin experienced by staff, framing initial suspicion of organophosphate exposure.
    That evening became sick with symptoms that are typically associated with like insecticide poisoning.
  • Sewer Gas — Concept · Prior facility issue (context) · 1 mention · first at
    Cited as a previous inspection finding at the hospital, supporting early theories of ventilation/air contamination.
    We got algae. And a year after that, an inspection found the emergency room was permeated with sewer gas from a drain.
  • Algae — Concept · Prior facility issue (context) · 1 mention · first at
    Referenced as part of Riverside General's earlier safety problems (algae in a reservoir) that influenced suspicion toward hospital infrastructure.
    Inspection discovered that algae growing in the water in a water reservoir was also causing issues.

Places & events

  • Riverside General Hospital — Place · Primary setting (incident location) · 4 mentions · first at
    The ER where staff became ill during treatment of Gloria Ramirez; also discussed for prior issues with fumes and safety concerns.
  • Olivewood Cemetery — Place · Burial location · 2 mentions · first at
    Where Gloria Ramirez was buried after delays; used to highlight the family's prolonged limbo and media intrusion.
    The coroner's office released the body to the family in late April. And Gloria Ramirez was buried at Olivewood Cemetery in Riverside on April 27th, 1994, almost two full months after she passed away. Like that's tough on that family.

Full transcript with timestamps

Hey weirdos. I'm Ash. And I'm Elena. And this is Morbid with a side of refrigerator cigarette. In case you don't know what that is, I don't promote smoking. I do promote Diet Coke. Yeah, that's that's a thing. People call Diet Cokes a fridge cigarette.

It's just a meme I saw once. Yeah, that I think that's funny. Mhm. I think I too think it's funny.

Strawberries and cream Dr. Pepper. My fridge cigarettes. All right. Well, I think I think Diet Coke is disgusting. You know what? No. You know which one I do like of the Dr. Pepper ones?

Um the cream soda one. Oh, see. I think that's disgusting. Disgusting. Disgusting. But that's funny cuz they were in your fridge when I tried them. You gave me somebody else like them.

No, you know why they were in my fridge? Tell me. Cuz I think you thought that was the kind I liked and you got them for one of your gettogethers and then you gave me the rest of them and I felt bad.

It's my fault. You know why those are in my refrigerat? Because my refri my refrigerat.

You know why those are in my refrigerator? Because of you. No. And that's No, cuz you were doing a kind you were doing a kindness and then I did a kindness back

by taking them and not saying like those are not the ones I like until now. Until now like a year later.

You little you little cuz I really don't like those. But you you drank them. I like them.

And I think Aiden drank some. So worked out worked out for me. Drink drank drunk.

Drank it. Uh yeah. What else is this new brother man? Uh, you guys sold out the Sunday show in under four minutes. You're outrageous. I It's insane. Like, who are you? Here's the thing. Um, there are tickets being resold. That has nothing to do with us. We get a proposal with how many seats and we say, "Yeah, that price sounds fair." And then people can buy them and do whatever the [ __ ] they want with them, which sucks. I realize

it sucks a giant ass, but we have nothing to do with that. Yeah. So, if you see tickets that are like

astronomical priced, it's even on the Wilbur website because you have to look under the thing and it'll say verified resale ticket. That tells you that someone's trying to resell that ticket.

Yeah. Uh cuz there's like balcony seats that are sitting there right now for like $1,200. Whoever did that, go [ __ ] yourself.

But like that's that's not us, you know? We're not out here charging [ __ ] No. And that's how it works. We literally get a proposal with each seat and how much money it should cost. And we actually went back a couple times and were like, "Ah, let's be like a little more fair."

We would never do that to you. No. So, so anyway, but I there was just a couple people that were concerned that we were like trying to

concerned that we thought we were out here thinking we're like Sabrina Carpenter or something. So, I'm not

I wish. And also those like those tickets that people are concerned about, those aren't like we're not

like the resale tickets. Whoever's selling those tickets, if somebody buys them, they get that money. So

yeah, we're not profiting off of that in any way. It's just crazy. It's a wild world.

Yeah, people people are are getting rougher and rougher out here in these streets. But you know what? You're all great. You're all that matters.

You're all fan freakingastic. Yeah, we just like it was only a couple people that like even noticed it and were so and mentioned it, but we just didn't want anybody thinking that we were out here trying to sell tickets for like $700 and [ __ ]

No. Uh, that's crazy. [ __ ] crazy. Um, but yeah. So, so that's stupid um stupid of people to do.

I think that's really our only bit nasty though. I know. I think that is. I like that I've officially named our business um segment Bid Nasty.

That's pretty fun in my opinion. of nasty and that commences been nasty. Yeah, cuz I don't think there's anything else that really has come up.

No, that that you guys need to [ __ ] know about. You know, don't forget um we lied. Biden nasty over

more nasty. Don't forget uh tomorrow actually cuz I think this is Thursday's episode.

I was going to say look at look at me. She looked at me she looked at me first like I know I was just like she looked at me blankly and shook her head. I just went, "Oh, no. I don't I don't know those things."

So, today is Thursday for you. It's what? Tuesday for us. So, we're not even that far apart. Don't worry. We're not getting back into craziness. But anyway, Friday is going to be our bonus episode where we are going to talk about

um Unknown Number, the high school catfish scandal, which I actually last night me and Drew were watching TikTok together and people have been filming their reactions when they find out who the catfish is. Oh, yeah.

And I need you all to please do that if you don't know. Oh, hell yeah. If you somehow don't know who the catfish is at this point, you got to film yourself watching it because your reaction will be insane.

I've been spoiled. I already know. I got spoiled ahead of time. So, I won't do it, but you guys should definitely do it.

I got spoiled ahead of time, but even still still shocking. Well, even still shocking. And also, I was like, well, I don't know, you know, I didn't know exactly.

Yeah. But we won't we'll talk about it on Friday. We'll talk about it on Friday. Yeah. Aka tomorrow if you're listening on Thursday.

Yeah. All right. So, that wraps up Bit Nasty. Uh now Bid nasty is done. Pinky swear. Let's go girls. Uh today we are going to be talking about a very interesting case. Um and one that so we're going to be talking about Gloria Ramirez. Um you might see her referred to sometimes as the toxic woman, which is shitty.

Not great to do that. Um, it's it's really not great to name somebody that. After you hear the story, you'll understand why like that's, you know, and her family does not want her to be

known as the toxic woman. Yeah. Um, that's who who would want that, you know? So,

so we will not be calling her the toxic woman, but I just wanted in case you had seen it that that's the same Gloria Ramirez. Um, this this story is wild. I know like I know of this story but I don't know all the details.

Very interesting. Very tragic. Yeah. Very scary. Yeah. Uh so let's start. Uh within hours of Gloria Ramirez taking um an unexpected visit to the ER in 1994, medical personnel who you know rushed to her aid that evening became sick with symptoms that are typically associated with like insecticide poisoning.

Oh [ __ ] like very strange like tremors, apneoa, burning skin like randomly. So like if you like ingested like raid or something.

Yeah. And like several of these people, several of these like medical personnel required hospitalization themselves because of it.

Oh. And in the days and weeks after this, the doctors and nurses who came into direct contact with Ramirez continued to experience these crazy bizarre symptoms. They were defying logical explanation at this point and they were leaving everyone wondering how had this seemingly ordinary woman's body been transformed into some kind of like Trojan horse of toxicity. That's what that's essentially what they were saying. Like what happened here? Like

cuz initially they had no idea. They had no idea. They didn't know what they had gotten into. And honestly the the symptoms and things that were happening were like associated with chemical warfare essentially.

What? Yeah. It's wild. So, let's start at the beginning. It's the best place to start.

It always is. On the evening of February 19th, 1994, Gloria Ramirez complained to her boyfriend Johnny Estrada that she was having some trouble breathing, which is scary.

Yeah. She was only 31 years old. She was a mother of two, but she had been diagnosed with advanced stage cervical cancer about 6 weeks before this.

Oh, wow. So, she was actually scheduled to begin some pretty aggressive chemotherapy the following Tuesday, but obviously this night things took a pretty alarming turn. And so, when she started to say, "I'm having trouble breathing." This was It should never be something that's ignored, but getting that diagnosis, it made it even scarier.

Yeah, of course. Um, and she actually ended up collapsing. Like, she told her boyfriend, "I h something's wrong." And then she collapsed.

Oh, that's so scary. Johnny called the paramedics and they got there really quickly and she was very quickly transported to Riverside General Hospital and this is in California.

Okay. Uh she was admitted at about 8:15 p.m. and taken to trauma unit 1. Emergency staff assessed the whole situation. Everybody was moving at a rapid pace, but by the time she arrived there, her breathing had gotten way worse. It was super shallow, really quick, and it was causing her blood pressure to fall really, really rapidly.

That's so scary. So, in just trying to determine what the cause of all of this was, doctors and nurses questioned Gloria as best they could right?

Uh, but by this point, she was barely conscious and she was only able to really provide some short answers and most of them were kind of unintelligible and frankly unhelpful at this point.

Yeah. She's not like totally with it at this point. Yeah. So the doctors and nurses, the whole staff were questioning the paramedics as well who transported Gloria. All they knew was that they had been told by Johnny Estrada that her name is Gloria Ramirez. She's 31 years old and she was recently diagnosed with cervical cancer. So the attending medical staff started treatment and they started by injecting a combination of bzzoazipines, Valium, Versid, and Adavan.

Oh wow. That was to sedate Gloria. Yeah, I would think so. Obviously. and followed by more injections of lidocaine and an anti-arithmic called bratilium to stabilize the irregular heartbeat that was happening.

Okay. Um so the drugs started working their way through her system and in the in the meanwhile nurse Moren Welch began performing mouthto-mouth resuscitation with an ambu bag. This is

cuz she was starting to really go intense. It is it it's like one of those intense medical scenes that you're picturing in your head. It was like something from the pit.

Exactly. That's exactly what it is. And the combination of the drugs and this forced air should have been enough to stabilize Gloria's situation at least for a brief period of time. Um, you know, just trying to so they could collect some more information even just to move forward.

But when it became clear she wasn't responding to the treatment at all, medical staff began preparing to shock Gloria's heart back into a normal rhythm with a defibrill.

[ __ ] It was just going to hell. like everything was going haywire. And she's 31 years old.

31 years old. Jesus. 31 years old. And the first indication that something was a miss came when the nurse cut away Gloria's t-shirt to try to apply the electro electrodes. And she found that the woman's body was like covered in what looked like an oily sheen, like an oily substance,

like you put like Vicks on your chest or something. Yeah. Like But one nurse described it as like an oil slick. Um, she said like you see on the ground of a gas station.

Oh, you know, like that kind of sheen, which is different. Yeah. I was like, so not like on your chest.

Yeah. It was then that the medical staff noticed a faint odor coming from Gloria's body. What they thought was probably coming from Gloria's body that some would later describe as fruity, while others said it smelled more like garlic.

It's always sickly sweet. to me how people can smell things differently or see things differently

or it's like just different notes of this odor hit someone different someone more like like someone's going to sit there and say well it was sickly sweet like garlic and it's like they get the note of garlic somebody else is like fruit

it's like when you see people do like a wine tasting and they're like I'm getting notes of sandalwood

yeah it's like and then you're drinking it and you're like I'm getting notes of uh grape

grape sour grape grape now by the time by the time this was all going on, Gloria was in full cardiac arrest. Full cardiac arrest. And there was no time to linger over this kind of odd discovery that they had all just come across.

Yeah. They're like, "We'll get put a pin in that." So medical staff continued the life-saving protocols and following the defibrillation, nurse Susan Kaine swabbed Gloria's arm and inserted the catheter, then attached the syringe to try to draw blood. Once the vial was filled, Cain handed it to Morin Welch. It's important that you're getting this um transfer of like the chain of custody essentially of everything so you can it'll be important later. Um so again, Susan Kane swabbed Gloria's arm, inserted the catheter,

took the syringe, drew the blood, and then she handed it to Moren Welch, the nurse, who immediately noticed that the blood smelled of ammonia.

Oh. Welch passed the vial off to medical resident Julie Gorchinski, who in addition to the unusual ammonia smell, noticed there appeared to be quote manila colored particles floating in the blood.

Oh, they were probably all like, "What the [ __ ] is going on?" Yeah. So, moments after the blood sample was collected, trauma unit one was plunged further into chaos, if you can even believe it.

I was like, "Yeah, how?" As he continued his attempt to stabilize Gloria Ramirez, Dr. Alberto Ooa heard someone shout, "Catch her. Catch her. Catch her." Okay. Turning to see what

is on a table. So turning to see where the [ __ ] that's coming from. Ooa just barely managed to catch Susan Kain.

Okay. Under the arms as her legs gave out and she dropped to the floor. She like lost consciousness.

Yeah. just like passed out. Okay. Kane had just been removed from the room on a gurnie when Gorchinsky began to feel nauseous. And these are all the people that were doing all the medical. Yeah.

Feeling as though she was going to be sick, she excused herself from the room and went to sit down at the nurses station. But she wasn't there for long before she too slumped to the floor and started exhibiting symptoms of apnea.

She was intermittently twitching and shaking. Oh my god. And then she would stop breathing for several seconds. What the [ __ ] Like picturing this scene from beginning to now even. And it's it's going to keep going.

It feels like something out of a television show. It doesn't You would see this happening in a show and be like, "Calm the [ __ ] down everybody." Like something out of like er like so dramatized, you know?

But even er you'd be like, "No." I know. Exactly. Like you'd be like, "Guys, this is not this doesn't make sense."

Yeah. This is No. No. It actually feels like something out of house. Yeah. You know when like crazy [ __ ] goes down in House and they're like and then he goes to the bottom

diseases. This is a house episode which I [ __ ] love that show. House is a great I haven't seen that in forever.

Great show. Yeah. This is cuz like we're going from and it's all so sudden. That's the thing. It's like all happening very quickly. Like

poor Gloria. It's just six weeks ago diagnosed and then immediately feels a little shortness of breath. passes out cold at her house, is rushed to the hospital, and right when she gets there, she goes into cardiac arrest. They're trying to do like mouthto mouth trying to defi defibrillate her heart back

and now everybody starts dropping like flies. Like it just won't stop. I don't I feel like I would run out of that hospital crying. I don't like that's a lot. Now, back in trauma unit one, Moren Welch,

another person who handled the vial, was the third person affected. She later said, "I remember hearing someone scream." And she said, "And then she passed out."

When Welch regained consciousness, she no longer had control over her arms and legs.

What? Yep. Yep. No. Moments after that, the entire emergency room at Riverside General was evacuated.

Yeah. I was waiting for that cuz like what the [ __ ] going on? And medical staff continued treating patients in the parking lot. Holy canoli. Well, and I quote, "Hazardous materials materials collectors dressed in protective clothing tested the air in the emergency room for dangerous gases." Cuz that would be my first thought. I'd be like, "This is a gas leak." Like something's up here

really bad is in this ventilation system and we're all [ __ ] breathing it in right now. So, in trauma unit one, Gloria's condition continued to worsen as all this was going on with her blood pressure dropping at an alarming rate. And despite their efforts to stabilize her, and this is just so tragic, amid all of this, Gloria Ramirez died at 8:50 p.m. from what an autopsy would later identify as kidney failure brought on by cervical cancer.

Oh wow. So she died as a result of that six weeks earlier and died. That is wild.

And it's like she got in there at 8:15 p.m. and was dead by 8:50. Wow. When as all around her people are just chaos,

but they're also at the same time their absolute best. Oh, it's awful. It's so tragic all the way around.

Oh, she's so young. And she you said she had two children. She's a mother. That's awful.

Now, once Dr. Ooaha had pronounced Gloria dead, her body was sealed into an airtight um bag and moved to an isolated room in the hospital because again, they don't know what's Yeah.

Among those who helped move the body was ER nurse Sally Baldderas, who had been in trauma unit one and helped to collect the blood sample from Gloria. Once she'd returned to the parking lot after moving Gloria to where she needed to be, Baldderas felt ill and then started wretching and complaining of quote a burning sensation on her skin.

Oh, and then she too needed emergency medical attention. This is like the fourth or fifth person at this point. In total, 23 of the 37 members of the emergency department who worked the night Ramirez was brought in complained of experiencing at least one symptom. Whoa. 23 of the 37 members of the emergency department. Is that like mass hysteria? Like Well, that's one of the that was one of the thoughts that people had,

but cuz I'm like that's an insane amount of people who weren't even in the room. This is also too though,

it's like people are experiencing real symptoms. Yeah. Like this, you know, they're not just like,

you know, Salem witch trial style like throwing themselves saying they see like monkeys on the wall and stuff like

they're experiencing like actual medical emergencies, which is wild. Yeah. Now, Baldderez, whose symptoms were initially described as little more than a headache, required a 10day hospital stay to treat the symptoms of apnea she began experiencing after exposure.

So, that's another person with apnea. Yeah. Susan Kaine also continued to experience apnea in the days following and was hospitalized at Corona Regional Medical Center until her uh symptoms subsided 3 days later.

I wonder if they renamed that place. I know. I was thinking that, too. I was like, woof. But also, holy [ __ ] Yeah, by far the most the most affected from the exposure to Gloria Ramirez was Dr. Julie Gorgjinsky who suffered a number of serious symptoms and even underwent surgery on her knees several weeks later to treat avascular necrosis

which is a condition where the bones that make up the joints begin d basically dying for lack of blood circulation.

Like necrosis what the [ __ ] Gorchinsk's other symptoms included hepatitis, pancreatitis, and quote chest seizing muscle spasms and breathing relapses that necessitated use of a respirator. Holy [ __ ] I just keep saying that, but like

she was only 33 experiencing all this and she couldn't draw a full breath for like months after exposure.

And so the what was the thing called that she was had the necrosis thing? avascular necrosis. So like her the nerves in her knees were dying off. The bones that make up the joints start dying from lack of blood circulation. Holy. And she's 30 something years old.

33. Like is she going to be able to use her legs? Mhm. Now among the more baffling elements of the case, at least in the earlier days of this whole investigation, because now they're like, "What the [ __ ] happened here?"

Yeah. was that the paramedics who transported Glory to Riverside General, who'd presumably been in close contact with her body, experienced none of the symptoms present among the ER staff.

I just pulled my head back and went to the side like, huh? This led investigators from Riverside County agencies and Cal OSHA to focus their attention on the hospital itself, believing that something was circulating in the hospital, possibly in the ventilation system. Because a lot of times like in the and I don't know obviously what happened here but like a lot of times they're like putting oxygen on you like that close that close.

I mean they were doing all the things she was in full Yeah. Like she was in very much stress on her way to cardiac arrest in the in the ambulance. So they were doing a hell of a lot.

And think about a trauma unit compared to the like the size of that compared to an ambulance back of an ambulance and a closedin probably not that well ventilated space. That's why they're thinking it has to do with the ventilation in the hospital.

Yeah. In fact, this wasn't the first time Riverside General had trouble with toxic fumes.

That's like not something you want on your Yelp reviews. You don't want like one that says toxic fumes, let alone multiple. One time having toxic fumes is like

too many. Yeah. You know? Yeah. In 1991, so only a couple of years before this, two employees required treatment for exposure to what was believed to be a toxic gas leak from a sterilizer. The [ __ ] Not a sterilizer leaking toxic fumes.

Just one year later, a federal inspection discovered that algae growing in the water in a water reservoir

was also causing issues. Babe, we got algae. We got algae. And a year after that, an inspection found the emergency room was permeated with sewer gas from a drain.

That can kill you. Sewer gas will [ __ ] kill you. Yep. Yep. Yep. Not sewer gas in the Don't you tell me there's more. Is there another comma there?

No. Okay. I mean, let alone Jesus Christ. We got enough commas. J. So, the hazmat team began by searching for a variety of toxins capable of causing the symptoms that the hospital staff were dealing with, particularly hydrogen sulfide, which is an insidious poison that smells like rotten eggs and at high concentrations can kill a person after one or two whiffs.

Insidious. Insidious. People who go into hazmat are just like straight up heroes.

Yeah. Like imagine like risking your [ __ ] like that. I know. and fast gene, a chemical commonly used in the creation of organic chemical compounds, but one that can also be used to create um a chemical weapon.

Oh, good. Yeah. Don't write that down. Uh it tears open capillaries in the lungs, drowning its victims in their own blood.

Oh, that is like chemical warfare. Chemical weapons are the scariest thing in the entire universe. sound made up.

No, they do. It sounds like something out of like a futuristic novel. I'm horrified right now.

So, where Hazmat team is looking for hydrogen sulfide, insidious poison that smells like rotten eggs and can kill you with a couple whips uh whips or faz gene, which is literally something that will tear open capillaries in your lungs and drown you in your blood.

Fortunately, neither was found at the hospital. Well, that's that's uh really fantastic news. So, in addition to the negative results from the tests looking for toxins in the air, the theory that those affected had been exposed to something circulating in the vents or other hospital symptoms, while certainly like a reasonable theory, was undermined by other obvious factors. For one, Dr. Ooa, who'd probably spent more time with Gloria Ramirez than anyone else,

was totally fine, never experienced any ill effects from exposure to Gloria's body.

Interesting. And that is like something you need to understand. He was closest, probably spent the most time and he did not experience anything from Gloria Ramirez's body.

Also, if something had been circulating in the vents or the water supply there,

it almost certainly would have affected more than just those working in the ER. It would have also affected patients and visitors

because it's not just like the only people in the ER are the people working there. There's a ton of civilians walking around.

Well, and even probably other areas of the hospital, too. It's not always just one building. I don't know, maybe it is in this case.

So, because of that, investigators returned to the only lead they had, which was Gloria Ramirez's body, might have had something going on,

which I understand needing to like check all the boxes. Oh, yeah. I don't think anybody faults them for having to look at that as an option. So, after several delays, the autopsy of Gloria Ramirez took place on February 25th, and from the start, it was clear that it was going to be anything but a typical autopsy.

Okay. Working in a specially sealed room, the 90-minute autopsy was conducted by a team of four pathologists, all dressed in airtight toxinproof safety suits.

How long does a typical autopsy take? Honestly, it can take it varies. That's the thing. 90 minutes is like sure.

Like it really depends on like so many factors in an autopsy. If it's a complete autopsy, if it's a keep, if it's a return, like keep the organs for research or you're returning them to the body. Uh if it's if it includes the the head, like if it's a neuro case, if they want, you know, the spinal cord taken out, if they want, you know, uh bone marrow taken, say they want

so many things, for lack of a better term, like the works. How long does that take?

That could take hours. Okay, so this one isn't really insanely long. This is this is pretty this is a pretty decent one I would say. Like this is and again somebody very skilled and capable can probably do a complete one in in less time than I probably could.

And like when you were performing them how many people were working at the same time is four people working on the same body kind of crazy.

Pathologists is a lot of pathologists to have in the room but I understand why they did it in this case because if it's a I've never worked with four pathologists on an autopsy. How many would you typically

Usually I was only alongside one and if it was a neuro case maybe two because it was like a neuropathologist with us

and is like the doctor, right? Like they're like the medical examiner. They're the the specialists.

I see. Um so four pathologists like that's a lot. Yeah. Unless it's like they unless they you know maybe confuse four pathologists with a couple of texts too, but I could see why they would have four pathologists here cuz what the [ __ ] going on, you know? Like that.

But also at the same time, I'm like, if this is coming from Gloria's body, which it sounds like it's probably not, uh, for pathologist, like you want to take all those people out.

I know. You want to take out all those pathologist? Well, they're wearing their safety suits. They're wearing the PE required, I guess. So, that's good. They're wearing like like

airtight toxinproof safety suits. Kind of like what you wore during during CO. Well, I was just going to say during CO, we wore those.

I remember seeing you in your full garb. It's crazy. And it sucks. like you're sweat very necessary won't ever knock it but damn you sweat in those you sweat and it's hard to do things and it's like you don't get to be as precise as you want to be cuz you're in this really bulky thing and

we had like special like bubbles like plastic bubbles that would go over the person's head so you had to like reach into the bubble to do the the brain removal and it was not great.

Wow. Yeah. CO was a [ __ ] time for for uh autopsies. It's a [ __ ] time for autopsies. And you're also just a wild [ __ ]

This is the moral wild [ __ ] You're like, we'd have to reach into the bubble to do the brain. Like she's just like, I'll take a medium iced regular. Like, oh, okay. Totally. It was crazy.

Damn. I know. Like I said, you're a wild bridge. It's pretty standard otherwise, but like you're not.

You had a bubble in some crazy suit and it's harder. Uh, but yeah. So although the situation that occurred in the year was highly unusual, it was in fact not the first time it had happened also. Um so like everybody going down like that. Well, several years earlier, emergency room workers in Perth, Australia were kind of similarly affected to a less dramatic extent, I will say. Uh during the examination of a man who had uh killed himself by ingesting weevil poison.

Oh [ __ ] Yeah. With that in mind, so there there was some kind of precedent for this. I won't say it's a direct

precedent, but there is some kind of precedent. Yeah, with that in mind, the pathologists expected to find something in Gloria Ramirez's body that could wreak similar havoc, like an organo phosphate pest pesticide, but neither the search of her apartment or the autopsy turned up any chemicals like that.

Okay. Also, although she had been diagnosed with the advanced stage cancer only recently, she hadn't started chemotherapy and had only been taking copazine, a drug used to control nausea.

Okay. So, she wasn't even on any like the crazy like chemo drugs, you know what I mean?

Yeah. Yeah. As the evidence collected during the autopsy was being analyzed, Gloria's body was put back into airtight storage and county officials continued the investigation. The family, meanwhile, was left in kind of a limbo state, which must have been really hard. They still had no explanation for what the [ __ ] had happened.

And with the investigation still open, they couldn't bury Gloria and and start the grieving process.

That was tough. And I imagine that like somebody was like close by when all the chaos was happening in the ER. And that must have been really traumatic.

That must have been really traumatic. Now, by midappril, the Ramirez family hired an attorney and filed a request for a court order that would allow for an independent pathologist to conduct another autopsy. Good for them.

Also, others in the Riverside community started to wonder whether the county's refusal to release their findings or update the public was perhaps an indication of a cover up.

That was them wondering that, saying that's what it was. I could see why people would be curious like that. Uh, Robert Schwarz, an environmental attorney, told the LA Times, "The county is destroying the single most important piece of evidence. They're destroying Gloria Ramirez's remains by having delayed things this long." Tom Dantis, a representative from Riverside County, responded to the public pressure and said, "This investigation isn't as simple as testing a hypothesis by checking for the presence of a particular chemical. The testing that is being performed is designed to rule out the thousands of possible chemical compounds and narrow the focus of the investigation. You can kind of see both sides here.

Yeah, you really can. But he and but he couldn't provide any additional information at that time.

But it's also like if you don't have the answer, what do you have to say? Yeah. Now, while the county struggled under increasing pressure from the public, the evidence and samples collected from the autopsy were sent to the forensic science center at the Lawrence Liverour National Laboratory, which is a former nuclear weapons production and testings lab that was transformed and rebranded in the early 90s to focus on, you know, areas of natural sciences.

Okay. The technicians at the forensic science center had expected to find the culprit in gases contained in the headsp space of the containers, if not in the liver itself. But all they found was nitrogen, oxygen, carbon dioxide, and argon. Normal constituents of air.

Yeah. Just nothing out of the ordinary. Right. Among the mysteries the technicians at the lab were able to solve though was the ammonia smell that many of the emergency room personnel noticed emanating from Gloria's body and the blood that was taken.

According to Brian Anderson, a director at the forensic science center, the odor was most likely caused by Gloria's body breaking down that anti-nausea medication that she was taking at the time.

Oh, okay. That's interesting. That is interesting. Ultimately, the team at the center was able to identify and explain many of the unusual compounds found in the blood and tissue samples submitted by the county. In fact, the only thing Anderson and his team couldn't explain was the heavy presence of dimethyl sulfone, which is a naturally occurring chemical compound found in everything from plant and marine life to food and beauty products. Oh, okay. As far as Anderson knew, this compound was a relatively harmless chemical, and it really couldn't have caused the damaging effects that people in the ER were suffering from that night. So, he returned to the Riverside Coroner's office and reported his findings, confirming that no toxins were found in Gloria Ramirez's body. So, anyone calling her the toxic woman is [ __ ] stupid.

It's not real. Exactly. So the technicians at the forensic science center had done as thorough an analysis as possible in 1994. So Anderson's findings were more or less the final word. Despite having no explanations for what had happened at Riverside General, county officials were confident there was no existing threat at the hospital. And the strange case of Gloria Ramirez was effectively clo closed, at least as far as the county was concerned.

Okay. The coroner's office released the body to the family in late April. And Gloria Ramirez was buried at uh Olivewood Cemetery in Riverside on April 27th, 1994,

almost two full months after she passed away. Like that's tough on that family. So, if Riverside County officials had hoped that releasing Gloria's body would put an end to the chaos and the mystery surrounding this case, they were definitely disappointed in the weeks after that.

Yeah, the family still pressed the coroner's office for answers, rightfully so. That and they were unfortunately never going to really get any. And in August, Dr. Gorchinsky filed a $6 million lawsuit against Riverside General Hospital, alleging that conditions at the hospital and failure of safety protocols had left her with more than one debilitating condition preventing her from working. And she was a 33year-old doctor,

right? According to her lawyer, Russell Cuzman, the suit was filed in part to compel the hospital and the county to release whatever information they had related to the case. He said later to reporters, "Clearly, she's the victim of some kind of toxic poisoning. The question is where did it come from and who is responsible?" Now, officials from the county and Riverside Hospital immediately took a defensive position, contracted contacting the California Department of Health and Human Services to undertake a study to determine the cause of the symptoms. So, they were like, "We're going to try to figure this out." After reviewing the medical information from most of those affected by it that night and interviewing 34 of the staff members working at the hospital that evening, the DHS concluded the symptoms experienced by those who came in contact with Gloria was a case of mass psychoggenic illness, a situation in

which symptoms of physical illness are experienced by large groups of people for psychological reasons.

Right. That's kind of what I was thinking. Exactly. Now, although the study allowed for the possibility that a small number of those affected, particularly those who came in close contact with Gloria Ramirez's body, were quote exposed to a poisonous substance, they did not know the origin of the poison. It's important to note that mass psychoggenic illness tends to be applied with bias, though, and is ascribed far more often to women than it is to men.

Um, and a lot of women went down. That's kind of the case here. Yeah. Now, so, so maybe it wasn't necessarily that is what you're kind of implying.

Nobody. Yeah. Nobody really knows here. So, as one would expect, the county's official explanation of mass psychoggenic illness was uh poorly received.

I bet, especially by those directly affected. When Riverside ER nurse Moren Welch read the report, she went to the Forensic Science Center and implored Anderson to take a second look at the case cuz she was like, "This is bullshit." Yeah. And I mean, you can kind of understand why people thought that just because this is like such an insane case.

Yeah, of course. But the people who experienced it are pissed. Exactly what I was just going to say. Now, upon review, it was discovered that what was initially identified as dimethyl sulfone, remember the like the thing that wouldn't have caused issues in a lot of cosmetics and everything. Yeah.

Was in fact dimethyl suloxide or DMSO. The only difference between those two chemicals is that DMSO has one oxygen atom, not two. So that changes a compound completely.

Yeah. Oh god, not physics. Let's talk about it. Chemistry. Lol. I was like, no, it's not. In fact,

I was like I was like chemistry. I was bad at both. Fortunately, it's not physic. But unfortunately, it is chemistry.

Organic chemistry, in fact. Boo. So since the 1960s, DMSO has been sold as a gel solvent used in industrial cleaning products.

What? But it's also used by some as a kind of folk remedy for pain relief and its occasional use in the treatment of interstatial cyitis, excuse me, a condition causing painful urinary tract lesions in women.

Ouch. The presence of DMSO would explain the oily sheen discovered on Gloria Ramirez's body, assuming that she may have used it for pain relief,

like a topical pain relief, right? Because she's This would also This would also explain the aroma of garlic described by several of the workers present in the room with Ramirez because these are both hallmarks of this product.

Oh wow. I mean, I love the smell of garlic. I do too. But I don't love a toxic thing.

The presence of DMSO alone didn't explain the symptoms supposedly caused by exposure to Gloria though. Okay, that alone.

It was only when Anderson checked the chemical index text to review DMSO that he noticed an adjacent entry for a different chemical that seemed the most likely explanation for what had caused the medical mystery surrounding the death of Gloria Ramirez.

Okay. Dimethyl sulfate. We have we there's so many dimethyls. There is in most cases dimethyl sulfate is used in small quantities in the manufacturing. You see I'm like you're nerding out so hard over there.

I have my finger up. She's like in most cases with her little pointer finger. I'm like hey I just wanted to point out I have I could see your face immediately when my finger went up. I was like think it's so funny. So in most cases, figure it up again. Dimethyl sulfate is used in small quantities in the manufacturing of dyes, perfumes, and certain drugs. But the chemical has an unpleasant history as one of the main components of this thing called nerve gas used in chemical warfare.

Not not more chemical warfare, like dyes, perfumes, certain drugs. Oh, also nerve gas.

Nerve gas. I'm thinking that whole thing that the after experience or kind of legit,

huh? Or Yeah. Uh kind of very unpleasant history for sure. In vapor form, dimethyl sulfate can quote kill the cells in exposed tissues such as the eyes, mouth, and lungs.

Yeah. When absorbed into the body, dimethyl sulfate causes convulsions, delirium, paralysis, coma, and delayed damage to the kidneys, liver, and heart.

Did somebody have kidney failure? Um uh Gloria did. Oh, Gloria did. Okay. Given its uses and the knowledge and skill required to handle it, no one suspected dimethyl sulfate in the case of Gloria Ramirez cuz that's like [ __ ] chemical warfare. Like no. After all, why would like a mother of two, housewife, just normal everyday human being? Why would she have come in contact with such a volatile chemical?

Yeah. Like where would she have come in contact with that? I don't know. But just as dimethyl sulfone can be transformed into dimethyl uh the DMSO yes compound with the addition of just one oxygen molecule doesn't take a lot to transform it. Dimethyl sulfate can be created by adding one more oxygen model molecule to DMSO. Oh,

so it's very it's so delicate. Yeah. And it transforms a fairly innocuous chemical into a literal toxic gas capable of killing a person

like that. That's so scary. One extra oxygen molecule. That reminds me of an uh episode of Below Deck where I forget which

I'm very interested to see. No, it's actually funny. I forget which Chief Stew it was and which like lower stew it was, but she kept mixing cleaning products that they were telling her not to mix.

Oh, [ __ ] no. She was like, "You're literally going to create mustard gas and blow the boat up and it's so easy to do."

Yeah. They were like, and they told her a couple times and finally she had to go to the captain. She was like, "Ah, hey."

Yeah. It's like, "Sorry, you have to be," and I'm telling you right now, be so careful with that [ __ ]

When you are cleaning, do not mix [ __ ] Have a open window. It's so easy for people to get so sick from that [ __ ] And I don't want any of you getting sick, so be careful.

No, we love you. Just use um Oh, [ __ ] I'm trying to think of the lady on the commercials. I love her.

What's the What's the floral start with P? I love that woman on the commercials.

Palm Olive. No, Pinesaw. Pineaw. I love pineaw. I was thinking pine saw, but I said palm olive.

No, that's actually funny because my brain was doing the same thing. I smell pines while I said palm olive.

[ __ ] I love pineaw. I mix it with warm water. Do you think that's okay? That's fine. Okay.

Yeah, you're okay there. All right, cool. Um, so yeah, be careful everybody. But because they had taken the case pro bono,

which is pretty great, Anderson and his team had to work nights and weekends over an extended period of time before they finally arrived at the best possible explanation for what the [ __ ] had happened at Riverside General.

Yeah. The team theorized that like many cancer patients, Gloria Ramirez had turned to DMSO, the one that wasn't okay. Yeah. To help manage her cancer related pain, which would account for the oily sheen on her skin.

And you said that was okay. That was okay. When the paramedics placed the oxygen mask on her in the ambulance,

it added a Gloria's bloodstream was flooded with oxygen. Oh. creating the highly unusual set of [ __ ] circumstances required to transform the DMSO into dimethyl sulfate.

Holy blew my [ __ ] mind when I heard that. No, my mind is Wow. Because they did exactly what they were supposed to do. They put oxygen on her cuz she wasn't breathing. They did nothing wrong. Yeah, cuz they didn't how would they

would have no idea that that is not a common question that you have to ask someone like, "Do you have DMSO on you?" And also, she wasn't able to really respond to a lot anyways.

Yeah. So, they didn't do anything wrong. This was not them being like negligent.

No. But it's just a wildly unusual and freak [ __ ] set of circumstanced as many people as it did because it's Did it like spread through the How does that work actually? Well, her like so many of the ER staff went down because her her blood was now filled with toxic gas essentially because her bloodstream was now flooded with oxygen

and that added the extra oxygen molecule to DMSO to turn it into that essential nerve death. So like even holding a vial of her blood, it could kind of like go through the vial.

Well, it it's going to be exposed to the air somehow because it's going to be transferred into the vial. So there is going to be some kind of

I see you know and she's even just from that little pin prick to insert the catheter to put the syringe in.

It went into the air exposure to the air like that it's vapor essentially like it can travel

but I it just blew my [ __ ] mind shocking. What are the goddamn odds of this? I would say they're very um insane.

Yeah. So the chemical reaction well pushed. They're they're I was like in my head I would just say they're low and then I was like yeah no they're not high but I questioned myself if they are. I was like they're crazy.

So the chemical reaction would also explain the presence of the white or off-white like manila is what they described crystals observed in the blood samples taken in the ER. When the blood sample was drawn, small amounts of the lethal gas, like I said, leaked from the syringe, which explains why those closest in proximity, Kain, Welch, and Gorchinsky were the most affected. Oh, cuz they all had and as they went out further, people experienced considerably less symptoms of exposure.

So, it would be the same as chemical warfare. This is horrible, but incredibly fascinating. And just what the [ __ ] are the odds that all this would happen? It's just like it really is wild.

It really is an episode of [ __ ] House. I'm like, has House done an episode on this?

I'm about to Google it. I'll let you know. It would be impossible for Anderson and his team to recreate the exact circumstances necessary to like concretely prove this theory. So, when they submitted the report to the coroner in the case, it was only so they could get the county's feedback. Nevertheless, the county the Riverside County coroner's office accepted the Forensic Science C Center's explanation because it makes so much [ __ ] sense and released the report as the final word on the matter. Although some people were skeptical of the results, pointing out that a reaction like that would have required an enormous amount of DMSO, Oregon State toxicologist Frank Dos pointed out in that stage of fighting for her life, Ramirez may have really overloaded on it.

Yeah. creating the precise set of circumstances under which the chain reaction could occur. And I fully believe that. I think this is just a freak

set of circumstances that absolutely no one is at fault for. Totally. I mean, you think of like the products that are available that you don't realize how like dangerous they can be. I just I'm 29 years old. I just found out that you can't put Vicks under your nose overnight.

Yeah. That's honestly idea like that is something we used to do when we were like younger. Yeah. And and it's these home remedy things,

but when you start looking into them, you realize how dangerous this [ __ ] can be.

Yeah. I mean, I'm so glad I'm related to you because you're so sciency. I would have no idea.

It's scary. And even things like um like dry shampoo, aerosol dry shampoo. I know

the fact that that's been connected to so much cancer and different like stuff.

It's so scary. You're better off with like the really natural like pump powder ones,

but you also have to be careful of those. So like be really careful when you're picking this [ __ ] cuz you just don't want to put yourself in that position you know.

Now for the last you know over 25 years Gloria Ramirez has been called the toxic lady. Someone whose existence was only significant in death essentially

because of like what people said about her. The curiosity of course is only natural. I mean

it's a fascinating like I just said the circumstances of her death are bizarre. They're incredibly complex, easily lending themselves to fantastical interpretations of it. But from the moment she died, Gloria's family had to face a seemingly endless stream of reporters, media personalities, and headlines that accused Gloria, who was not here to defend herself, of everything from PCP addiction to being an alien. I'm sorry. Are you [ __ ] kidding me?

Yeah. If you're rolling up to somebody's house as a reporter, like listen, I get it. Reporters are a thing. If you're rolling up to somebody's house who has just lost their family member and asking if they're a [ __ ] alien, you

go [ __ ] yourself. Re-evaluate your [ __ ] life choices. Re-evaluate your entire existence as a human. Are you joking? And PCP addiction. Like, what?

Where do we even get that from? It's just grasping at sensational headlines. That's all it is.

So shitty. It's outrageous. I mean, the speculation was ridiculous and it obscured her humanity.

Uh, truly, Gloria Ramirez was a single mother of two young children. She was described as quote, "A simple homemaker." According to Reverend Brian Taylor, who spoke at her graveside,

she was also a sister, a girlfriend, and a member of the community whose life was tragically cut short very quickly by cancer.

Yeah. Like so many of us, her life was just ordinary. Hard like just a just a life.

Yeah. Hardly befitting the science fiction narrative that she is so often involuntarily inserted into.

Yeah. When Gloria was finally laid to rest on April 27th, more than two months after her death, it was under the invasive eye of journalists, photographers, a whole host of people who were shouting questions at the grieving family

at the funeral, setting a disrespectful and thoughtless tone that honestly permeated her legacy for more than two decades at this point.

Yeah. Get the [ __ ] away from people's gravesides unless you're related or people like get out of here. In a brief article for the Los Angeles Times, Peter King's summation of the funeral is something that we should probably all keep in mind today, they wrote, "Speaking well of the dead, allowing them a final dignity is a basic human courtesy. Gloria Ramirez just got cheated." Yeah, she absolutely did. And it's so true because I fully believe the theory that the forensic science center came up with anderson and his team.

It makes so much sense just from a scientific freak set of circumstances that can happen but obviously don't happen often.

Yeah. No, right. And no one is at fault. It was no one was doing anything that they shouldn't have been doing.

No. Gloria was in pain. She was doing what she was probably she might have been who knows maybe she was grown up with that remedy. You know what I mean? Like was just like [ __ ] Vicks under my nose.

Yeah. Like she was just doing what she had to do to get relief which any of us none of us who have not experienced cancer like personally

can speak to because I can't imagine that. No. And the paramedics were just doing their job getting oxygen to her brain and her lungs when she was losing it rapidly.

Right. doing their job and the ER staff was doing their job and it's like and it just nobody did anything wrong. Every it just was a [ __ ] set of circumstances that happened to fall into an even shittier one.

Yeah. 100%. But Gloria Ramirez is not the toxic lady. No, she's a like you just said, she was like a family member of many people and a friend,

a friend, a sister, a girlfriend, a community member, and somebody who got sick in a [ __ ] set of circumstances happened.

Yeah, that's it. But it's Let's give people dignity. Yeah, it's more fascinating what happened to make all of that occur than it is to sit here and call her the toxic woman and say that it was something

ask if she alen or like things like something naturally occurring in her body or something like that. Like it's just [ __ ] organic chemistry really.

Gone arai. Wow. But that's the tale of Gloria Ramirez and I hope her family has gotten some kind of relief over the the past couple of decades here.

Yeah. Because I would hope so. And here we are to set the record straight. She's not a toxic woman.

She's not a toxic woman. Get the [ __ ] out. She's Gloria Ramirez. That really was a fascinating case that had heard of it like but I did not know everything that went into that.

Yeah. I had only heard her called toxic lady. Me too. So yeah. Wow. All right. Well, thanks for listening. We hope you keep listening and we hope you keep it weird. I'm not so that you're rolling up to people's houses or their grave sites asking stupid questions. I had to sing during the episode and here it is. Yeah. Don't do that. Don't do that. I'll punch you. Don't do that. I won't actually punch you, but I'll like metaphorically punch you.

Yeah.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Episode 707: The Tragic Death of Gloria Ramirez"?

Ash (Host), Elena (Host).

What is "Episode 707: The Tragic Death of Gloria Ramirez" about?

The discussion centers around the tragic death of Gloria Ramirez, referred to as the "Toxic Lady," who became the focus of intrigue and speculation due to the mysterious circumstances surrounding her passing and the subsequent health issues experienced by medical personnel. The hosts engage in light-hearted banter and personal anecdotes while addressing the bizarre and puzzling elements of this…

What is mentioned in this Morbid | Podcast episode?

25 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Gloria Ramirez, Dimethyl Sulfate, Riverside General Hospital, DMSO, Dr. Julie Gorchinski, Brian Anderson. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Episode 707: The Tragic Death of Gloria Ramirez"?

The episode runs 55 min; the transcript is about 9,953 words in 267 timestamped sections.

More from Morbid | Podcast

About this transcript: the episode's spoken words as captioned on YouTube, split into timestamped sections. Reclip.Me locates every person, work and idea in the text, keeps the time it is first named, and quotes the words around it verbatim. Last updated January 24, 2026.