Top Democrat SLAMS Trump Over Embarrassment Abroad and ICE

What this episode is about

Virginia Senator Mark Warner criticizes Donald Trump's recent foreign policy approach, particularly at the World Economic Forum in Davos, where Trump both doubled down on his controversial interest in Greenland and later attempted to backtrack. Warner highlights the inconsistency and lack of historical understanding in Trump’s statements about U.S. military presence in Greenland and the implications of his proposed "infinite" deal.

Key takeaways

• Trump's 'infinite' deal for Greenland reveals a leadership style more improvisational than strategic.
• Canada's pivot toward China underscores a seismic shift; trust in US allies has eroded under Trump's tenure.
• With only two mines, Greenland's mineral riches remain a mirage, not a territory Trump can claim.
• Trump's colonial obsession risks alienating allies; NATO's historic unity hangs by a thread.
• A Canadian PM seeking trade deals with China reflects a loss of American reliability; the implications are dire.

Who speaks in this episode?

• John (Guest) · 10 min speaking
• Mark Warner (Guest) · 15 min speaking

What is discussed, and when

1. 0:00 – 5:00: William McKinley
2. 10:00 – 15:00: Cook Unity, Donald C. Murphy, Patty Murray
3. 15:00 – 20:00: Donald C. Murphy

Notable quotes from "Top Democrat SLAMS Trump Over Embarrassment Abroad and ICE"

• Now has turned into you know TBD because I'm trying to get some of the details on what he's saying. The thing I know is the Danes were more than willing to say you want to do…

  about Donald Trump · at 2:11

• No idea. I think that the president's got an obsession about trying to add territory. We all know he thinks, William McKinley was the most significant president because he…

  about William McKinley · at 3:12

• It's it's not great. Pods of America is brought to you by Cook Unity. I have been using Cook Unity forever, for years, long before they ever sponsored this podcast. It is fantastic. most.

  about Cook Unity · at 11:18

• Uniforms, body cameras, does not remove the mask, clear a compromise. Another one of your colleagues, Chris Murphy, criticized the bill, saying it puts no meaningful constraints on the growing lawlessness of ICE. Where are you on this?

  about Donald C. Murphy · at 14:51

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

• Donald Trump — Person · Referenced political figure (U.S. President in discussion) · 2 mentions
  Central subject of critique regarding Greenland threats, alliance damage, and politicization of intelligence and institutions.
• Donald C. Murphy — Person · Referenced policymaker (Senator) offering intra-party critique · 2 mentions · first at 14:55
  Mentioned as criticizing the DHS funding deal for failing to constrain ICE, framing a disagreement about strategy and leverage.
• Patty Murray — Person · Referenced policymaker (Senator) in domestic policy segment · 1 mention · first at 14:34
  Cited as negotiating a bipartisan DHS funding deal that becomes the basis for debate about ICE constraints and Democratic leverage.
  So I want to turn to what's happening domestically. Your colleague in the Senate Patty Murray negotiated a bipartisan funding deal for the Department of Homeland Security. It does not increase the agency's overall.
• William McKinley — Person · Historical reference · 1 mention · first at 3:19
  Invoked as an example of U.S. territorial expansion to explain/criticize Trump's perceived obsession with adding territory.

Sponsors

• Cook Unity — Product · Sponsor · 1 mention · first at 11:18
  Sponsor of the podcast, providing chef-designed meals delivered to customers.

Full transcript with timestamps

0:00 Joining me in studio, vice chair of the intelligence committee, Virginia Senator Mark Warner. Good to see you,

0:05 John. Great to see you. So, let's start uh with what's happening in Davos. Trump uh had as soon as as recently as yesterday doubled down on his threats to Greenland. Then uh he very uh ostentatiously backed off in his speech uh at at Davos. uh he said that uh he will not use force while adding you can say yes and we will be very appreciative or you can say no and we will remember and then we get word of

0:32 that sounds very presidential yes of course well it's we can I want to ask you about the Mark carney because it was man the comparison between a kind of leader trying to make a argument about his interests and his nation's values and then our president getting up there and doing his kind of mad king improv but uh he he then said we got a deal and here was Trump when he has asked about it. Does

0:53 it still include you? Does it still include Does it still include the United States having ownership of Greenland like you've said you wanted?

0:59 Uh, it's a long-term deal. It's the ultimate long-term deal and I think it it puts everybody in a really good position, especially as it pertains to security and minerals and everything else.

1:14 How long How long would the deal be, Mr. President? Uh, infinite. So what's your what's your take on the infinite deal?

1:23 My take is, you know, how long is that deal going to last? Will it change by tomorrow? The thing I think I know Trump doesn't know the history much, but America used to have 17 military bases in Greenland. We're down to one. Not because the DNE said get out, but because we decided to get out. And the one base we got, we got a couple hundred Americans and about twice as many Danes. So we've had this partnership with that country for you way before World War II. Matter of fact, I I talked to the bipartisan centers, you know, Marcowski, Telus, Coons who were there. They were really understandably upset. The Danes put more soldiers in our coalitions in Afghanistan and Iraq. They had more folks killed per capita than we did. And then this kind of out of the blue which started we thought kind of as a joke and now has turned into um you know TBD because I'm trying to get some of the details on what he's saying. The thing I

2:21 know is the Danes were more than willing to say you want to do have more bases absolutely. You want to do mineral deals? Absolutely. There's only two mines working right now in Greenland. You know, the truth is the only national security threat to Greenland right now, it's not China or Russia. It's the United States of America,

2:39 right? Is I mean, and part of the re the reason we don't have whatever the mineral rights he's talking about the B problem isn't that the Danes aren't allowing it. The problem is it's cult.

2:48 It's really hard to do mines, even with the ice flows melting in this harsh a territory. There are a reason that there's only two mines in in Greenland. That was reported to me. What was this all about? Right,

3:04 John? You know that's I wish I could tell you. It's part of the gang of eight. We're supposed to get the most classified stuff. I wish I could tell you here was the logical reason. I had no idea. Um I think that the president's got an obsession about trying to add territory. We all know he thinks, you know, William McKinley was the most significant president because he added Cuba and the Philippines that, you know, those kind of colonial activities didn't fully work out long term that well. Um, but the idea that we took the most successful alliance in America's history NATO yeah

3:36 and got it this close and who knows whether it still is going to continue to exist because you can't continue to undermine trust and think our friends around the world are going to continue to salute and follow us as leaders. And I we talked offline, I'm sure we can get to this. You know, the situation with Canada just blows me away right now. our closest ally. You I'm biased. My mom's family uh came from Ontario. But the idea that the Canadian prime minister is saying to the crowd at Davos, you we can't rely on America anymore. And it's not just words. He went to China last week and cut a trade deal saying China's more dependable.

4:16 That does not help America. It doesn't make us safer. Doesn't make us richer. It is bad policy, bad politics all across the board. So yeah, the the speech by Carney is remarkable uh in part because as you say, we're watching someone describe a world in which they which c Canada sees themselves as between us and China as opposed to with us in an alliance against uh China economically at the very least.

4:42 What does the speech signal to you about the damage being done? He's laying out a worldview, a future in which China and other, sorry, with Canada and other countries have to kind of ally strategically when they can't trust the US. What do those of us who are pro-America, anti-Trump, like what do we say to that?

5:02 Well, I remember when Trump 2 came in, you know, and sitting from the position on the intelligence committee, I thought, could you imagine? You're like you're a senior spy at the CIA and you're told, "Hey, we got a new president. He's back. Here's the new plan. Russia is our friend and Canada's the enemy. It was a a bad joke then.

5:21 Yeah. But we're a year later and the Canadian prime minister, who I I know socially a little bit, a very serious guy, very pro-American. His kids go to American schools, you know, was head of the Bank of Canada, head of the Bank of England. This guy's got some real chops, but has made the the choice for his country, which I think is a legitimate choice that you can't count on the United States of America. And when you have when our hockey teams play in Canada now and people boo the national anthem, you can't put that genie back in the bottle even when we have a new president. This is long-term damage to how we are viewed, not just in Canada, but around the world,

6:01 right? Right. I mean there look we could have you could argue that the first Trump term was an aberration and and in many ways he was more contained than he is now. So so yeah the genie can't go back in the bottle but there will be a postTrump era when we as hope to lead uh we being Americans we being those that believe in democracy and and in sort of updating but keeping these international institutions. What is our story about what comes next? like how do we what what do we say to our allies when they feel like they can't rely on us?

6:32 I think the first term every country's had aberrations but the fact that he's back and more unhinged I mean first term Trump I didn't agree with him but you know I tell you I worked well with Minutuchin who was his treasury secretary other folks this crowd around him this time with very few exceptions are are just out there and I I think about how I've felt the last 10 days or so I felt embarrassed for our country. Yeah.

6:56 I mean, the idea that Trump didn't get the fact that the world is laughing at him when the Venezuelan opposition leader, Machado, tried to give Trump her Nobel Prize. And he took it kind of like thought it was the real deal. Didn't realize people were laughing. And then a few days later, he says the crazy stuff in print of saying, "Yeah, one of the reasons why I'm thinking about Greenland, I don't have to be a peace guy anymore, is because Norway, you didn't give me the Nobel Prize." Even though Norway as a government doesn't give out the Nobel Prize. So this this idea of how we are viewed in an you Americans have always been a maybe a little bit goofy but I think the rest of the world kind of thought you're we can count on you to do the right thing at the end of the day.

7:45 That lack of being able to count on us going forward. I don't know how we fully recover. And the question we get back home here and abroad is, you know, what happened to a traditional center-right Republican party and why are there so few voices that are willing to stand up against this guy?

8:06 Yeah. Does it Yeah. the the part of the the Carney speech was interesting too in which it was it's it's only at the twilight of this era that you have a Canadian leader saying look the American he h he h he h he h he h he h he h he h he h he hijgemany uh had a lot of advantages caused brought a lot of stability but it wasn't enforced evenly right there was advantages to being America and the rules didn't apply fairly it's it's interesting to hear our Canadian leaders say that so plainly and now the the the turning of this you know the dial of uh rules applying turning too far towards kind of it becoming a cudgel and all of a sudden you have this sort of dissolution. Uh how do we what do you have any thoughts about what comes after like what is the world order we could help rebuild?

8:51 Well, you know clearly the trade a little bit for a lot of our countries around the world was

8:56 we're going to spend a lot more money on defense and we're going to help protect you. Mhm.

9:00 You're going to go along with us eight times out of 10 on what our foreign policy goals are. You're going to

9:07 except the French. It was six. Except for the French, you know, maybe six. Six at the best. You know, um

9:12 Dal may have been right in the 60s. Uh we also said, okay, we get to have the reserve currency and that economic value to us was huge. The fact that you've got this breakup of the trust relationship coupled with a frontal assault on the independence of the Federal Reserve is a double whammy that um I'm not sure folks have fully thought through. And and if you get way out there, you can add and if suddenly I'm up to my eyeballs on all this crypto stuff at this point trying to figure out what the rules ought to be there. If you are suddenly creating new methodologies of financial systems where it's not as dollar dependent, this could be a really not a great story for our country. And um we got some work to do. We got some we got a and I don't I'm not sure folks fully appreciate how much damage has been done now on the on the level sitting in my chair with the intelligence relationships and the

10:16 military rel you know those are still really good but I've had countries that are saying some of our closest

10:24 who have said we can't share with the intelligence our intelligence anymore with the Americans we're not sure we're going to keep it safe you know the nor I mean not uh the Dutch who really punch above their their weight in the intelligence class. They said it in the Dutch media that we can't trust um America to keep our intelligence safe. That's one more part of our blocks. Our our our strengths were we got the biggest military. We also had the best intelligence. We had the best technology. They did think even if our system was slow that they you got a rule of law. If that's all under assault, and it is, um, where this leads to is a level of uncharted territory. And you look at part the reaction to Carney's speech and I know Davos are all the elites, but when the rest of the world of elites and including most of the American business community that's there gave him a standing ovation, we ought to take a pause.

11:18 It's uh, it's not great. Pods of America is brought to you by Cook Unity. I have been using Cook Unity forever, for years, long before they ever sponsored this podcast. It is fantastic. Uh most of my meals are from Cook Unity. They deliver chef designed meals that balance real flavor, nutrition, and convenience with no cooking or planning required. They also let you choose what works for you with collections like protein forward, better for sleep, mood boosting, and fiber maxing. Plus, it's awesome knowing their roster of all-star chefs include Food Network alums, James Beard Award winners, and acclaimed restaurant tours who balance bold flavors and nutrition and small batch meals delivered fresh. not frozen.

11:53 Taste, comfort, and craftsmanship in every bite from the award-winning chefs behind CookUnity. Go to cookunity.com/crooked or use codec crooked to get 50% off your first order. That's 50% off your first order at cookunity.com/crooked or use the code crooked. The on the intelligence front, I was thinking about what this must mean. If United States inside of this Greenland debate has been the adversary, what does that do for intelligence sharing with our sort of partners in the UK and in Europe? like you're saying it's still holding strong, but around this issue, we were we were on the other side.

12:25 We were on the other side and and the fact that the Brits, the Norwegians, the French, obviously the Danes were putting troops there so that if Trump had actually carried out as threat, are we really going to fire on British troops? The implication,

12:39 we've done it a couple times before. Well, yeah, it goes back a way. It's actually some of our best stuff.

12:43 Yeah. 250 years ago and then 1812, we had that little bother. But America classic, really.

12:47 But since that time, we've had a pretty good deal with that. Yeah. No, listen. I and I want to say I oppose war with Britain and if that's not I just want to be on

12:54 that's a fairly radical statement you know and although as you said earlier the French

12:59 yeah listen well I you know it's sort of it's it's lesser to evil situation but the I want to ask you about Marco Rubio in just one thing

13:08 the thing that that worries me about the intel stuff is when when a country starts to corrupt its intelligence product because you want the intel to meet the policy goal.

13:21 You know, Iraq was obviously the shiny example. But when this crowd fires the head of the Defense Intelligence Agency, a two-star general, great reputation, because the DIA said the truth about the strike we made on Iran. It was a wonderfully successful strike. But because he didn't use the words total obliteration, Trump's methodology,

13:44 he gets fired. when the national intelligence professionals who said Maduro bad guy trender log bad group there's not this total linkage the way they wanted to represent that those professionals get fired I've had senior intelligence professionals say Warner what is going on and there is a fear particularly because of you know Gabbard's unusual appearances on so much of Russian activity uh in Russian media so many times and far-right media that can we really share everything uh with the Americans and our intel is the best but it is so supplemented by our partners all around the world and if we don't have access to that then again doesn't make America safer.

14:30 So uh I want to turn to what's happening domestically. Your colleague in the Senate Patty Murray negotiated a bipartisan funding deal for the Department of Homeland Security. It uh does not increase the agency's overall budget. cuts the money allocated for enforcement and removal operations by $115 million, which is a small amount compared to the vast increase that just went through through the Trump big beautiful bill, but uh it will require uniforms, body cameras, does not remove the mask, clear a compromise. Another one of your colleagues, Chris Murphy, criticized the bill, saying it puts no meaningful constraints on the growing lawlessness of ICE. Where where are you on this?

15:02 Well, let me back up. First of all, I think we ought to acknowledge, or at least I want to acknowledge, I think President Biden screwed up the border. M

15:10 you know the process we weren't prepared folks coming in and Trump got hired in certain ways because of the situation at the border but closing the border is different than 10,000 plus ICE agents masked you know going to doortodoor in certain communities arresting folks when they drop off their kids at school or people going to work. So, I got legislation to try to say like other law enforcement, you know, show your badge, show your face.

15:41 There are ways we can prohibit doxing of of ICE agents. We've not passed that. I can tell you in my state with these quotas where they're trying to pick up folks all the time.

15:51 Um 75% of the people picked up have they've maybe come here illegally or overstayed when they were illegal, but they've not committed any other crime. So, I definitely want to put some um additional constraints on ICE. As you said, the vast the vast bulk of their money that they're getting now is not coming from the budget, but it is coming from the big awful bill that did all this huge plus up.

16:16 So, you know, the the new words or the new bill came out literally this morning. I want to dig into it. I got, you know, I got five or six days before I put it aside. Um, I don't think we ought to be shutting down the government again because I think that uh and again from a Virginia standpoint, we got a lot of federal workers. We got a lot of contractors. We, you know, the people who are contractors, the folks who clean the the toilets in our federal buildings, they don't ever get reimbursed. And I want to weigh what kind of constraints that Murray said she got. Obviously, Chris Murphy feels very strongly the other way. What's the best way that we can put constraints on ice that actually will get something done when we're still in the minority? And that's what I got to I got to sort through over the next five or six days.

17:02 Yeah. There is sort of I think a lot of people watching this unfold and they want to see Democrats do more uh and uh

17:10 well doing more and I I hear this all the time on a bunch of issues. Yeah. But is doing more just voting or is doing more trying to find a way to actually get some further constraints on these guys? Trying to look at the fact that you know the ICE training has gone from multiple months to 47 days which is wacky

17:29 nuts. So I'm all in on doing more but doing more where you can actually get a result.

17:35 Well no that's what that's the question about it because it's it's you know Democrats using their limited leverage to get concessions. those concessions are ultimately unsatisfying given the scale of what we're seeing, the lawlessness of what we're seeing. And yet that is all that we have. And I'm just curious what you think about the balance between basically saying plainly what should be happening, which would go far beyond what this bill does, while what we are willing to accept.

17:59 I hung in and was proud to hang in on this last fight we had on healthcare. You know, I didn't I stayed with we got to stay in the shutdown. Um, and I saw a lot of my folks say, "Well, you know, hang in there, but I'm not sure I can make my mortgage appointment payment next month." I The folks that were the invisible people, and again, we got a lot more federal employees. The people I think about the most in this are not the federal employees are going to get reimbured or even the high price contractors, but there's a we've outsourced so much of our work that literally the janitorial staffs and all the federal buildings are contractors.

18:35 They don't get any reimbursement. And I think we we highlighted how much damage is being done on the healthcare debate, but we didn't and we we've got the public's attention and that will pay dividends in November. I absolutely believe um I'm not sure that the notion though that constantly threatening a government shutdown I'm just not sure that's the right path and whether we burn the goodwill that that we've earned this ICE you know I'm going to look at what we've got it's is it as much as I want it absolutely not I'd like to actually talk to some of the Republicans I although I get criticized appropriately for being too bipartisan I've lost so much faith in and the vast majority of my Republican partners who just have lost any willingness to stand up and I'm so tired of them privately saying, "Oh, Mark, I think you're right." Or I got one that even said, "Oh, Mark, it's like you're our conscience." I don't your damn

19:31 conscience. Vote your conscience. Um, but that's what I got to sort sort through over these next few days. How can we be the opposition and actually extract some wins that are not just, you know, we held on, held on, held on. How do we actually change some of the policy? Ultimately, it's going to come through an election, but what can we do in the interim?

19:54 What have Speaking of sort of Republicans, what they're saying behind the scenes, like do you have a a a working relationship with like Scott Bessant? He's the he was saying, "Don't worry. Don't worry." You know, Trump there's a plan. There's a plan. Obviously, the plan is this ridiculous framework to I guess claim we had a victory in Greenland. Well, nothing really changes. But, uh, do you have any relationship with the people inside this administration at all?

20:16 Very few. I've got a bit of a relationship with Besson and a lot of that was based upon you know the fact that in Trump won I think I mentioned I had a good working relationship with Minutuchin we actually got you 12 billion dollars for underserved communities through what's called community development financial institutions CDFIS um that I think postco helped a lot of folks that if I had not had that relationship um we wouldn't have gotten in the last co bill I was hoping for somewhat the same approach from Bessant You know, I've had, you know, a couple of of I think small wins on a crypto bill with him and one case of where I think the Doge guys were going way over the top.

21:01 Um, but I've been there's a whole lot of stuff that he's said and done that really disappoints me. I I thought that this and you know you you hear these outside reports standing up for the independence of the Federal Reserve and this is not some esoteric intellectual thing is if the Federal Reserve is not viewed as independent people are going to charge us more interest yeah to buy our debt and that means everybody's prices are going to go up your your car loans going to go up your mortgage is going to go up so there is this is a directly into the affordability argument but they are few and far between in this administration

21:35 is it that you think Bessant is not powerful is do you think Bessant doesn't is in over in over his head what like this is this was you know look we are we are so far we are so far down uh the path here um but this is the person that's meant to be the serious one who talks to the business leaders and yet we they are they are Korean they're threatening tariffs over Greenland they're threatening the the the the reserve currency they're threatening whether people will even want to buy treasuries

22:02 yep and the argument you that you usually and again I've not I don't uh I've not talked to Bessant in months and months is you not from him directly but from their their defenders is oh gosh it would be worse. I'm not sure how much worse it could be when we've seen in the last two weeks a direct frontal assault on the Federal Reserve, when we threatened um our NATO allies on potentially an invasion, when we didn't get briefed on what happened in Venezuela. You know, one of the the the irony is this stuff, as as you know, all fits together. like when we saw the Iranian people stand up I think really bravely and the kind of the the um response of we stand with the Iranian people I think we needed to do more but one of the reasons and boy oh boy I am not by any means saying a a kinetic actual strike on Iran would have made sense but our ability to even do that was cut back because we got 20% of our

23:10 fleet off the coast of Venezuela blockading so the Venezuelan oil doesn't get out and the aircraft carrier that was supposed to be in the Eastern Med was not there. It was off the coast of Venezuela. And so if we thought, what could we do to help the Iranian people? Well, one, you know, we could have gotten more Starlink so they could open up the internet. Two, we could do some cyber activities that we didn't fully deal with. But three, we could have, I think, potentially forced or urged all our European friends who have ties to to Iran to really up the pressure. But they were not going to up the pressure on Iran when we're threatening NATO and Greenland. So, you know, our military capacity to was cut back because our aircraft carrier somewhere else. We're now taking an aircraft carrier from Indoacific and moving it to the Mediterranean. The fact that the Trump crowd doesn't seem to understand the

24:00 interconnectedness of all this stuff literally blows me away. Uh, one last question for you. Uh, you have a new primary challenger in Virginia. His name is Mark Moran. He's a former Wall Street guy, but most famous uh he appeared on season one of the reality show Fuckboy Island. Uh do you know what a boy is?

24:20 Um I'm an old guy, but I'm not that old a guy. So it's like Yeah, I would say try to protect your interest or laugh.

24:26 I would say this, you know, John, you know, reality TV stars actually being good elected officials,

24:33 I'd point to the president. Yeah, I'm not sure that's the credential I'd put out there.

24:37 What about people that went briefly on Survivor? Uh yeah. Well, they're a different crowd. They're survivors by

24:42 natur. Um well, uh Senator Mark Warner, thank you so much for your time. Good to talk to you and uh man uh you know, good luck out there.

24:53 Amen, brother. Thanks.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Top Democrat SLAMS Trump Over Embarrassment Abroad and ICE"?

John (Guest), Mark Warner (Guest).

What is "Top Democrat SLAMS Trump Over Embarrassment Abroad and ICE" about?

Virginia Senator Mark Warner criticizes Donald Trump's recent foreign policy approach, particularly at the World Economic Forum in Davos, where Trump both doubled down on his controversial interest in Greenland and later attempted to backtrack. Warner highlights the inconsistency and lack of historical understanding in Trump’s statements about U.S. military presence in Greenland and the…

What is mentioned in this Pod Save America episode?

5 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Donald Trump, Donald C. Murphy, Patty Murray, William McKinley. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Top Democrat SLAMS Trump Over Embarrassment Abroad and ICE"?

The episode runs 25 min; the transcript is about 4,780 words in 65 timestamped sections.

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