--- title: "How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show transcript | The Ezra Klein Show | Reclip.Me" description: "Full transcript of \"How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra…\" from The Ezra Klein Show, November 7, 2026. 1 h 8 min, 12,284 words, timestamped. 8 notable quotes…" canonical: https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript --- Transcript # How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show From [The Ezra Klein Show](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show) · [Episode page](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show) · [Watch on YouTube](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wvYKx-USiZQ) November 7, 2026 · 1 h 8 min · 12,284 words · 150 timestamped sections This is the full, timestamped transcript of "How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show", an episode of The Ezra Klein Show published November 7, 2026 (1 h 8 min, about 12,284 words). It mentions 101 people, works and ideas, including Democratic Party, Donald Trump, Michelle Goldberg, Ezra Klein, Republican Party. ## What this episode is about Democrats won by tailoring strategies to diverse local contexts, selecting the right candidates and approaches for each region, from Texas to Michigan and Maine, revealing a emerging Democratic trajectory shaped by ground-level campaigns and practical, place-based messaging. The discussion analyzes what worked, what that signals for the party's future, and how intra-party dynamics may shift as a result. ## Key takeaways - Texas shows how local empathy and anti-elite resentment can unite voters beyond party labels, despite Trump’s pull. - Tech disruption, not ideology, defined many campaigns—nuisances like noise and crypto mining shaped battlegrounds more than slogans. - Democratic wins hinged on diverse strategy kits: candidate fit, ground-level storytelling, and timing over one-size-fits-all blue wave. - Inter-party infighting feels louder, but campaigns’ shared emphasis on neighborliness signals a shift toward humane, issue-specific messaging. - Texas drama—Rogan endorsements, Paxton scandals, and Trump interference—illustrates campaigns succeed when celebrity meets local grievances at scale. ## Who speaks in this episode? - [Ezra Klein](https://reclip.me/speaker/ezra-klein) (Guest) · 27 min speaking - [Michelle Goldberg](https://reclip.me/speaker/michelle-goldberg) (Guest) · 41 min speaking ## What is discussed, and when 1. [0:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=0) – 10:00: [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8), [James Talarico](https://reclip.me/person/james-talarico), [Texas](https://reclip.me/location/texas) 2. [10:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=600) – 20:00: [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Republican Party](https://reclip.me/entity/109971), [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8), [Populism](https://reclip.me/concept/populism-2) 3. [20:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1200) – 30:00: [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8), [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Mike Collins](https://reclip.me/person/mike-collins), [Georgia](https://reclip.me/location/georgia) 4. [30:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1800) – 40:00: [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8), [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Kazakhstan](https://reclip.me/entity/111528), [Corruption](https://reclip.me/concept/corruption) 5. [40:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2400) – 50:00: [Michigan](https://reclip.me/location/michigan), [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Republican Party](https://reclip.me/entity/109971), [Haley Stevens](https://reclip.me/person/haley-stevens) 6. [50:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3000) – 1:00:00: [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Kansas](https://reclip.me/location/kansas), [Corruption](https://reclip.me/concept/corruption), [Oligarchy](https://reclip.me/concept/oligarchy) 7. [1:00:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3600) – 1:08:23: [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8), [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2), [Michelle Goldberg](https://reclip.me/person/michelle-goldberg), [Texas](https://reclip.me/location/texas) ## Notable quotes from "How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show" - > Tuesday is a lot more interesting and a lot more revealing than the differences between them. My colleague Michelle Goldberg, also an opinion columnist here at the New York… *about [Michelle Goldberg](https://reclip.me/person/michelle-goldberg) · at [0:39](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=39)* - > A kind of squishy centrist, you know? James Helerico will tell you that like the Democratic Party has forgotten how to fight, you know? He talks about flipping tables, right? He does. So, it's not. *about [James Talarico](https://reclip.me/person/james-talarico) · at [14:24](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=864)* - > People now in polls see the Republican party as the elitist party. That was not true a few years ago, right? people and it's kind of obvious why that is because you see Donald Trump and these. *about [Republican Party](https://reclip.me/entity/109971) · at [20:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1210)* - > Raphael Waro basically running as a ticket and this time he kind of ran as a ticket with Kesha Lance Bottoms. He is able to speak like I think very successfully both to kind of… *about [Corruption](https://reclip.me/concept/corruption) · at [26:36](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1596)* - > He became I think such \[snorts\] an important part of the Democratic message in this election because what he showed is something that Democrats had long believed but they… *about [Jon Ossoff](https://reclip.me/person/jon-ossoff) · at [30:41](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1841)* - > Because like \[snorts\] how does a candidate like JD Vance, sort of even more, I think, aligned with white nationalist forces in the Republican party than Donald Trump. How. *about [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8) · at [39:54](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2394)* - > In 2016. Now you can see he's really bad for these reasons, right? Let's like end this forever. And I think now you have this Democratic party that doesn't believe that, right?… *about [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2) · at [1:02:32](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3752)* - > I think that's a good place to end. I'll also find a question. What are three books you'd recommend to the audience? *about [Ezra Klein](https://reclip.me/person/ezra-klein) · at [1:05:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3904)* ## Who and what is mentioned in this episode? ### People - [Donald Trump](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-8) — Person · Referenced political figure · 28 mentions · first at [1:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=115) Central antagonist in the discussion; his presidency and actions are described as the primary cause of Republican losses and the focus of Democratic campaigns' critiques. - [Michelle Goldberg](https://reclip.me/person/michelle-goldberg) — Person · Main guest / analyst · 4 mentions · first at [0:44](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=44) Guest and on-the-ground reporter whose reporting and analysis of multiple races (Texas, Michigan, Maine, etc.) provides the empirical backbone of the episode's arguments. - [Ezra Klein](https://reclip.me/person/ezra-klein) — Person · Host · 2 mentions · first at [1:18](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=78) Host of The Ezra Klein Show; frames the episode topics, asks questions, and guides the conversation with Michelle Goldberg. - [James Talarico](https://reclip.me/person/james-talarico) — Person · Featured winning candidate / case study · 5 mentions · first at [2:08](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=128) Presented as a model Democratic winner in Texas — a faith-forward, anti-oligarch, anti-tech-billions populist who appealed to disaffected voters and changed campaign texture. - [Jon Ossoff](https://reclip.me/person/jon-ossoff) — Person · Featured winning candidate / case study · 3 mentions · first at [24:29](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1469) Discussed as a Democratic Senate winner in Georgia who successfully weaponized corruption messaging against Trump-aligned opponents and connected corruption to voters' everyday suffering. - [Abdul El-Sayed](https://reclip.me/person/abdul-el-sayed) — Person · Featured winning candidate / case study · 2 mentions · first at [43:26](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2606) Michigan Senate winner (featured as an example of left/populist surge); ran a fiercely populist campaign emphasizing Medicare for All and connecting economic grievances to cultural attacks against him. Help the party. it's it's also fascinating. I'm not hardly the first person to point this out that he ran on Medicare for all which we used to think was like an extremely… - [Gina Hinojosa](https://reclip.me/person/gina-hinojosa) — Person · Featured candidate / illustrative example · 4 mentions · first at [7:31](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=451) Texas candidate used as an example of data-center/tech populism and school-voucher backlash; her campaign illustrated grassroots anger about local impacts of corporate projects and education policy. To feel like this appeal coexisted with populism. and you could really see it also in Hinosa's campaign. We talked a little bit about the data center populism, but I want to… - [Ken Paxton](https://reclip.me/person/ken-paxton) — Person · Defeated incumbent / emblem of Republican corruption · 3 mentions · first at [4:58](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=298) Texas Republican official described in strongly negative terms and as one of the vulnerable, scandal-plagued figures Democrats beat or capitalized on in Texas. Mostly \[clears throat\] Mexican-American people in Texas and then he absolutely terrorized them. So that's part of the story, but also I think you know James Telerico was a… - [Adam Hamilton](https://reclip.me/person/adam-hamilton) — Person · Featured winning candidate / case study · 3 mentions · first at [10:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=655) Kansas Senate winner who ran a faith-forward, populist campaign that blended culturally conservative and populist economic appeals to win a historically Republican seat. Course. And they're no, no. Which are you? And I'm I think we can be both. To be a liberal means to be generous of spirit, open to seeing things with new eyes and to be and open to reform and to be conservative means holding on to values. - [Elon Musk](https://reclip.me/person/elon-musk) — Person · Referenced billionaire / foil · 2 mentions · first at [17:59](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1079) Presented as symbolic of tech billionaire power and cultural influence that Democrats turned against (esp. in Texas) to connect local grievances to broader anti-oligarch themes. Disappearing that their world might disappear where it helped \[snorts\] in some ways that Elon Musk moved to Texas and made himself the face in a lot of ways of the Republican… - [Mike Collins](https://reclip.me/person/mike-collins) — Person · Opposing candidate / defeated incumbent · 4 mentions · first at [24:29](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1469) Georgia Republican candidate defeated by Jon Ossoff; portrayed as part of the corruption and extremism Ossoff attacked. So, I want to then shift over to Georgia where John Of crushed Mike Collins by 18 points. This was supposed to be an endangered seat. the OS of victory which I think has been… - [Bernie Sanders](https://reclip.me/person/bernie-sanders) — Person · Referenced ideological antecedent · 3 mentions · first at [3:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=190) Used as a reference point for left/populist Democratic politics; Abdul El-Sayed's style is compared to Sanders' anti-oligarch, mobilizing approach. Like the Democratic Party has forgotten how to fight, you know? He talks about flipping tables, right? He does. So, it's not that he's saying that the Democratic Party needs to be more consiliatory. - [Dr. Jack Abbott](https://reclip.me/person/dr-jack-abbott) — Person · Defeated / vulnerable Republican incumbent (case study) · 3 mentions · first at [6:07](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=367) Texas governor discussed as having faced significant resentment and contributing to the shift against Republicans in the state. That wasn't all scandal plagued Republicans on the other side. Greg Abbott wasn't considered a highly vulnerable Republican before this week. - [Haley Stevens](https://reclip.me/person/haley-stevens) — Person · Referenced candidate / establishment pick · 3 mentions · first at [42:16](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2536) Discussed as the establishment-backed Democratic candidate in Michigan whose perceived lack of accessibility and enthusiasm contrasted with Abdul El-Sayed's insurgent energy; cited for declining to support El-Sayed late in the race. Her kind of towards the end of that primary hoping to push her over the edge. Who was she and how did she end up endorsing the Republican in the final days of the race? - [Joe Rogan](https://reclip.me/person/joe-rogan) — Person · Media figure referenced · 2 mentions · first at [5:14](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=314) Mentioned as having given James Talarico a platform that helped introduce him to audiences that Democrats needed to reach; used as an example of cross-aisle outreach. Well, I had a great time with Joe Rogan, and I'm always willing to go on to shows or podcasts with hosts who disagree with me on any issue because we have to we have to build. - [Scott Colom](https://reclip.me/person/scott-colom) — Person · Featured winning candidate / case study · 2 mentions · first at [38:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2326) Mississippi Democrat who ran successfully (story includes his appointment to federal bench and decision to challenge an incumbent senator) — example of surprising Democratic gains in the South. He ends up in this race because he could have had another job, right? He was appointed to the federal bench by Joe Biden and he is blocked by Mississippi Senator Cindy Hyde Smith and then he decides to challenge her in the election. - [Chuck Schumer](https://reclip.me/person/chuck-schumer) — Person · Referenced party leader / strategist · 2 mentions · first at [42:23](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2543) Mentioned as intervening in multiple races (recruiting Haley Stevens, investing resources) — part of discussion about establishment candidate selection and strategic choices. Okay. So, I've been critical of Chuck Schumer's intervention in some of these races. There was obviously races where he was really, \[snorts\] really important, right? He was really. - [Sherrod Brown](https://reclip.me/person/sherrod-brown) — Person · Referenced incumbent / example of established Democrats · 3 mentions · first at [41:44](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2504) Mentioned as an example of older-generation Democrats who won, contrasted with the new generation of candidates; his victory noted among other incumbent successes. Elections in the Midwest. So you had Senate seats open for contest in Ohio where Sher Brown won running again a very anti-data center campaign among other things in Minnesota where Peggy Flanigan won for the Democrats. - [John Lewis](https://reclip.me/person/john-lewis) — Person · Historical reference · 2 mentions · first at [25:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1530) Referenced as a civil rights hero to contrast Mike Collins' alleged behavior and to invoke civil-rights-era moral authority in John Ossoff's debate rhetoric. Who were mocking a black woman on a college campus with monkey sounds. If John Lewis were marching today from Selma to Montgomery, Mike Collins would be grabbing a billy club. - [Mallory McMorrow](https://reclip.me/person/mallory-mcmorrow) — Person · Referenced Democrat / primary contender · 2 mentions · first at [43:34](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2614) Accurate identifications essential for linking to real person; standard spelling corrected Yeah, I like Mallerie McMurro a lot. I never understood why the establishment was moving towards Stevens. I like Elsa too, but I understood what the fears about him were forability reasons. - [Beto O'Rourke](https://reclip.me/person/beto-orourke) — Person · Referenced former candidate · 1 mention · first at [8:23](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=503) Mentioned as a prior high-profile Democratic candidate in Texas (2018) whose run lacked a full ticket-building effort around him; used to contrast the 2026 coordinated Democratic efforts in Texas. She said because this time we have a ticket like because this time we have a team. when Beto ran in 2018 and came pretty close to Ted Cruz, there wasn't a competitive campaign… - [Donald Trump Jr.](https://reclip.me/person/donald-trump-jr) — Person · Referenced family member in corruption example · 1 mention · first at [31:34](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1894) Mentioned in John Ossoff's tungsten/Kazakhstan corruption example as 'Eric and Don Jr.' receiving stakes in a company tied to a Kazakhstan deal — used to illustrate alleged nepotistic corruption. 6 days later, 6 days after Prince Eric and Prince Dawn get their stake, Kazakhstan announces this company will get quote, the largest known undeveloped tungsten resource in the. - [Joe Biden](https://reclip.me/person/joe-biden) — Person · Referenced national figure · 1 mention · first at [38:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2335) Mentioned in relation to appointing Scott Colum to federal bench and as a broader national political context He ends up in this race because he could have had another job, right? He was appointed to the federal bench by Joe Biden and he is blocked by Mississippi Senator Cindy Hyde Smith and then he decides to challenge her in the election. - [Cindy Hyde-Smith](https://reclip.me/person/cindy-hyde-smith) — Person · Referenced incumbent · 1 mention · first at [38:57](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2337) Mentioned in relation to Mississippi: Scott Colum (Scott Colom) was blocked by Senator Cindy Hyde-Smith from a judgeship and later challenged/beat her in the Senate race — used to illustrate unusual candidate recruitment paths. He ends up in this race because he could have had another job, right? He was appointed to the federal bench by Joe Biden and he is blocked by Mississippi Senator Cindy Hyde Smith and then he decides to challenge her in the election. - [Sam Altman](https://reclip.me/person/sam-altman) — Person · Referenced tech figure · 1 mention · first at [4:54](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=294) Correct spelling confirmed; attribute as tech figure with evidence Yeah. Exactly. So I think actually feels that way with AI sometimes. Ask not what AI can do for you but ask what you can do for AI. - [John Cornyn](https://reclip.me/person/john-cornyn) — Person · Referenced politician · 1 mention · first at [5:02](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=302) Correct canonical spelling; alias noted for garbled variant Move but they can't sell their property cuz their property value has fallen through the floor. So that's like one group of people. Then there's just people for whom the… - [Congresswoman Jasmine Crockett](https://reclip.me/person/congresswoman-jasmine-crockett) — Person · Referenced candidate · 1 mention · first at [9:33](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=573) Named as another prominent Democratic Senate primary candidate in Texas; contrasted with James Telerico's style (Crockett more of a fighter/viral candidacy). High-profile candidates running in the Senate primary, with Telerico and Jasmine Crockett. And Crockett is much more the traditional fighter candidate. takes on the right, had all these viral videos where she was, lacing into. - [Steve Miller](https://reclip.me/person/steve-miller) — Person · Referenced staffer/official · 1 mention · first at [22:11](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1331) Preferred form; alias noted for variant They get picked up and roughed up by ICE. those kind of encounters or things that people were seeing firsthand or hearing about from people that they knew. - [Bobby Pulido](https://reclip.me/person/bobby-pulido) — Person · Referenced local candidate/celebrity · 1 mention · first at [22:45](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1365) Public figure name; correct spelling Populism but as you were saying a massive swing in the Hispanic electorate right leading people like Bobby Pledo who is running for the house this amazing like candidate you… - [Dr. Martin Luther King Jr.](https://reclip.me/person/dr-martin-luther-king-jr) — Person · Historical reference · 1 mention · first at [26:15](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1575) Canonical historical figure; canonical form ensured In a way that there just isn't in civil rights legacy, right? He grew up in a synagogue that was firebombed because of the rabbis commitment to civil rights and alliance with Martin Luther King, right? - [Raphael Warnock](https://reclip.me/person/raphael-warnock) — Person · Referenced political ally/context · 1 mention · first at [26:36](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1596) Referenced in context of Georgia politics and alliances (Ossoff running as a ticket with Warnock previously); mentioned as part of the coalition building in Georgia. Very much rooted in and very much cognizant of. You've seen it in both of his campaigns. You saw it in him and Raphael Waro basically running as a ticket and this time he kind… - [Gary Peters](https://reclip.me/person/gary-peters) — Person · Referenced politician · 1 mention · first at [42:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2524) Named as the Michigan senator who retired this cycle, creating a marquee seat contested in 2026 Democrats weren't that worried about that one. in Michigan where that became a very marquee seat because it was one of the few seats in the country where Republicans thought maybe they had a pickup opportunity. - [Susan Collins](https://reclip.me/person/susan-collins) — Person · Defeated incumbent (referenced) · 1 mention · first at [47:13](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2833) Name spelled correctly; context of defeat retained Could definitely see it in Maine, and again, beating Susan Collins is no small thing, but you could feel the difference in energy between when Graham Platner was the nominee… - [Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez](https://reclip.me/person/alexandria-ocasio-cortez) — Person · Representative of left-wing energy · 1 mention · first at [50:25](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3025) Full name specified with alias noted as applicable It's also a reality. I mean Bernie Sanders is in his 80s at this point. M he doesn't have all that many obvious successors in the Senate. He does in the house with AOC. He actually has it in. - [Annie Andrews](https://reclip.me/person/annie-andrews) — Person · Referenced healthcare advocate/doctor-candidate · 1 mention · first at [51:39](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3099) Name corrected; role preserved And you know you also Dr. Annie Andrews who you know really hammers home on healthcare. So, you've got these doctors coming into the Democratic Senate caucus at a time when I think there is. - [Roger Marshall](https://reclip.me/person/roger-marshall) — Person · Referenced opponent · 1 mention · first at [54:47](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3287) Referenced as Adam Hamilton's Republican opponent in Kansas; criticized for practices related to hounding patients over debts — used to show populist attack lines that crossed ideological boundaries. It's not like a position point on the left right spectrum cuz he went really hard against his opponent Roger Marshall for the way Marshall had hounded past patients over their debts and the amount of interest Marshall paid had demanded. - [Governor Gavin Newsom](https://reclip.me/person/governor-gavin-newsom) — Person · Referenced politician · 2 mentions · first at [11:32](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=692) Canonical spelling; alias noted Bit about this side of it. This kind of So, so at the time that I first met Terico, there was still this idea in the Democratic party that like they needed their own Trump… - [Ted Cruz](https://reclip.me/person/ted-cruz) — Person · Referenced politician · 1 mention · first at [8:27](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=507) Canonical spelling; context appropriate Which I think you can't like serious Democrats running in all these races which you can't understate. So you had Democrats running up and down the ticket. When I met Gina in… - [Keisha Lance Bottoms](https://reclip.me/person/keisha-lance-bottoms) — Person · Referenced ally · 1 mention · first at [26:42](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1602) Referenced as part of Ossoff's broader ticket/coalition-building in Georgia (Ossoff 'ran as a ticket with Kesha Lance Bottoms' in the conversation). Very much rooted in and very much cognizant of. You've seen it in both of his campaigns. You saw it in him and Raphael Waro basically running as a ticket and this time he kind… - [Peter Magyar](https://reclip.me/person/peter-magyar) — Person · Comparative reference · 1 mention · first at [28:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1684) Hungarian politician; ensure correct spelling That was the other race I covered this year was the Hungarian election. And what you saw with Peter Maguar was this combination of, sort of like reclaiming Hungarian national… ### Books & papers - [Good People](https://reclip.me/book/good-people) — Book · Recommended book · 1 mention · first at [1:05:19](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3919) Likely a book with potential author; needs verification of title/author And it's a book about a very assimilated Afghan family in Virginia where the teenage daughter is killed in what may or may not have been an honor killing. It's about a. - [The Feast of the Goat](https://reclip.me/book/the-feast-of-the-goat) — Book · Recommended book · 1 mention · first at [1:06:11](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3971) One of three books Michelle Goldberg recommends at the end of the episode; used to illustrate narratives about dictatorial cults of personality. Assimilation. it's like so heartbreaking. So anyway, that is one of them. A book I've been thinking about recently for no particular reason. it's about the last days of a decaying dictatorial cult of personality. ### Companies & orgs - [Democratic Party](https://reclip.me/company/democratic-party-2) — Company · Primary organizational actor · 43 mentions · first at [0:12](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=12) Subject of the episode's analysis — the party's recruitment, strategy, ideological composition, and future trajectory are examined after the 2026 midterms. - [Republican Party](https://reclip.me/entity/109971) — Company · Primary opposing political actor · 12 mentions · first at [6:06](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=366) Framing foil for Democrats in the episode; Republican incumbents and nominees (Abbott, Paxton, Collins, etc.) are discussed as losing ground and being criticized for corruption and billionaire ties. - [New York Times](https://reclip.me/entity/109855) — Company · Publisher / employer · 2 mentions · first at [0:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=46) Employer of both host and guest; source of Michelle Goldberg's reporting referenced repeatedly during the episode. Tuesday is a lot more interesting and a lot more revealing than the differences between them. My colleague Michelle Goldberg, also an opinion columnist here at the New York… - [Fox News](https://reclip.me/entity/109875) — Company · Media outlet referenced · 2 mentions · first at [1:00:54](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3654) Referenced as a platform James Telerico appeared on the morning after his Texas victory — used to signal outreach to conservative audiences and cross-aisle communication. I am not interested in retribution. The people of Texas did not elect me last night. for retribution. They elected me to deliver for them to make their lives easier and better and less. ### Concepts & topics - [Corruption](https://reclip.me/concept/corruption) — Concept · Core issue / messaging focus · 6 mentions · first at [28:32](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1712) A central theme Democrats used — connecting corruption (Trump-era favors, oligarch ties) to voters' economic pain and public-service decline. - [Populism](https://reclip.me/concept/populism-2) — Concept · Core topic / strategy · 4 mentions · first at [16:20](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=980) A recurring strategy across multiple Democratic campaigns described in the episode — appeals against tech elites, billionaires, and corporate power that transcended traditional left-right labels. Unchecked billionaire corporate power, economic inequality, the like. So it's this kind of like everyone against the billionaires kind of politics which just is numerically much better than a sort of like red blue divide. - [Medicare for All](https://reclip.me/concept/medicare-for-all) — Concept · Policy proposal / campaign plank · 2 mentions · first at [13:02](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=782) Highlighted as a popular progressive policy that won electoral support in Michigan and signaled the viability of left-wing economic messaging within winning Democratic coalitions. I could be wrong, but I think that the thing we're going to hear Abdul say talk about the most, my guess, is expanding Medicare. - [Oligarchy](https://reclip.me/concept/oligarchy) — Concept · Framing / critique · 2 mentions · first at [58:22](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3502) Used as a framing device for Democratic campaigns to criticize billionaire influence and elite capture of public goods; central to the anti-elite messaging described. From the Democratic party that emerged out of the 2018 midterm? I mean fundamentally the focus on oligarchy which I don't even remember us kind of using that word in 2018 but… - [Data centers (concept)](https://reclip.me/concept/data-centers-concept) — Concept · Local economic grievance / campaign issue · 5 mentions · first at [3:22](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=202) Ambiguous classification; clearly a campaign issue related to data center development and its local impact Is a major center of the data center buildout. people in the rural part of the state hate them because they're they see them and their eyes sores and you know and sometimes they people feel like they're ruining their lives. - [MAGA](https://reclip.me/concept/maga) — Concept · Demographic / faction · 1 mention · first at [1:03:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3826) Used to describe a segment of Republican-aligned voters; discussed in relation to defections from Republican candidates and motivations around immigration and enforcement policies. There are a lot of people, I think, who were in MAGA for the mass deportations, who were in there for the cruelty. But there are people, who again, and this is something that's hard for me. - [School vouchers](https://reclip.me/concept/school-vouchers) — Concept · Policy grievance / campaign issue · 1 mention · first at [6:45](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=405) Cited as a local policy driving voter anger in Texas, helping motivate cross-party defections and Democratic gains in some districts. Abbott is bought and paid for by the billionaires and the corporations. And they were furious about data centers and they were also furious about school vouchers. And I think… - [Christian nationalism](https://reclip.me/concept/christian-nationalism) — Concept · Ideological counterpoint · 1 mention · first at [11:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=708) Referenced as a political force in Texas that candidates like Telerico positioned themselves against, using faith to appeal broadly while rejecting Christian-nationalist politics. Still eventually hopes to be a pastor when he's done with politics. He's ve he's not a Christian nationalist by any stretch of the imagination and in fact developed his politics like very much in opposition to Christian nationalism. - [Culture wars](https://reclip.me/concept/culture-wars) — Concept · Contextual theme · 1 mention · first at [17:22](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1042) Mentioned as a long-running source of political division that some candidates argued had become less central compared to economic and oligarchy/corporate issues in 2026 campaigns. Say like the culture wars are over, right? And I think I was a little bit skeptical of that going in. like I don't know if you can just kind of unilaterally say that this… - [Affordable Care Act](https://reclip.me/concept/affordable-care-act-2) — Concept · Policy concept · 1 mention · first at [1:04:50](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3890) Canonical name for the policy; alias ACA useful for cross-reference Right? Especially when you have Donald Trump in office. You can, you can do certain things. They might be able to restore the ACA subsidies, but I think there's a sense that… - [Religious left](https://reclip.me/concept/religious-left) — Concept · Emerging current · 1 mention · first at [11:01](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=661) Mentioned as part of the 'texture' change — a religiously-rooted left that speaks in moral language and values, exemplified by candidates like Telerico and others. Believes it's kind of sinful and you know he's in a state where it's so preeminent. But he does believe that Democrats lost something as they became more secular and \[clears… - [Realignment](https://reclip.me/concept/realignment) — Concept · Analytical framework · 1 mention · first at [21:17](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1277) Used to discuss whether the 2026 results represent a long-term partisan realignment in the South or a more temporary shift; Michelle Goldberg prefers the term 'dealignment'. We think. But yeah, what does it mean that the South has fallen for the Republicans? So, look, obviously in some ways I think we're still metabolizing this because it's just I can't think of another time. ### Places & events - [Texas](https://reclip.me/location/texas) — Place · Setting / case study · 6 mentions · first at [0:52](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=52) Major battleground discussed at length — site of multiple Democratic victories and illustrative of new Democratic strategies (faith-inflected populism, anti-tech billionaire messaging, coordinated ticket). That is the new form of politics that we pioneered in Texas. It's how we won by double digits in the largest red state in the country. And I think it can be a blueprint for our nation going forward. - [Michigan](https://reclip.me/location/michigan) — Place · Setting / case study · 8 mentions · first at [0:52](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=52) Site of Abdul El-Sayed's Senate campaign and a key Midwestern battleground examined for lessons on populist messaging and Medicare for All appeal. Help the party. it's it's also fascinating. I'm not hardly the first person to point this out that he ran on Medicare for all which we used to think was like an extremely… - [Georgia](https://reclip.me/location/georgia) — Place · Setting / case study · 6 mentions · first at [24:26](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1466) Site of Jon Ossoff's large Senate victory; used to illustrate how anti-corruption messaging resonated in a Southern battleground. Mara Lago mafia has taken American corruption to spectacular new heights. And so I think one of the things that he did so effectively is that in the past it's been hard to get voters to care as much as maybe I think they should about all. - [Kansas](https://reclip.me/location/kansas) — Place · Setting / case study · 7 mentions · first at [10:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=655) State where Adam Hamilton won a Senate seat, used to illustrate successful blending of populist and faith-based appeals in a historically Republican state. And healthcare reform parting in the runup to 2028. I want to move to Kansas. The last time Kansas had a Democrat in the Senate was the 1930s. - [Mississippi](https://reclip.me/entity/111715) — Place · Setting / case study · 6 mentions · first at [37:33](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2253) Noted as one of the Southern states where Democrats made surprising gains, signaling the South's growing unreliability for Republicans. What has happened is the South has become unreliable now for the Republican party. They have to defend it. Demog going to have an opportunity to say this is what it is like when we govern Texas,. - [January 6th](https://reclip.me/event/january-6th) — Event · Referenced event / indictment of opponents · 2 mentions · first at [6:29](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=389) Used as a litmus test and attack point against Republican candidates who supported efforts to overturn the 2020 election; part of the moral case Democrats made. The 2020 election was stolen. Mike Collins has supported Donald Trump's effort to overturn the election and he wants to give your tax dollars to the violent thugs and criminals… - [Tungsten Mining Deal in Kazakhstan](https://reclip.me/event/tungsten-mining-deal-in-kazakhstan) — Event · Illustrative corruption example · 2 mentions · first at [31:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1908) Referenced in John Ossoff's speech as a concrete example of alleged Trump-family corruption — used to connect corruption to taxpayer harm and to mobilize voters. 6 days later, 6 days after Prince Eric and Prince Dawn get their stake, Kazakhstan announces this company will get quote, the largest known undeveloped tungsten resource in the. - [Kazakhstan](https://reclip.me/entity/111528) — Place · Referenced foreign setting / corruption example · 4 mentions · first at [31:24](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1884) Mentioned in an Ossoff clip as part of a corruption narrative tying Trump family business dealings and foreign mining deals to taxpayer subsidies. 6 days later, 6 days after Prince Eric and Prince Dawn get their stake, Kazakhstan announces this company will get quote, the largest known undeveloped tungsten resource in the world. - [South Carolina](https://reclip.me/entity/111700) — Place · Setting/State referenced · 3 mentions · first at [37:22](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2242) Referenced as one of the Southern states where Democrats performed unexpectedly well, signaling the South's unreliability for Republicans. That you were on the ground for, but I think you understood the night was going to be something different when the needle began swinging on South Carolina. - [Maine](https://reclip.me/entity/111591) — Place · Setting/State referenced · 2 mentions · first at [0:52](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=52) Mentioned as one of the states where Democrats ran notable campaigns and where Michelle Goldberg reported on races (e.g., Troy Jackson event, Senate contest vs. Susan Collins). The difference in energy between when Graham Platner was the nominee and when, I went to a Troy Jackson event just I have family in Maine and was visiting them. Went to a Troy Jackson event while I was there. he seemed like a very nice man. - [The Civil Rights Movement](https://reclip.me/event/the-civil-rights-movement) — Event · Historical context · 2 mentions · first at [26:05](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1565) Invoked to situate John Ossoff's background (internship for John Lewis, synagogue firebombed for civil-rights solidarity) and to frame moral/values appeals in campaigns. In a way that there just isn't in civil rights legacy, right? He grew up in a synagogue that was firebombed because of the rabbis commitment to civil rights and alliance with Martin Luther King, right? - [Mara Lago](https://reclip.me/location/mara-lago) — Place · Symbolic location · 1 mention · first at [28:35](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1715) Famous location; ensure correct hyphenation and capitalization And just this relentless focus on Orban's corruption. John Oaf is always talking about the Mara Lago mafia. The Mara Lago mafia has taken American corruption to spectacular new heights. And so I think one of the things that he did so. - [Hungary](https://reclip.me/location/hungary) — Place · Comparative reference · 2 mentions · first at [28:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1684) Used as a comparative case (Hungarian election, Viktor Orbán, Peter Magyar) to illustrate how populist rhetoric and anti-corruption messages can be mobilized — Michelle Goldberg draws parallels between John Ossoff's approach and Peter Magyar/Orbán-era politics. That was the other race I covered this year was the Hungarian election. And what you saw with Peter Maguar was this combination of, sort of like reclaiming Hungarian national identity,. - [Cameron County](https://reclip.me/location/cameron-county) — Place · Referenced location (voter shift example) · 1 mention · first at [22:24](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1344) Used to illustrate large Hispanic swing toward Democrats in border counties of Texas after 2024 policies And in the border counties of Texas, the swing versus like the 2024 presidential election, to just name a couple of these, Cameron County plus 44 swing to the Democrats. Hidalgo plus 49,. - [Hidalgo County](https://reclip.me/location/hidalgo-county) — Place · Referenced location (voter shift example) · 1 mention · first at [22:27](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1347) Cited as another border county showing dramatic swing to Democrats in 2026 Swing to the Democrats. Hidalgo plus 49, Web plus 50. these are heavily Hispanic border counties. And part of the story here is not just like Palico's kindness or Hinosa's you… - [Selma](https://reclip.me/location/selma) — Place · Referenced location (historical) · 1 mention · first at [25:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1530) Referenced in rhetorical comparison to civil rights marches (John Ossoff invoked John Lewis marching from Selma to Montgomery) In a way that there just isn't in civil rights legacy, right? He grew up in a synagogue that was firebombed because of the rabbis commitment to civil rights and alliance with Martin Luther King, right? - [New York City, New York](https://reclip.me/location/new-york-city-new-york) — Place · Referenced location · 2 mentions · first at [33:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1990) Location appears in multiple mentions; canonical form needed This, I think, is why there's been something different about the reaction to Asso's victory. Because this is not, look how much money I brought back to Georgia for highways. I think this felt. - [Longview](https://reclip.me/location/longview) — Place · Referenced location (campaign event) · 1 mention · first at [7:12](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=432) Canonical spelling for Texas city; alternate 'Long View' should be removed That people couldn't do extracurriculars or sports or anything unless they had someone to pick them up. so I met this guy at a rally in Long View, Texas. - [Montgomery](https://reclip.me/location/montgomery) — Place · Referenced location (historical) · 1 mention · first at [25:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1530) Paired with Selma in civil-rights-era reference used in debate clip about Mike Collins Who were mocking a black woman on a college campus with monkey sounds. If John Lewis were marching today from Selma to Montgomery, Mike Collins would be grabbing a billy club. - [Hungarian election](https://reclip.me/event/hungarian-election) — Event · Comparative case study · 1 mention · first at [28:12](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1692) Generic event phrase refined to a specific event; capitalization corrected That was the other race I covered this year was the Hungarian election. And what you saw with Peter Maguar was this combination of, sort of like reclaiming Hungarian national… - [San Francisco](https://reclip.me/location/san-francisco) — Place · Referenced city · 1 mention · first at [33:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1990) Used as an example of coastal liberal strongholds contrasted with places like Georgia where corruption messaging resonated This, I think, is why there's been something different about the reaction to Asso's victory. Because this is not, look how much money I brought back to Georgia for highways. I think this felt. - [Ohio](https://reclip.me/location/ohio-2) — Place · Referenced battleground state · 1 mention · first at [41:44](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2504) Mentioned in passing as a state where Sherrod Brown won, part of Midwest discussion Elections in the Midwest. So you had Senate seats open for contest in Ohio where Sher Brown won running again a very anti-data center campaign among other things in Minnesota where Peggy Flanigan won for the Democrats. - [Minnesota](https://reclip.me/entity/111699) — Place · Referenced battleground state · 1 mention · first at [41:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2508) Mentioned as a state where Democrats won (Peggy Flanagan) in the 2026 cycle Democrats weren't that worried about that one. in Michigan where that became a very marquee seat because it was one of the few seats in the country where Republicans thought maybe they had. - [Virginia](https://reclip.me/location/virginia-3) — Place · Referenced location (setting of recommended fiction) · 2 mentions · first at [1:05:25](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3925) Referenced as the setting for the novel Good People (Afghan family in Virginia) recommended by Michelle Goldberg And it's a book about a very assimilated Afghan family in Virginia where the teenage daughter is killed in what may or may not have been an honor killing. It's about a. - [Iowa](https://reclip.me/location/iowa) — Place · Referenced state · 1 mention · first at [50:47](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3047) Mentioned as an example of states Democrats may need to contest in future cycles (part of broader map discussion) But now the entire political map is it's just a map again of states, right? It's like it's hard to imagine it's hard to even imagine what the 2028 like presidential looks like… - [Afghanistan](https://reclip.me/location/afghanistan) — Place · Referenced country (novel subject) · 1 mention · first at [1:05:21](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3921) Referenced as the origin of the family in the novel Good People (recommended by Michelle) And it's a book about a very assimilated Afghan family in Virginia where the teenage daughter is killed in what may or may not have been an honor killing. It's about a. - [Dominican Republic](https://reclip.me/location/dominican-republic) — Place · Referenced country (historical reference) · 1 mention · first at [1:06:17](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3977) Mentioned in relation to Vargas Llosa's The Feast of the Goat (about Trujillo's assassination) Assimilation. it's like so heartbreaking. So anyway, that is one of them. A book I've been thinking about recently for no particular reason. it's about the last days of a decaying dictatorial cult of personality. - [Mexico City](https://reclip.me/location/mexico-city) — Place · Referenced travel context · 1 mention · first at [1:07:20](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=4040) Mentioned by Michelle as context for buying a book (travel to Mexico City) when recommending books Okay. So, I actually bought it a few months ago when I was going to Mexico City, and it didn't come in time, so I've only just started reading it now. ### Media & podcasts - [The Apprentice](https://reclip.me/media/the-apprentice) — Media · Cultural reference · 1 mention · first at [1:04:19](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3859) Proper capitalization corrected for media title Right? They saw him as someone who had seen the inside of the system and was going to blow it up as opposed to just someone who wanted to get inside there so he could like grab everything in. ### Sponsors - [Roy Cooper](https://reclip.me/person/roy-cooper) — Person · Referenced supporter/operational actor · 2 mentions · first at [45:27](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2727) Mentioned as an actor Schumer got involved to help in races (context of intervention/investment) — example of national Democratic figures being mobilized to help contested states. But this is I want to say that I think Schumer ended up doing a good job on a lot of measures here, right? They just, they put money to Mississippi late in the game when people thought. ## Full transcript with timestamps [0:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=0) This election was full of so many extraordinary Democratic campaigns. Lifted, yes, by a wave that kind of Trump set into motion, but to get over the finish line in so many places, Democrats had to run the right candidates and they had to run in very, very different ways in very different places. And I want to spend an episode looking at some of the ways they ran and what that can reveal about the Democratic party that will emerge out of this election, the lessons Democratic Party will take going into the next election. There's already like you can feel these efforts at factional infighting beginning among Democrats. Uh but I think what is uniting the campaigns that won on Tuesday is a lot more interesting and a lot more revealing than the differences between them. My colleague Michelle Goldberg, also an opinion columnist here at the New York Times, has done amazing work over the past year covering [0:52](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=52) these different campaigns, going to Texas and Michigan and Maine and so many other places to actually see what the elections felt like on the ground. So she brings all this texture from when it wasn't clear if these strategies would work out. It wasn't clear if a democratic wave to say nothing of a blue tsunami would actually build. So, I want to have her on the show now to talk about what actually worked, what she saw then, and what that allows her to understand now about the Democratic party that is emerging out of this election. She joins me now. [1:27](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=87) Michelle Goldberg, welcome to the show. Thanks for having me. So, big week. I want to begin with Texas, which you covered extensively and I think is the heart [1:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=100) of both why this election feels like and more than feels like really is like an earthquake that will reshape the political landscape for a long time. How did Democrats win Texas? [1:53](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=113) Well, I mean, I think, you know, look, I don't they couldn't have done it obviously without Donald Trump. Donald Trump got a bunch of new voters among um mostly \[clears throat\] Mexican-American people in Texas and then he absolutely terrorized them. So that's part of the story, but also I think you know James Telerico was a phenomenal candidate. Um \[clears throat\] and he identified something really early. I mean I when I when I profiled him, he was like the underdog in the Senate primary. And so, but even then, I think he had this very clear vision of what he thought people in Texas were going to be looking for, you know, that people were so tired of being angry all the time. They were so tired of, you know, he would always say, "I'm tired of hating my being told to hate my neighbor." [2:43](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=163) It was on the one hand, you know, as he talked about this politics of loving your neighbor, this politics of like kindness at a time when, you know, the um the right had kind of polarized against the very conception of empathy. Um and at the same time, he also identified an enemy and an enemy that kind of was in its own way uniting. Right? the way he talks about billionaires is not that different from the way Bernie Sanders talks about billionaires. Um I think with the difference that he is often talking very specifically about tech billionaires. [3:20](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=200) You know he talks about you know t Texas is a major um center of the data center buildout. people in the rural part of the state hate them because they're they see them and their eyes sores and you know and sometimes they people feel like they're ruining their lives. [3:38](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=218) They're loud. Like you talk to people who can no longer sleep at night who say that the noise is like killing their livestock, you know, and they want to move but they can't sell their property cuz their property value has um fallen through the floor. So that's like one group of people. Then there's just people for whom the construction is like a huge inconvenience. It's ruining their views. It's, you know, they kind of moved out to, they didn't think they were moving into industrial areas, right? Maybe they were in favor of Donald Trump saying he was going to re-industrialize the heartland. They didn't think he meant like their backyard. Um, so there's that, but then there's also just, you know, this sort of ambient resentment of all of these tech bros who are saying, "We're remaking the future, you know, get on board or be left behind. And by the way, there's a chance we're going to destroy the world and, [4:31](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=271) you know, and and you're going to pay for it, right? Because and so, you know, it's one thing to make sacrifices for an industry that you think you're going to benefit from. It's another to make sacrifices for like a crypto mine." Um and so you know so all these things come together. [4:45](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=285) Ask not what the crypto mind can do for you but what you can do for the crypto mind. [4:49](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=289) Yeah. Exactly. So I think actually feels that way with AI sometimes. Ask not what AI can do for you but ask what you can do for AI. [4:54](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=294) Right. I mean that is kind of Sam Alman's attitude half the time you know and then on the other side you have Ken Paxton who is uniquely loathome. Although I I suspect that maybe John Cornin would have lost also. Well, this is I think one of the really interesting things about Texas because there was a story that I think people were fairly clued into before the election. Telerico is an excellent candidate in a way. You got to give Joe Rogan some credit here. It was Rogan inviting Terico on and then [5:20](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=320) you know lavishing him in praise that made I think a lot of Democrats think maybe Taller Rico's thing actually works on, [5:28](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=328) you know, the kind of people Democrats need to actually win over. And then Trump intervenes, make sure Paxton is going to be the nominee. You've got this very, very talented, nice Democratic candidate running against a scandal plagued Republican. And so if we had ended up with an election night where James Telerico won for Senate, might say, "Okay, Trump is unpopular. Paxton is like a monster and you know, Telerico is an excellent candidate." That's not what happened. Democrats won four of the five redistricted house seats. They won for governor. They had huge gains in the Texas House. And so that wasn't all scandal plagued Republicans on the other side. I mean, Greg Abbott wasn't considered a highly vulnerable Republican before this week. [6:12](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=372) So there's two different parts of that, right? So on the one hand, Greg Abbott, there was huge resentment. And when you hear about this resentment, you never really can understand how like um anecdotal it is, you know, like I was meeting a bunch of MAGA voters at Gina Henos's events. You know, she put one of them in her ad, right? He had a commercial with somebody who had been at the capital on January 6th. [6:32](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=392) I was at the January 6th rally. I'm a staunch conservative, but I cannot support Governor Greg Abbott. Greg Abbott is bought and paid for by the billionaires and the corporations. And they were furious about data centers and they were also furious about school vouchers. And I think, you know, this is maybe a kind of a sleeper issue in a lot of places. Um, but not for parents who live in places where there aren't a lot of private schools, but where they feel like their schools are being defunded. So, people are just livid about this, you know, and they would talk about like cutbacks in say after school busing so that people couldn't do extracurriculars or sports or anything unless they had someone to pick them up. Um, so I met this guy at a rally in Long View, Texas. [7:14](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=434) He's like a MAGA voter, super conservative. Um, told me that the last time he had voted for a Democrat was back in the '9s, and that was only because back then lots of Texas local officials were still Democrats. Um, and he's, you know, not only is he voting against Greg Abbott, he's at the Gina Henosa rally, and it's because he was a school superintendent, but was so angry about vouchers, right? Was so angry about vouchers, what vouchers were doing to like his particular school system. So that's part of it. The other part is just the fact that you did have Democrats running in all these races which I think you can't like serious Democrats running in all these races which you can't understate. So you had Democrats running up and down the ticket. When I met Gina in like before I went out there um I met her when she was in New York um \[snorts\] to kind of hear more about her race and I said to her, [8:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=490) you know, why should Democrats believe when believe in this race when like Texas is always Lucy in the football for Democrats? Um and she said she said because this time we have a ticket like because this time we have a team. You know, when when Beto ran in 2018 and came pretty close to Ted Cruz, there wasn't a competitive campaign for governor, there weren't competitive races around him. It was just him. And there's like a magnifying effect of having all of these different candidates, you know, doing their own events, running their own commercials, doing their own get out the vote efforts and that that's kind of compounding. And so I think that part of like party building, not just I mean James Helerico is a fantastic candidate, but not just relying on one marquee candidate to drag everybody across the finish line was I think really important. [9:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=544) I always think about politics as having content and texture and you know a lot of what you're describing here is content. The you know voucher issue, the AI data centers issue, high prices, you know what is Donald Trump doing in in Iran, right? That's all content. And then there's texture, which is like how does politics feel to people? And and one interesting thing to me about the Texas arc here was Democrats actually had two very very high-profile candidates running in the Senate primary, you know, with Telerico and Jasmine Crockett. And Crockett is much more the traditional fighter candidate. Um, you know, takes on the right, had all these viral videos where she was, you know, lacing into Republican members of Congress. the the Democrats go for Teler Rico and and he sort of infuses I think the the campaign with this particular texture and I want to play a clip here of his victory speech. [9:54](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=594) My faith teaches me that love is the strongest force in the universe. Love is not passive. Love is not neutral. Love is not weak. Love requires that we stand between the bullies and the bullied. Love requires that we look evil in the eye and not blink. That kind of love has always been a threat to the powers that be. That kind of love is revolutionary. That kind of love is creative. Hate is predictable. Hate is boring. Hate can't lower our energy bills. Hate can't teach a child to read. Hate can't build a future, but what hate can't do, love can. [10:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=648) I love that. I think it's really beautiful. Something was happening in the texture of the campaign in Texas, not only there. I mean, I think you see with Adam Hamilton in Kansas who we'll talk about, [10:59](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=659) you know, you see it some with Elsa, there's like this rise of a religious left, a more moralistic left, John Of talking in the language of values, but I think Telerico in particular exemplified this. Can you step into the Trump era? Can you win over Trump voters, not by mirroring Trump, [11:17](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=677) but by acting as this Well, he's the anti-Trump. He's the anti-Trump. Tell me a little bit about this side of it. This kind of [11:24](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=684) So, so at the time that I first met Terico, there was still this idea in the Democratic party that like they needed their own Trump, right? That was I think around the time that Gavin Newsome was like selling knee pads. \[snorts\] [11:36](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=696) And Ter Rico, I mean, you know, his faith is real. He was a seminarian. He still eventually hopes to be a pastor um when he's done with politics. He's ve he's not a Christian nationalist by any stretch of the imagination and in fact developed his politics like very much in opposition to Christian nationalism. Believes it's kind of sinful um and you know he's in a state where it's so preeminent. But he does believe that Democrats lost something as they became more secular and \[clears throat\] kind of lost a language to talk about values and conviction and the things that make life meaningful and people slipped into you know kind of atomization and despair and at least for him you know kind of it's faith is what what what keep what sustains him and I think he thinks that you know other people he would never try to push his faith on other people, but he does think people need something transcendent. [12:38](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=758) Well, the the other thing though that I thought was very effective in what he did, Telerico is a progressive candidate. I mean, he had these points where he moderated um on, you know, oil and gas [12:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=768) on, you know, certain trans issues on um immigration and and sort of like pushing himself forward on border enforcement. But I think people some just think too much about politics as a single dimension of like where do you stand on Medicare for all. [13:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=784) People's impression of what a Democrat or Republican is is also do they have faith is also where do they live is also how do they talk and how do they dress and and one thing Telerico seemed to me to be doing throughout the campaign quite effectively and many of the candidates did it in different ways was sort of saying I'm not like those other Democrats. First of all, I don't hate you. I mean, there's been a clip going around of him on a podcast asked about Donald Trump. Begins by listing what he likes about Donald Trump. [13:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=810) I think the president does have clear strengths. I think he's able to communicate in a way that's clear and and concise and powerful to people. He is willing to take action when there's so much gridlock. Um, he's willing to just kind of bust through walls to deliver for people. And he has a sense of humor, which I I feel like is really missing in in politics. you know, he has a a light-hearted weight about him. Those are, I think, some of the redeeming qualities, right? That that kind of it's a very Obama-like politics, right? There's no red and blue or at least those divisions do not fully define us. And this has been a layer of politics that I think has sort of been lost in the Trump era because Trump made so many people feel it didn't matter. [14:11](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=851) And it has been really interesting to me to see it roar back. Well, and it's interesting because there's there's two dimensions to this because on the one hand, you know, James Telerico is not a pushover, right? And he's not really a um a kind of squishy centrist, you know? I mean, James Helerico will tell you that like the Democratic Party has forgotten how to fight, [14:33](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=873) you know? He talks about flipping tables, right? He does. So, it's not that he's saying that the Democratic Party needs to be more consiliatory. It's more just that it needs to be more willing to fight for the right things and the right things are kind of unchecked billionaire corporate power, economic inequality, the like. So it's this kind of like everyone against the billionaires kind of politics which just is numerically um much better than a sort of like red blue divide. He also is able to speak to the fact that people are like so burned out on rage and so hungry for like an alternative and for the idea of a politics that can feel different. Um, you know, there's a lot of kind of very conservative Christians who were kind of apoplelectic about the way he used faith. They would say he was a heretic in some ways. they were more threatened by him than they were by a secular candidate. But when I would go to his [15:38](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=938) rallies, I would talk to people who would say how good it felt that there was, you know, a kind of a Democrat who wore his Christianity on their slee on his sleeve and who would say that they had felt in the past like the Democratic party was not was not open to religious people even though Terico um represented their faith much more than the Republicans did. And so yeah, there was a sense there there was a population there was a group of Texas voters who felt drawn into the party by him. [16:12](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=972) So I do think it's really interesting the way this openhearted love thy neighbor politics doesn't have to feel like this appeal coexisted with with populism. Um and you could really see it also in in Hinosa's campaign. We talked a little bit about the data center populism, but I I want to play this clip from an appearance she did on the campaign trail in in August where she was talking about the the data centers. [16:35](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=995) It is the fight for Texas. It is the fight in America. It is the fight about is this going to be a Texas that is by and for the people. And we need a governor who will defend the rights of the people, who will cancel contracts that jeopardize our water that we need to drink and live in our homes. It is common sense. We need to get back to a time. Back to a time when our elected leaders did the bidding of the people and not the moneyed interests and not the billionaires. [17:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1024) There's something I can't remember if you said it or she said it in an interview with you where she talked about AI contributing to a feeling people had that their lives were coming out of control, right? That there was disordering. [17:16](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1036) So like how did she like build that populism? Well, I think, you know, she would often say like the culture wars are over, right? And I think I was a little bit skeptical of that going in. like I don't know if you can just kind of unilaterally say that this um central source of division in American politics is no longer relevant but there is a sense that they become that it becomes kind of tired when people feel so directly threatened you know kind of in both in their immediate environment in what what their kids schools are going to look like in these billionaires telling them that their jobs are disappearing that their world might disappear where it helped \[snorts\] in some ways that Elon Musk moved to Texas and made himself the face in a lot of ways of the of the Republican party there. Um, you know, in some ways she often seemed and I think Delerico even more so often seemed like he was running [18:14](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1094) as much against Elon Musk as against um Ken Paxton. But and then she convinced people that that was going to be her priorities, right? not that she was necessarily \[clears throat\] moderating, you know, so she would say, "I still believe what I believe, but like we're not going to get consensus on this, so we're going to do the, you know, the things around the edges that um that we can all agree on, like making sure that women who are having miscarriages are treated in hospitals. But what really matters is the kind of unchecked power of these billionaires. I also think that, you know, there's a kind of an upper middle class person, take myself, um, not that I'm a swing voter, but if I think about who do I find threatening now, it's Elon Musk, right? It's like the tech bros. They seem to be like the forces of not just inequality, but incipient totalitarianism. [19:09](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1149) And they are culture warriors. It's also worth noting, right? And they're culture warriors. and they are, you know, the sort of um the forces behind this presidency and the Republican party. And I've written this in other instances before. You know, Democrats have been sort of um bemoning their kind of loss of the white working class and not just the white working class for many many years, right? And they sort of they wanted to bring back a sort of FDR coalition. and they wanted to bring back, you know, the political power of unions, but also being the party in many cases of the educated upper middle class that for a long time was very very comfortable with Silicon Valley, right? [19:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1195) So for a long time, Silicon Valley was seen as a kind of democratic stronghold \[snorts\] and people who felt like comfortable and optimistic about the role of technology in their jobs and the future um were a big part of the democratic coalition. People now in polls see the Republican party as the elitist party. That was not true a few years ago, right? people and it's kind of obvious why that is because you see Donald Trump and these billionaires and his like you know kind of Caligula like Halloween parties and stuff but you \[snorts\] know Donald Trump was always this extraordinarily goddy and decinent figure but the fact that he was kind of culturally in tune with the work with parts of the working class overrode that as did and I think this gets lost the fact that they saw him as a class traitor. [20:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1248) right? They saw him as someone who had seen the inside of the system and was going to blow it up as opposed to just someone who wanted to get inside there so he could like grab everything in sight. And you know, so again, this has created a problem for Democrats in terms of fundraising, in terms of, you know, having kind of hostile forces own a lot of these platforms, but it has also created this like kind of generational opportunity for a possible realignment. If you go back to 2016 after Donald Trump wins, there's a certain category of Democratic interpretation which is this is the last gasp of like a dying old political coalition. [21:37](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1297) But then in in 2020 and particularly in 2024, he begins making really significant inroads with Hispanic voters, with Asian-American voters, um to some degree with black voters, certainly in 2024 with young voters. The Hispanic strength was always the most important and unusual change he was making to the electorate and the most significant way in which Democrats have turned out to be wrong about him [22:02](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1322) and wrong about the right ways to to combat him. And then Donald Trump won office in 2024, turned over the entire immigration portfolio basically to Steven Miller and Greg Bevino and Christy Gnome. And in the border counties of Texas, the swing versus like the 2024 presidential election, to just name a couple of these, Cameron County plus 44 swing to the Democrats. Hidalgo plus 49, Web plus 50. I mean, these are heavily Hispanic border counties. And part of the story here is not just like Palico's kindness or um Hinosa's you know AI populism but as you were saying a massive swing in the Hispanic electorate right leading people like Bobby Pledo who is running for the house this amazing like candidate you know well-known singer in those communities you know he wins by 25 points in a Trump district [22:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1375) right I mean in some ways that's the easiest to explain right I mean I think there was in retrospect the idea that as the country became more diverse, Democrats were going to have this like automatic demographic advantage and people leaned into that, right? I mean, I think that maybe that was like the substrate of a lot of emphasis on identity even going up to the 2024 election, but it's one thing for people to be able to look beyond kind of rhetorical disrespect, and it's another thing to have masked men grabbing your relatives off their job sites, right? Kids afraid to go to school. I mean, just the amount of terror that people were feeling. I mean, there was a story that I don't think got a lot of international attention, but it was something that people were talking about when I was in Texas, that there were two young guys on their way to enlist. I mean, these are the kind of things you can't make up, right? These [23:57](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1437) two young guys on their way to enlist in the Marines and they they're citizens. They get picked up and roughed up by ICE. those kind of encounters or things that people were seeing firsthand or hearing about from people that they knew. [24:14](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1454) If you're not a subscriber to the New York Times, we have some news for you. You can now explore the Times for free without any payw walls at all during your first month in the New York Times app. So, I want to then shift over to Georgia where John Of crushed Mike Collins by 18 points. This was supposed to be an endangered seat. the OS of victory which I think has been one of the big stories that coming out of the election. I would say that was not just a politics of loving thy neighbor. Th this clip from one of the debates between OF and Collins is I think maybe the single most brutal moment I have ever seen in a political debate. [24:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1495) Mike Collins and Donald Trump, they're still obsessed with overturning the 2020 election. Mike Collins still believes the 2020 election was stolen. Mike Collins has supported Donald Trump's effort to overturn the election and he wants to give your tax dollars to the violent thugs and criminals who sacked the US capital on January 6th. Mike Collins is attacking your voting rights. But that's not a surprise when you consider who Mike Collins is. This is a man who cheered on a group of young men who were mocking a black woman on a college campus with monkey sounds. If John Lewis were marching today from Selma to Montgomery, Mike Collins would be grabbing a billy club. [25:38](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1538) Mike Collins would be grabbing a billy club. Mike Collins is standing there during this like just like looking down at his papers. You and I you reported on the the campaign. [25:47](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1547) What did you see there? Well, so I mean John Oaf in some ways I don't think any candidate does quite so much like resistance fan service. Um and partly it's just these are different electorates, right? there is this kind of like resistance electorate in Georgia in a way that there just isn't in [26:05](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1565) civil rights legacy, right? He grew up in a synagogue that was firebombed because of the rabbis commitment to civil rights and alliance with Martin Luther King, right? He's an intern for John Lewis. there is this, you know, kind of historic black Jewish alliance um that dates back to the civil rights movement and that he is very much rooted in and very much cognizant of. You've seen it in both of his campaigns. You saw it in him and Raphael Waro basically running as a as a ticket and this time he kind of ran as a ticket with Kesha Lance Bottoms. He is able to speak like I think very successfully both to kind of black voters who grew up in the civil rights tradition but also to some of these suburban women who were radicalized by the 2016 election. I mean I just I just want to go back for a second. \[snorts\] I was in such a bad place after 2016 and the first time I felt like a teeny bit of hope was when I went to the sixth [27:13](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1633) district which is where John Oaf was running in a special election and there were all these women who had not been political but had all this kind of social capital from like the PTA and you know the stuff that you do as a suburban mom and who all of a sudden became like political fiends. They could look at the map of the block and say like, "Okay, you know, this guy, he's not going to vote Democrat, but the wife might, and she gets home from work first, so that's when we've got to hit the door." [27:42](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1662) And I remember him saying to me, you know, I'm standing on the shoulder of these women. And he didn't win that race, but obviously that was like eventually a Democrat flipped that seat and that was the seat of his political career. And so I think he's always understood these kind of very outraged middle-aged suburban women who are very very important in the Georgia electorate. He also, you know, I've compared him to Peter Maguar in Hungary. That was the other race I covered this year was the Hungarian election. And what you saw with Peter Maguar was this combination of, you know, sort of like reclaiming Hungarian national identity, wrapping himself in the Hungarian flag, you know, reciting Hungarian poetry and just this relentless focus on Orban's corruption. John Oaf is always talking about the Mara Lago mafia. The Mara Lago mafia has taken American corruption to spectacular new heights. And so I think [28:47](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1727) one of the things that he did so effectively is that in the past it's been hard to get voters to care as much as maybe I think they should about all of Donald Trump's like authoritarian depradations. But what John Ozaf does is connect those and and this is also something that happened in Hungary. Connect those to the suffering you're feeling in your own life. It's not just that they're enriching themselves, but they're doing it at your expense. [29:12](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1752) Just think about this. When you are paying more for your health insurance, when a hospital in your community is closing down, Mike Collins voted to take that money out of your pocket and out of your community and give it instead to data center developers. And that's the problem, Mike. It's not just that you've hired half the Third Reich to staff your congressional office and you have promoted neo-Nazi content online. It's that you're robbing your constituents to subsidize your donors. I want to know if you will commit to voting to repeal that data center tax scam that you voted for. [29:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1786) I mean, I think that that so exemplifies the way he's on the one hand able to make this like kind of sweeping moral case against the right, but \[snorts\] then again kind of connect it to the emiseration of the voters. He is really outraged by corruption. you know, he um like a big part of his story was that he was a documentarian before he was a um politician and made documentaries about corruption and you know had someone he worked with killed um for his work on one of those documentaries. I [30:22](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1822) I think this is an important point about him because two things that are kind of in that answer you just gave that I think are worth drawing out a little bit. One is yeah he did not run a well I think Trump has done a lot of good things kind of purple state campaign right that is one move it would not have been a crazy move for him to try it's not what he did [30:41](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1841) he became I think such \[snorts\] an important part of the Democratic message in this election because what he showed is something that Democrats had long believed but they couldn't crack the code on which is that Trump's corruption should be a tremendous political itical vulnerability. That is not like a new insight. John Oaf, what happened was Oaf was the one who was able to weaponize the insight [31:09](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1869) into like consistent viral almost unanswerable clips. I I want to play one of them here that I think shows a couple of the things that he was able to do so well. Just listen to this. Last September, the president of Kazakhstan calls Donald Trump and says he wants to grant tungsten mining rights to an American company. And the very next month, Eric and Don Jr. get a stake in the American company pursuing the mining deal. 6 days later, 6 days after Prince Eric and Prince Dawn get their stake, Kazakhstan announces this company will get quote, "the largest known undeveloped tungsten resource in the world." [31:56](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1916) Few more weeks go by and then the US government run by their father \[snorts\] sets aside 1.6 6 billion of your tax dollars to fund and finance their mining project in Kazakhstan. All this while you pay more for gas, for groceries, for healthcare. And that's just the tip of the iceberg. Billions from foreign princes and oligarchs. Sweetheart real estate deals all over the world. Taxpayer funding to Trumpbacked companies. And listen, here's the bottom line. If you're involved in any of this, next year you'll be raising your right hand and swearing to tell the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. [32:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1966) So help you, God, in front of the United States Congress. This, I think, is why there's been something different about the reaction to Asso's victory. Because this is not, look how much money I brought back to Georgia for highways. I think this felt to many people like the case against Trump they had always wanted to see work and resonate [33:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1990) resonating not in San Francisco not in New York City but in Georgia where rode that case to an 18point victory [33:19](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=1999) right so actually I mean and John Ov is kind of amazing at constituent service right that's that's the underlying part of it but yeah I mean I think part of why this has been cathartic is that in some ways this feels like [33:35](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2015) the first election where people have responded to Donald Trump in what seems like a normal way, right? It's kind of how we expected them to respond to Donald Trump in 2016 and 2018 and all these elections when they didn't. It's like, you know, now there is this kind of popular revulsion that he was able to channel. I think one of his skills and this again I think goes back to his background as documentary filmmaker is that he knows how to take these like really wonky details right it's like hard to build a drama out of like tungsten mining rights in Kazakhstan but he knows how to tell a story about that and to make that story symbolic because the other challenge in talking about Donald Trump's corruption is that it is you know it's sort of beyond the realm of human consciousness to keep it all in mind at one time and So he's able to find these like extremely salient examples and talk about them in this [34:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2070) like condensed gripping way and bring people along with it. He has this very old school ortorial style. You know, you hear the black church in it, [34:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2080) but you also just hear the way they used to teach elecution. Well, and he and and Obama like [34:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2088) Obama, but I was watching him and Obama and I was watching their Obama actually does have a much less [34:54](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2094) formal style of speech than OF does. Of has a self-consciously formal construction. [35:01](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2101) Every political era has almost like I think the same structure which is somebody wins doing something unusual [35:07](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2107) and then everybody tries to ape them for a little while. you know, Donald Trump with his incredibly offthecuff weaving, looping, discursive, you know, rhetorical style. You know, the podcast election of 2024, can you go hang with the besties? \[snorts\] [35:23](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2123) And then everybody try to do that for a bit. You know, Gavin Newsome and his podcast, you know, they're all doing podcasts. [35:28](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2128) And then here comes John Of talking as if he's in the 18th century. And it's refreshing actually like, oh, you wrote a speech, [35:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2140) right? You then went back over it and you edited this, right? And he does and he's, you know, he he writes his own speeches, which is somewhat unusual. [35:48](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2148) He's like a very kind of earnest and reserved person, you know, he doesn't want to do like [35:53](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2153) Yeah. kind of casual off-the cuff kind of hanging out on a podcast. Nobody has heard about his workout routine. [36:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2160) Yeah, exactly. Even when they asked. Another another candidate with the OV bulkup. You've heard of I mean we've heard about other candidates workout routines because that was part of the mimicking the [36:11](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2171) Abdul say I think had an had someone from the times I believe interview him while he was working out. [36:16](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2176) Yeah, he did that with us on too. It's like he holds a lot backstage. He dribbles out his clips. It just it's interesting to me stylistically he was doing something disciplined in an era when almost one of the lessons people had taken was discipline is dangerous. Well, and he has a theory of this and you know how much of this is just kind of a rationalization because I think he is a sort of reserved and introverted person. But he also has a theory which is that there's power in not being in people's face all the time that like if you sort of hang back then when you do intervene people are more ready to listen or it will get you know his theory of attention is sort of like the opposite of the theory of attention that people have been learning for the last however many years. [37:03](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2223) Yeah. They should want more of you, not want less of you. Right. Exactly. That like Yeah, you should be maybe like a little bit koi. [37:09](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2229) So, Georgia, I mean, going plus 18 for the Democrats, going to the Democrats in the governorship Texas, you also had, and these were not races that you were on the ground for, but I think you understood the night was going to be something different when the needle began swinging on South Carolina. God, [37:27](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2247) for a while, I didn't believe that. I mean, that was that was healing. I was I was not ready to believe that. Mississippi. It looks like the Democrats are are going to win that seat. When I think of what is now different in American politics, it will be sustainably different. I'm not saying the South has realigned. People always talk about realignments. I think of this more as a deignment. [37:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2266) What has happened is the South has become unreliable now for the Republican party. They have to defend it. Demog going to have an opportunity to say this is what it is like when we govern Texas, when we govern Georgia, when you know you have a South Carolina senator, a Mississippi senator. And just the collapse of the Republicans southern wall. I mean, we never even called that the red wall because you wouldn't even have really thought to attack it. But now the entire political map is it's just a map again of states, right? It's like it's hard to imagine it's hard to even imagine what the 2028 like presidential looks like if people are fighting in Texas in Kansas [38:29](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2309) to say nothing how the candidate recruitment goes. I mean I think one thing the Democratic party was not doing in the way you might have thought was really thinking about who do you recruit in South Carolina. You know it ended up getting a great candidate but a lot of these were [38:43](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2323) were people who step forward themselves. People who step forward themselves. I mean, the Scott Column story in Mississippi is is is so interesting. Maybe it's worth saying for a minute how he ends up in this race because he could have had another job, [38:55](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2335) right? He was appointed to the federal bench by Joe Biden and he is blocked by Mississippi Senator Cindy Hyde Smith and then he decides to challenge her in the election [39:07](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2347) and now he's beat her for her Senate seat. We think we think we think we think. But yeah, what does it mean that the South has fallen for the Republicans? So, I mean, look, obviously in some ways I think we're still metabolizing this because it's just I can't think of another time when like so many of our political assumptions have just been exploded overnight. There was kind of an attempt after Mitt Romney was defeated to reckon with what it means to be like a conservative party in a multi-racial democracy. And then Donald Trump kind of blew that up. [39:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2386) But they're going to have to start thinking about it again with Donald Trump being on the way out, right? Because like \[snorts\] how does a candidate like JD Vance, you know, sort of even more, I think, aligned with white nationalist forces in the Republican party than Donald Trump. How does he win in a state like Mississippi if Mississippi's votes can't just be taken for granted from the outset? You know, and then at the same time, you know, maybe Marco Rubio is a better candidate for Mississippi, but maybe not a better candidate for an anti-war electorate. And so, you know, they just like their coalition has evaporated overnight. Um, but there's also all of these questions for the Democratic party because you're going to start hearing demands from some of the more left-wing candidates and some of those demands are going to be really popular and I think that again is worth keeping in mind. Right? There's a lot of [40:50](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2450) things that I think will both satisfy certain left-wing base voters and potentially help the Democratic Party solidify itself as a national party. And it's kind of been a while since we've understood the Democratic Party as a as a national party. And then there's another part of it that is less about like messaging and such and is also just about like investment and building and taking seriously that you need a strong Democratic party in those places. [41:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2490) And I think it then gets into kind of what happens in the places Democrats are more prepared to contest, right? Which is like the kind of like the string of elections in the Midwest. So you had Senate seats open um for for contest in [41:44](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2504) Ohio where Sher Brown won running uh again a very anti-data center campaign among other things in Minnesota where Peggy Flanigan won for the Democrats. Democrats weren't that worried about that one. um in Michigan where that became a very marquee seat because it was one of the few seats in the country where Republicans thought maybe they had a pickup opportunity. [42:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2524) Um Gary Peters, a Democratic senator from Michigan, had decided to retire the cycle. You did a bunch of reporting from from Michigan and and now kind of everybody knows how it went. But but before we get to Elsad, I actually want to talk about Haley Stevens. [42:18](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2538) Mhm. Who was the Democratic establishment choice in that election? I was never totally sure why. Um, but Schumer recruited her. Governor Whitmer endorsed her kind of towards the end of that primary hoping to push her over the the edge. Who was she and and how did she end up endorsing the Republican in the final days of the race? [42:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2560) Okay. So, I've been critical of Chuck Schumer's intervention in some of these races. There was obviously races where he was really, \[snorts\] really important, right? He was really important in like convincing Sherid Brown to run again. I mean, Haley Stevens, as far as I can tell, her main attribute, and this is ironic given how things went down, was that she was a team player, you know, and she was just like a kind of normie, solid Democrat who had a lot of patrons in the party, was like not just kind of normally pro- Israel, but incredibly passionately pro- Israel for kind of odd reasons because she's not Jewish or although she might become Jewish, she says, um, I always thought that was a huge mistake. I never understood why if you don't want if you don't want Abdul El Sayed to be the candidate either because you are like ideologically not in line with him or you think that he's a risk. [43:34](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2614) I mean Mallalerie McMurro was right there. Yeah, I like Mallerie McMurro a lot. I never understood why the establishment was moving towards Stevens. I like Elsa too, but I understood what the fears about him were forability reasons. [43:46](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2626) I always understood what happened here. Stevens, in addition to to some of the apac dimensions you just mentioned, she had originally won in a Trumpy district. Her her 2018 and 2020 Yeah. elections were in a a district that at least at that point was R plus4. And so there's a feeling that she could win over Trump voters and everybody's so used to Michigan being these like super tiny margins, [44:07](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2647) but you would watch her on TV. You would just wasn't an impressive candidate. It's not just I think that she's like, you know, kind of not super inspiring or charismatic. She's also I mean you could not see her campaign, right? Like I go to Michigan and I wanted to go to some of her events. I understand I wrote critically about her, but I write critically about a lot of people and their press people will still tell me where they're campaigning. Like there was so and there or you sign up as a member of the public. She did so few events where if you just as a member of the public as opposed to somebody who was like recruited to be there where you could go see her. I mean it was like it was it was bizarre. I don't know that I've ever seen anything like it. She just kind of was not accessible. Um you know and then meanwhile Abdul say is going everywhere. Mallerie McMurro is going everywhere. I mean I think [45:01](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2701) Mallalerie McMurro suffered from being the sort of Goldilocks candidate. Yeah. She was sort of in between the two of them. And then, you know, kind of once she dropped out of the race, especially once she I mean, I think it was always ugly, but it became especially ugly once it became a binary campaign. [45:16](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2716) But this is I I want to say that I think Schumer ended up doing a good job on a lot of measures here, right? They just, you know, they put money to Mississippi late in the game when people thought that might be a completely crazy move. I mean, he took some risks. He got Roy Cooper. The thing that I thought was interesting here and reflected to me a way in which a Democratic establishment needs to update its sense of what makes a candidate electable [45:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2740) is it does not care about and does not select for star power. It does not care about and does not select for charisma. It does not care about and does not select for people creating an authentic movement around them. Right. People being genuinely excited. But Elsad was exciting the hell out of people. [45:57](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2757) Yeah. Absolutely. and the fear that he was both a kind of mobilizing and countermobilizing candidate. He mobilized his people and mobilized people against him, which is I think why the Republicans [46:06](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2766) thought they might win. But there was, I thought, a sort of for a long time like a like an an unwillingness to grapple with what it meant that, you know, so many Democrats in Michigan were so excited about Elsa. [46:20](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2780) There's been a lot of attention to the Democrats who wouldn't vote for him, Haley Stevens being one of them. I think we would have seen something similar and maybe even larger on the other side. You know, voters who wouldn't have voted for Haley Stevens because of her [46:37](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2797) passionate commitment to Israel. But there are some lessons that are hard to draw just because like the the tide was so high that it kind of carried so many people along. Like Elsa, on the one hand, Elsa when he was being really cocky would say he was going to win by seven and that seemed ridiculous. and I think he won by seven. [46:56](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2816) And also that doesn't look like that's kind of an underperformance relative to the rest of the field. And so it's a little bit hard to draw direct lessons from it. But I absolutely think I mean I think you could see it in Michigan. You could definitely see it in in Maine, you know, and again, beating Susan Collins is no small thing, but you could feel the difference in energy between when Graham Platner was the nominee and when, you know, I went to a Troy Jackson event just um I have family in Maine and was visiting them. Went to a Troy Jackson event while I was there. You know, he seemed like a very nice man. [47:33](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2853) They didn't have the energy of the platinum event, but yeah, you could just feel Yeah. There's just like you could feel the sort of like deflation. Um, and yeah, I mean, the Democratic Party maybe is not in the It should be optimized for vibes. I mean, after the Obama experience, but um, [47:50](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2870) but it wasn't for a long time. Yeah. And it in some ways maybe still isn't. I want to play a clip of of Elsa's victory speech because I think it it it speaks to the way he specifically ran in Michigan. [48:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2880) We spoke of a brighter, a bigger, more hopeful Michigan. There's an astrourfed corporatefunded advertising campaign built to deceive and distract. Rather than try to unite us to contend with the crisis of gas or groceries, the opposition decided to try to divide us. At first, they pointed to my name and my faith as if to say, you know, he's a little different. [48:34](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2914) And when it didn't work, they tried to guilt me by association. And when that didn't work, they went all in on one of the ugliest campaigns we've seen in our lifetimes. [48:50](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2930) They might have been pointing to my name and my faith, but we all know that my name and my faith aren't the reason you can't afford your gas. Not the reason you can't afford your groceries. [49:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2940) Not the reason you can't see a doctor. I think you see there. I mean, you heard a sort of similar move at the end of basically every clip I've been playing is this continuous bringing back to like they're trying to distract you [49:13](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2953) from what you know, which is that everything is too expensive. In a way, what struck me as significant about Elsa's campaign is not, you know, did he underperform by a little bit. He didn't underperform by a lot, right? So he had a kind of normal performance for a, you know, Michigan Senate candidate. I think you could sort of, you know, debate whether it could have been five points more. [49:33](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2973) That's significant in a place like Michigan. On the other hand, you just saw like a hardcore populist [49:41](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2981) with like a huge amount of money spent to other him for his skin color and faith and name [49:47](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=2987) win the rust belt. Right. It worked. Right. That was I mean and that was the gamble, right? that that was the big test is that Bernie Sanders wing of the party has a theory of politics which is that this there's a kind of like more workingclass coalition that you can bring together with a relentlessly populist message and that you can kind of increase turnout to make up for maybe some of the like suburban moderates that you might lose. And it worked here. [50:19](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3019) It's also a reality. I mean Bernie Sanders is in his 80s at this point. M he doesn't have all that many obvious successors in the Senate. He does in the house with AOC. He actually has it in you know the New York City multi now [50:31](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3031) but but now Elsad comes in and is like a a can be a a champion for this politics there which you know when you think about the Democratic party is a big tent. [50:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3040) People tend to talk about that and what they're thinking about is like the right side of the tent expanding. Who do you run in Kansas? Who do you run in, you know, Iowa? But it also means having representation for like the left side of the tent and having that kind of creative energy in the party as well. [50:57](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3057) I mean, I could be wrong, but I think that the thing we're going to hear Abdul say talk about the most, my guess, is expanding Medicare. [51:05](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3065) And that is really, really popular, right? And kind of having somebody bang away at that over and over again is is it can kind of only I think can only help the party. I mean, it's it's also fascinating. I'm not hardly the first person to point this out that he ran on Medicare for all which we used to think was like an extremely um electorally like dangerous position and it barely registered as like a a point of attack. [51:33](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3093) It is a reflection of where the healthare system right now is that Medicare for all has never pulled as well as it has this year. [51:39](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3099) And you know you also Dr. Annie Andrews who you know really hammers home on healthcare. So, you've got these doctors coming into the Democratic um Senate caucus at a time when I think there is going to be a revisiting of healthcare and healthcare reform parting in the runup to to 2028. I want to move to to Kansas. The last time Kansas had a Democrat in the Senate was the 1930s. Um, you know, I remember about two months ago people started to tell me they thought Adam Hamilton really had a chance. And this is one of those I could see a poll number, but I had a lot of trouble believing the poll number, [52:16](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3136) right? And he did have a chance. He won convincingly. And so I want to get at the way he sold himself in Kansas. I think this clip is really telling. [52:28](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3148) And I have people say to me, I can't figure you out. Are you liberal or conservative? And my answer is yes, of course. And they're like, no, no. Which are you? And I'm like, I think we can be both. To be a liberal means to be generous of spirit, open to seeing things with new eyes and and to be and open to reform and and to be conservative means holding on to values or beliefs that are really important. We can be both of those things at the same time. And I know this about all of you. Even the most liberal in this room, you're conservative compared to somebody you know. And all of you who are more conservative are liberal compared to somebody you know. And so we need each other. [53:01](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3181) What did you make of his campaign? Again, I mean, I think we've talked about this idea of transcendence, right? But there is people I think are so exhausted with being like enraged all the time. There's been so many families that have been split apart over politics. You know, friendships split apart. And I think people want to move beyond that. And so, you know, we've paid a lot of attention to the way James Telerico did. This was maybe like a more sort of like slightly more sedate Midwestern version of that. Um, you know, and if you are like a wellspoken Democratic mainline pastor right now, I imagine that like Democratic operatives are coming in your door [53:43](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3223) because it does it has a signal, right? That's not what people are used to from Democrats. And so just hearing that that is what you do, right? You are a pastor. I think it opens the door from the beginning to, well, maybe this person is different, [53:56](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3236) right? And the fact that he has like a big, you know, it's a it's a big church, right? like people already he already has this kind of credibility in the community and he's already clearly you know he can't be painted as an interloper in the same way but yeah I just I think that you know we talked about like vibe shifts there is even maybe among people who voted for Trump there's an exhaustion and just like a desire for some sort of like national reconciliation [54:30](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3270) I think there's also a dimension here where looking at his campaign is a good moment to remember that populism even though we sometimes use it as like a synonym for progressive or leftist. [54:42](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3282) It's not like a position point on the left right spectrum cuz he went really hard against his opponent Roger Marshall for the way Marshall had hounded past patients over their debts and the amount of interest Marshall paid had demanded they pay. Some of them ended up in jail you know after he turned it over to collections. So Hamilton was running in some ways a very populist campaign against Marshall on the other hand running as you know both liberal and conservative ran as his line on this was I'm pro-life with a heavy heart. Um Scott Colum in Mississippi also ran as personally pro-life. I think both of them were also like pro-choice as a policy matter but he felt to me Hamilton more like the kind of candidate Democrats used to run like in the '9s. [55:23](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3323) Oh yeah for sure. Where there were like you know you had this sort of southern populist tradition but it was more culturally conservative. if it like wore its faith on its sleeve. He feels like something new now, but he actually felt to me like something very recognizable from more when I was growing up. [55:38](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3338) Yeah. No, I think 100%. Um I mean part of this is just about the both the declining power of what you know people call like the groups and also a sort of acknowledgment I think among a lot of Democrats that [55:56](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3356) on the one hand you know like abortion rights for example can can turn people out on its own um that you see you know Kansas did pass this abortion rights referendum a lot of these red states states did, but it doesn't necessarily motivate people to vote for Democrats. I mean, if anything, some of these referendums kind of gave people um permission to vote for Republicans because they had protected their abortion rights. And there's also, I think, just a sense that people want to feel like their representatives are sincerely grappling with these issues instead of sort of like repeating the team's rhetoric. the Republicans tried to make trans issues such a like so salient probably at least is just them just playing the hits from the last election. [56:47](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3407) But I also have a theory that voters reward the side that seems to care about that issue less. Right? that part of the reason it was damning for Kla Harris in 2024 wasn't because people were so concerned personally about um you know sort of whether people are getting their hormones in prison as just that it was such a statement about her priorities right and that it was like they care about this stuff they don't care about what you're facing [57:16](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3436) I'm interested in all the reporting you did as you watch us play out what you think ties all these candidates together. What this sort of new Democratic party with all this talent and and I want to note we've been focusing very strongly here on the Senate and a couple governors. It's like it's very hard to get at the House races because there's so many of them. But [57:36](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3456) you know, Democrats look to be on track for 250 to 260 House seats. It is an incredible incredible number. [57:44](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3464) So, I mean, this was happening there. This was all happening at every level. You know, state legislators flipped, but it does feel to me like there's a lot of new talent. You know, not all these candidates are millennials, but a lot of them are millennials. This feels like a very big moment of generational turnover in the Democratic party, which is one reason shared Brown and Roy Cooper's victories, which are both very, very, very impressive, I think, are getting a little bit less attention because I think people are looking to see what is this new generation going to be like? [58:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3490) What do you think this new generation is going to be like? What do you think is different about the Democratic Party that is emerging out of the 2026 midterm from the Democratic party that emerged out of the 2018 midterm? I mean fundamentally the focus on oligarchy which I don't even remember us kind of using that word in 2018 but right this kind of focus on oligarchy and corruption and some to some degree this is just a um function of the fact that Donald Trump has been so unleashed and has been able to um kind \[snorts\] of bestow so many favors on the codory of people around him. [58:52](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3532) But it has I mean and I' I've said this before, it has created the conditions for Democrats to be the anti- elite kind of anti-corporate, anti-billionaire class. And so that can mean a lot of different things in practice, right? I mean, I don't I would be very surprised if they're able to say raise taxes or institute a wealth tax anytime soon. There's going to be this debate in the new Congress about like, you know, move for hold Trump accountable or move forward. The middle of that ven diagram, I think, is investigating corruption, right? Investigating the sort of like siphoning off of public goods to all of these kind of vulturous figures. And so again, I think that you just have \[snorts\] it's not so much just a kind of an anti-Trump party where the most exciting new faces are kind of like faces of the resistance. their faces. Uh the you know the I think the the general the the like how do I say [59:59](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3599) this the gestalt or the um is people who believe that like our entire system has been just kind of like taken over and that the power of these kind of malevolent figures needs to be broken. I do think though that I both think that's true and in some ways I don't think this is going to be so salient between 2026 and 2028 because Donald Trump is going to remain the center of American politics [1:00:28](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3628) and Democrats are not going to have to manage some of their own internal tensions. [1:00:35](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3635) But the difficult thing about a big tent isn't so much running as one, but governing as one. And I I've been very interested to see, you know, right after the election, how some of the these different candidates are are speaking as they think about what is it going to mean to hold a Senate seat and and be popular among your constituents in Kansas, right? Or in Texas or in and and Terico went on Fox News the the day after the election. I think that's a signal unto itself, [1:01:02](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3662) but but I thought what he said was interesting. I am not interested in retribution. The people of Texas did not elect me last night. uh for retribution. They elected me to deliver for them to make their lives easier and better and less stressful. And that's what I plan to do. And I plan to do it even for the Texans who didn't vote for me. It's why I'm here on Fox News the morning after. [1:01:24](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3684) We appreciate you coming on. We really do. I have a last easy quick question for you. Are you so glad you did that Joe Rogan interview? Well, I I had a great time with Joe Rogan, and I'm always willing to go uh on to shows uh or podcasts with hosts who disagree with me on on any issue because we have to we have to build bridges in this country. We have to repair the ties that bind us together. That is the new form of politics that we pioneered in Texas. It's how we won by double digits in the largest red state in the country. And I think it can be a blueprint for our nation going forward. [1:02:00](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3720) This to me is a big difference between 2018 and 2026. 2018 I think the Democratic party still sort of felt this Trump thing was an aberration [1:02:10](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3730) that you know Butterfly had flapped his wings and James Comey had taken a laptop and Hillary Clinton had lost in a fluke and you might just be able to like bottle this thing back up, right? Like shove it back into the the basement of the country. And so you had this, you know, this resistance politics, but it was a little bit of a doubling down politics, right? It's like we thought Donald Trump was bad for these reasons in 2016. Now you can see he's really bad for these reasons, right? Let's like end this forever. And I think now you have this Democratic party that doesn't believe that, right? They got chasened after 2024, right? They got power back [1:02:45](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3765) and whatever they did with that power, it wasn't good enough, right? And instead Trumpism roared back stronger than before, more popular than before, and fundamentally more dangerous and destructive than before. And so the sense of what happens if you wield power in a way that pushes people back to the other side, I think that's much more going to be much more front of mind for Democrats, right? They still have to win in 2028 to say nothing of then what you know if they do win then what they do after that. I I mean to me the biggest difference there is their theory about how you peel people off from that coalition because the the kind of in 2018 and really going through the Kla Harris campaign, there was a sense that the people that you could win over were sort of educated upper middle class suburbanites who were appalled um you know and who kind of found Donald Trump like vulgar and were responsive to [1:03:39](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3819) appeals about democracy And I remember Gina Hinosa saying to me, she's like, the people that we're going to win are not the country club Republicans, it's MAGA. And I was like, really? You know, and obviously that can be overstated. There are a lot of people, I think, who were in MAGA for the mass deportations, who were in there for the cruelty. But there are people, you know, who again, and this is something that's hard for me to understand that people who still believed even after the first four years of Donald Trump that Donald Trump was going to \[snorts\] make their lives better, that his, you know, that he really was the man that they saw from the Apprentice, that he really was this sort of like, you know, financial genius, and that are going to be open to people who they feel like are not just kind of speaking to those to those anxieties and to the fact that their lives have been so hard, you know, [1:04:40](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3880) right? Who are speaking to them with respect um and who can do something for them. I mean, that's the hard part, right? Especially when you have Donald Trump in office. You can, you know, you can do certain things. They might be able to restore the ACA subsidies, but I think there's a sense that their potential coalition going forward is a different one than the one they imagined a few years ago. [1:05:04](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3904) I think that's a good place to end. I'll also find a question. What are three books you'd recommend to the audience? [1:05:08](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3908) So, I read almost exclusively fiction in my spare time. And one of the books, a book that came out this year that I absolutely loved and I think it did well, but I feel like I didn't hear people talking about it was this book called Good People by Patmina Sabbat. And it's a book about a very assimilated Afghan family in Virginia where the teenage daughter is killed in what may or may not have been an honor killing. It's about a killing, so it has, you know, these kind of like page turning thriller elements, but it's just like \[snorts\] such a good book about assimilation and the limits of assimilation. Um, it's like so heartbreaking. So anyway, that is one of them. A book I've been thinking about recently for no particular reason. Um, it's about the last days of a decaying dictatorial cult of personality. [1:06:11](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=3971) Is the feast of the goat by Mario Vargas Yosa, which is a book about the assassination of Raphael Chiro in the Dominican Republic. And I mean, it's a brutal book, so just like, you know, trigger warning. Um, there's scenes in it that maybe will like never leave my mind, but the reason I've been thinking about it recently is because you just get this sense on the one hand of this man whose presence is like all-encompassing and then the way it disappears. Again, it's like a book that you can't stop reading, but I think it has certain um echoes of this moment, although obviously not in a in a violent way. And then finally, I'm going to recommend I hope it's okay to recommend a book that I'm halfway through, only because as I'm reading it, I'm like, how come I had not heard of this book before? And maybe half your readers have and they're just like, where have you been? But this book called The Man Who [1:07:13](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=4033) Loves Dogs by Leonardo Pedora. Have you heard of it? No, I haven't. Okay. So, I I actually bought it a few months ago when I was going to Mexico City, and it didn't come in time, so I've only just started reading it now. It's this like big fat kind of like Russian novel style um historical novel about the assassination of Leantrosky, which you know, if you like I I actually kind of love these novels that are like novelizations of exciting historical events. And and this is, you know, the the assassination of Lantrosky is just like a fascinating and kind of wild story. Again, I'm \[snorts\] halfway through, so maybe it falls apart, but so far I um feel like it should be more of a classic than it is. [1:07:59](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/how-the-democrats-did-it-the-ezra-klein-show/transcript?t=4079) Michelle Goldberg, thank you very much. Thank you. Hey, hey, hey. ## Questions about this episode ### Who speaks in "How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show"? Ezra Klein (Guest), Michelle Goldberg (Guest). ### What is "How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show" about? Democrats won by tailoring strategies to diverse local contexts, selecting the right candidates and approaches for each region, from Texas to Michigan and Maine, revealing a emerging Democratic trajectory shaped by ground-level campaigns and practical, place-based messaging. The discussion analyzes what worked, what that signals for the party's future, and how intra-party dynamics may shift as a… ### What is mentioned in this The Ezra Klein Show episode? 101 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Democratic Party, Donald Trump, Michelle Goldberg, Ezra Klein, Republican Party, Texas. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it. ### How long is "How the Democrats Did It | The Ezra Klein Show"? The episode runs 1 h 8 min; the transcript is about 12,284 words in 150 timestamped sections. ## More from The Ezra Klein Show - [All analyzed episodes](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show) - [Books mentioned on The Ezra Klein Show](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/books) - [People mentioned on The Ezra Klein Show](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/guests) - [Sponsors mentioned on The Ezra Klein Show](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/sponsors) - [Topics mentioned on The Ezra Klein Show](https://reclip.me/podcast/the-ezra-klein-show/topics) About this transcript: the episode's spoken words as captioned on YouTube, split into timestamped sections. Reclip.Me locates every person, work and idea in the text, keeps the time it is first named, and quotes the words around it verbatim. Last updated November 7, 2026.