Knicks Take the NBA Cup, Details on CP3’s Exit, and Crawford Retires

What this episode is about

The discussion covers the recent NBA Cup victory by the Knicks and highlights the significance of Chris Paul's departure from the league, as well as Jamal Crawford's retirement. Insights from notable figures in basketball, including coverage by Ramona Shelburne, are examined to provide context and implications for the future of the NBA.

Key takeaways

• The NBA Cup: a birthday bash or a basketball revelation? Why not both!
• Celebrating birthdays at games proves cake and competition make for a perfect mix!
• Acknowledging when you're wrong? In sports and life, that's a true victory lap.
• Surprising finals contenders like Knicks and Spurs show the league's unpredictability is its charm.
• When favorite rappers have podcasts, is basketball and hip-hop the new ultimate crossover?

Who speaks in this episode?

• Max Kellerman (Host) · 33 min speaking
• Rich Paul (Guest) · 27 min speaking

What is discussed, and when

1. 0:00 – 10:00: NBA Cup, Knicks, Spurs, Ramona Shelburn
2. 10:00 – 20:00: Mike Brown, Knicks, Carl Anthony Towns
3. 20:00 – 30:00: Chris Paul, Knicks, Carl Anthony Towns, Ramona Shelburn
4. 30:00 – 40:00: Chris Paul, Terence Crawford
5. 40:00 – 50:00: Barack Obama, Canelo Alvarez, Terence Crawford, Adam Silver
6. 50:00 – 1:00:00: NBA Cup

Notable quotes from "Knicks Take the NBA Cup, Details on CP3’s Exit, and Crawford Retires"

• All right, Rich. The NBA Cup. You were there last night. We're going to have to get into that.

  about Buddy Rich · at 0:04

• Ramona Shelburn's story, she did a great job as always, but it is for basketball fans, and I'm a basketball fan. sitting back and looking at the NBA, it raises questions that I need.

  about Ramona Shelburn · at 1:17

• All right. Listen, you saw Bug Crawford retired yesterday.

  about Terence Crawford · at 2:40

• Is it more likely that the Thunder get there? Sure. Or the But I would say I like the Knicks at least as much as anyone out of the East, maybe more. And I think the Spurs are…

  about Knicks · at 5:09

• I think Mike Brown has saw enough basketball for sure. I think really good coaches could not be afraid to throw a guy. but Kic has showed he's an NBA.

  about Mike Brown · at 10:08

• The Spurs found new oil with those two young guys. And obviously, Fox is Fox and Wimy's going to be Wimi. But take nothing away from your New York Knicks cuz I'll tell you,.

  about Spurs · at 13:40

• What I've seen from Carl Anthony Towns in the last, let's say, month is strides in that area. And I think that changes the entire Knicks team.

  about Carl Anthony Towns · at 16:22

• Chris Paul comes in, even if he's aware of that, thinking, Yeah, but I'm still going to compete. Right? When he competes, they see he's actually pretty good. The right the bench is beating.

  about Chris Paul · at 25:18

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

• Buddy Rich — Person · Co-host / main speaker (industry insider perspective) · 1 mention · first at 0:04
  Primary on-mic counterpart to Max; drives analysis on NBA Cup, Knicks/Spurs game, and Chris Paul/Clippers dynamics; also shares personal anecdote about dinner with Barack Obama.
• Chris Paul — Person · Referenced athlete / case study in leadership-team fit · 12 mentions · first at 0:59
  Central to the Ramona Shelburne-reported Clippers story; discussed as a veteran leader whose competitiveness and voice can clash with coaching/organizational expectations.
• Mike Brown — Person · Referenced coach / tactical exemplar · 11 mentions · first at 9:49
  Credited for late-game lineup/ball-handling decisions and for influencing Knicks style (pace, bench trust, ball movement); used to contrast coaching philosophies.
• Terence Crawford — Person · Referenced athlete (boxing) / discussion centerpiece in boxing segment · 4 mentions · first at 2:40
  Used as the anchor for a discussion about greatness, pound-for-pound rankings, and what defines an all-time elite career; discussed in context of retirement and legacy.
• Ramona Shelburn — Person · Referenced journalist / reported source · 3 mentions · first at 0:52
  Her reporting frames the Chris Paul–Clippers conflict discussion; treated as credible insider coverage that prompts the hosts’ analysis.
• Carl Anthony Towns — Person · Referenced player / performance inflection point · 3 mentions · first at 15:43
  Used to explain why the Knicks may have leveled up—specifically, perceived defensive improvement and ability to defend in space, changing team ceiling.
• Adam Silver — Person · Referenced executive / decision-maker · 2 mentions · first at 6:37
  Discussed as the NBA commissioner responsible for the NBA Cup format; the hosts evaluate and partially retract earlier criticism of the tournament structure.
  Adam Silver, Senator, you owe my client an apology. Apology. This is the kaf commitment.
• Mitch Robinson — Person · Referenced player / on-court impact example · 1 mention · first at 9:02
  Highlighted as a ‘championship player’ due to offensive rebounding and clutch defense; used to illustrate value of defense/role players in big games.
  Mitch Robinson grabbing all the offensive boards. Listen, Mitch Robinson is one of those dudes who you see and you go, That's a championship player. and people don't see guys who are known for their defense as clutch a lot of the.
• Barack Obama — Person · Referenced public figure / anecdotal centerpiece · 5 mentions · first at 42:52
  Appears in a personal story about Rich needing to leave a small dinner; used for humor and social context, not sports analysis.
  With truffles. There was crab. And then there was a great conversation being had by our 44th president, Mr. Barack Obama.
• Canelo Alvarez — Person · Referenced athlete (boxing) / comparator in legacy discussion · 2 mentions · first at 40:17
  Mentioned as a marquee opponent used to contextualize Terrence Crawford’s status and public recognition; functions as a benchmark name in boxing stardom.
  Fight him because as soon as the other stars fought him, he beat the brakes off him. and Terrence Crawford who just beat Canelo Alvarez. He's on top of the world. He's a major…

Companies & orgs

• Knicks — Company · Case study · 13 mentions · first at 5:13
  Discussed as a team performing well in the NBA Cup and their potential in the league.
• Spurs — Company · Case study · 2 mentions · first at 5:17
  Mentioned as a competitive team in the NBA Cup and their performance in the tournament.

Places & events

• NBA Cup — Event · Core topic · 7 mentions · first at 0:04
  Main discussion topic about the NBA's in-season tournament and its impact on the league.
  All right, Rich. The NBA Cup. You were there last night. We're going to have to get into that.

Media & podcasts

• Love Island — Media · Incidental mention · 1 mention · first at 0:38
  Mentioned in passing as a show someone from the NBA Cup was associated with.
  I didn't know. Well, she's in New York, but she was excited about it cuz she saw someone from I think Love Island there.

Sponsors

• FanDuel — Company · Sponsor · 1 mention · first at 3:02
  Presented as the sponsor of the podcast segment, promoting their betting services.
  All right. Game over is presented by FanDuel. FanDuel's got it all. Same game parlays, quick bets for jumping in live and your way so you can build the bet that fits your play. Plus, don't miss.

Full transcript with timestamps

0:04 All right, Rich. The NBA Cup. You were there last night. We're going to have to get into that.

0:09 I told you. You told me. I spent my birthday at the NBA Cup. You did? Although you had your birthday party the night before I was there.

0:16 I mean, I know it was supposed to be a launch party for the show. Really? But yeah, but it was great. It was a hybrid. All good.

0:22 If you have a birthday cake and they sing happy birthday, that's a birthday party.

0:25 Fair point. Yeah, I take that. Yeah. Yeah, it was great. My daughter uh was excited about it. My my youngest daughter because she saw

0:33 Why did you bring her? I didn't know. Well, she's in New York, but but she was excited about it cuz she saw someone from I think Love Island there.

0:40 Oh, yes. Oh, she was very excited about that on TikTok or whatever it was. Yeah.

0:44 She was great, too. Yeah. So, all right. So, I'm going to do a Mia Kulpa on the NBA Cup. That's That's coming up. I got That's all I was saying.

0:52 That was excellent. Um and then did you see the Ramona Shelburn? That's my home girl, Ramona Shelurn on on the Clippers, the this Chris Paul story.

1:02 I saw clips of it, but I mean, yeah, that's I'm well oiled in that space. So, that is so

1:08 Well, I would say I want to pick your brain about what you're going to say about this. I want to know.

1:12 I can I can I can definitely um Yeah, we could talk about that. Ramona Shelburn's story, she did a great job as always, but it is for basketball fans, and I'm a basketball fan. sitting back and looking at the NBA, it raises questions that I need.

1:28 We pause, but that was a pause. Like, I'm very tenured in understanding what happens throughout the league. Let me correct that.

1:36 That's why you're the guy. I was like, I couldn't wait for this morning. I'm like, I can't wait to hear what Rich has to say about this.

1:41 I correct that just in case Cam and Mace is watching. Listen. Oh, yeah. Cam was there

1:48 or Joe and Jada because you know, we got to cuz see, here's the thing. We're Cam was there. I was very excited.

1:52 Here's the thing though, Max. We are a different pod, right? But we have to make sure that we're, you know, because I I I these guys, they will they will really have something to say to me about certain things. So, we got to be careful.

2:08 Okay. How we would normally say things, we we got to just You mean about the party?

2:15 No, just about like certain comments like I I just said something that I caught. You may not have caught it because you're not even thinking about it from that perspective.

2:23 But I gotta deal with people like I gotta deal with group chats and people like

2:27 I gota [snorts] Joe and Jaden Cam and Mace and and they you know it's different.

2:31 Who knew that all my favorite rappers would have pods one day? It's actually pretty dope.

2:36 I've done a you know like Nor I still have to do Nory but yeah. All right. Listen, um you saw Bug Crawford retired yesterday.

2:45 Yeah. Well, I'm I'm gonna I have some stuff to say about that. And then maybe we could do some NBA trades, you know, like the the season is upon us where people really want to hear about that. I think we can. And and I think that's the show today. It sound good.

3:00 Sounds great. Yeah. Let's go. All right. Game over is presented by FanDuel. FanDuel's got it all. Same game parlays, quick bets for jumping in live and your way so you can build the bet that fits your play. Plus, don't miss out on holiday offers and surprises all month long. Download the FanDuel app or head to fanduel.com/gameover. To get started, 21 and over and present in select states or 18 and over and present in DC, Kentucky, or Wyoming. Gambling problem? Call 1800 gambler or visit rg-help.com. Call 18887897777 or visit ccpg.org/hat in Connecticut.

3:54 Rich, we came out on on this show our first pod uh last Monday and I said I like the NBA Cup. I don't want to get it twisted now. It's like no revisionist history. I didn't like I said I it's just eh like we could do better.

4:09 I felt like you was hating a little bit. I know. I know. There there was like if if you had to say the positive or not like I was but I really maybe I was I didn't feel like I was but in retrospect maybe.

4:20 But here's the thing. It's okay to say yeah I was kind of hating and I was wrong.

4:26 If if if we had more people with that mentality to be able to say you know what I was hating a little bit but I was wrong. the world would be a better place

4:36 if someone thinks they're never wrong. No, it's not even that. It's just acknowledging that you were hating a little bit.

4:42 I think I guess in retrospect, well, let's put it this way. The the distance between my perception of how good it is and how good it actually is was pretty wide. Yeah.

4:51 Um it's great. It's great for the league. It that was and those teams that was great. I thought I was there last night.

5:01 Um just great basketball. Great basketball. Really was. and and and the fact that it is potentially a preview of the finals. I mean, is it more likely that the Thunder get there? Sure. Or the But I would say I like the Knicks at least as much as anyone out of the East, maybe more. And I think the Spurs are one of the top four teams in the West. Well, I think what was encouraging about it was, and I think this is what you're trying to say, yes, it could be a preview of the finals, but the fact that we have optionality in the preview of finals situations, if it's the Knicks and Spurs, if it's if it's the Knicks and Thunder, if it's the whoever it may be, Houston and someone else, it's just you're excited to watch who's ever there, which is is always a good thing for the league.

5:50 No doubt about it. there. That was like um that was a it had not exactly a postseason feel, but like you I remember you saying, "Hey, would it be better if it was like the college tournament?" I don't know. I was thinking more about that. I don't know how you do that because the way they do it now, it's only the championship is not a regular season game,

6:11 right? Like everything else doesn't Championship is actually if you win the championship. It's crazy. I said this to um I was telling LeBron this. I'm like the only thing you haven't done is play like a 83 game season. But actually he did. He won the NBA draft.

6:27 That's true. So that's the 83rd game. Um but it doesn't count in your regular season, but everything else does. So I don't know how they would do an inseason tournament.

6:37 Like I think they I like I So Adam Silver, commissioner, I think my criticism was uh incorrect. I think this is the right way to do it.

6:47 I feel like Tom Hagen now. Yeah. Adam Silver, Senator, you owe my client an apology. Apology. This is the kaf commitment.

6:58 Yes, you have to because here because here's the thing. We're in the House on American Activities Commission.

7:02 When you have a brand as strong and relevant as the NBA, the fact that Adam didn't sit on it and wanted to even try to make it better, that's an admirable thing.

7:15 And I do think that they're not I gave him credit for that last week. Yeah, take the credit now because

7:19 I'm saying I thought it my the the Mia Copa for me is I'm like good good idea, good step in the right direction. Now you can make it better. I don't know how they would do that at this moment. I think that was really really good.

7:32 But but the it's two parts. The good came from the players actually playing hard and embracing it.

7:39 Yeah, you have a million to win and they will. If they play the Allstar game like they played the NBA Cup, we'll really be smoking them. would be cooking strong. But there is some things like I imagine the semi-final game being in Vegas. Maybe they make that in market instead maybe

7:58 and just do the championship game in Vegas. There is a world where you can move the championship game around to different sites if you wanted to do that, right? So on so forth. So you can play it in, you know, cooler venues if you build it out.

8:13 I'm sure I'm sure he'll tweak it as time goes by. There's some things to do, but the fact of the matter is

8:17 it doesn't need any overhaul. The most important part about the NBA Cup that I that I take away from last night was that it's not only about the money for the starters, the the guys on the end of the bench. It's definitely only about the money for them because a million it's such a a change for their season, right? And everything in between. You saw coaches Mitch Johnson got a technical foul last night. if you know Mitch, he's not really doing that, but he was so passionate they wanted to win. And I just felt like

8:51 um you know, San Antonio actually they were tired. They I think towards the end of the game, they wore it down a little bit. Shots started to get shot.

8:59 Let's talk about the actual game because every like there'd be a lot of focus on Mitch Robinson grabbing all the offensive boards. Listen,

9:08 Mitch Robinson is one of those dudes who you see and you go, "That's a championship player." and and people don't see um guys who are known for their defense uh as clutch a lot of the time. He is a clutch defensive player. Like he is a not not your brand. I mean, you know, like

9:28 No, I know what you're saying. With a C. He is He clutch one way now. It's with a K.

9:32 It's with a K. It's being changed. He's a guy who when you need him the most plays his best. And that was apparent through the playoffs last year. And it was apparent last night. But I I got to tell you, I think the key to that game, and I I want to say it was Stan Van Gundy who brought it up on the broadcast was Mike Brown's Mike Brown's handling of the game late when he brought Kolic in at the end of that game to have another ball handler decision maker on the floor. To me, that's what that game for the Knicks.

10:08 I think Mike Brown has saw has saw enough basketball for sure. I think really good coaches could not be afraid to throw a guy. I mean, but Kic has showed he's an NBA player capable of playing in those minutes,

10:21 but he's not one of your five best players. A lot of coaches want their five on the floor.

10:25 Play in college. First of all, he's a competitor. He's going to make winning plays. He shoots it well, right? And he's just steady. And sometimes you need those steady guys, especially in those moments. And and a coach like Mike Brown, he's gonna trust a steady guy over anything because he hates turn I'm tell you right now, he hates turning the ball over and he wants to make sure you're going to compete. Two things with Mike Brown cuz he's old school, right? When I first met Mike Brown, I never forget, he he he he got the job in Cleveland and we went out to dinner and back then coaches used to have to dress wear their suits and Mike Brown I I used to get on him all the time because I said, "Mike, you're going to fracture your big toe cuz you stumping them Stacy Adams." You know, back then the the coaches used to go it was a store in um it was a store in Atlanta that all the when they go to Atlanta I'm telling you

11:26 they used to buy so many of these dress shoes they used to buy and I was making this joke about Mike Brown now he put the Chucks on now they save they he put the or he wears Vans or whatever you know um shoe that he wears but I know Mike Brown and I know the type of basketball he wants to play so I'm not necessarily surprised by that. I also think yesterday the minute restriction on Wimby man like that's just a game changer because if Wimby can play 32 minutes a game um his normal minutes it's only the second game back after being out for so long a

12:00 lot of the se of the first half in the second quarter he's just not on the floor changes the game

12:04 but also the rhythm and the continuity because now I think Wimy's sweet spot on the floor is the nail right

12:11 right so if you if you post him at the For all you guys out there, the nail is two corners of the foul line.

12:20 If you post him there, now he's he shoots the ball well enough to make that 15-footer. Now, if you bring the late double, depending on who you have in the short corner, if that guy is Vel or Champagne or even when guys like uh Castle gets his castle in the big three last night, even when a guy like Castle saying a lot right now and Harper gets [clears throat] those jumpers consistently.

12:46 Yeah, that's going to when you're going to see San Antonio get really really good. If you have a guy like Pal Gasol in the old days in the pinch post and he's making decisions, he's like a like a not exactly not a stretch four, but a four who can shoot a jump shot and make decisions with the ball like a second point guard even if he's not handling like that. That's a game changer. But and what you just said about Castle, I totally when if you look at Castle and Harper, those guys, the question is going to be if those guys develop a a three to the point where they they don't have to be hitting 38%, but even 33 to 35% from three, like just respectable enough. And that's really gonna allow Wembby to be that kind of, you know, in the old days they might call it a point center or something like that is is that's gonna be impossible. That's gonna be impossible.

13:40 The Spurs found new oil with those with those two young guys. And obviously, you know, Fox is Fox and and Wimy's going to be Wimi. But take nothing away from your New York Knicks cuz I'll tell you,

13:50 they played the better game last night. And you know what Bronson's going to give you?

13:56 OG actually shot the ball. He had five threes last night, which you know, he's he's capable of making threes.

14:02 OG is shooting the ball very well this whole year. But the play of Jordan Clarkson,

14:09 Mitchell Robinson off the bench and Tyler Kick and it was one more, but they also was missing McBride.

14:16 Yeah. Landry Shamid wasn't wasn't dressed. So, they was missing a lot of their shooting and they still won the game. So, the Knicks, look, like I said, I think the Knicks are, and we could talk about this later, but I do think the Knicks, just watching them, they're surface level trade away from really being able to cement themselves. I wouldn't get I text Timothy Shalom this morning and I said, "Are you really celebrating the end season championship?" You should, but I'm just asking because I I wanted to know. Um, but I think um,

14:53 what do you say? I don't know because we started shooting the show got. But I'll see you later.

14:58 But I do think that they are surface level trade away from really positioning themselves. But in things like this, this shouldn't be a time where you sit back and be complacent. You should actually get

15:10 Can I say something? Let me let me here's the thing that I think has changed with the Knicks because you know two years ago they're in the playoffs against the Pacers and the Knicks were clearly better than the Pacers and only lost that series cuz they were hurt. They had guys who couldn't play. The following year though the Pacers were clearly better last year. The Pacers were clearly better than the Knicks. They're just better because the Pacers had evolved and and gotten better as a group. It was clicking right and the Knicks hadn't quite taken that step. You know what's changed to me about the Knicks over the last couple weeks? When you think about Carl Anthony Towns coming out of college, he's the number one overall pick. Not just because, oh my god, he can shoot it. He can he can actually play seven feet tall, do all that, but because in the modern NBA, you're big. It needs to be able to

15:59 defend out in space. And he's built like and has the ability to be that guy. So part of it with him was the projection of the kind of player he could be in the NBA. And what it turned out to be with Carl Anthony Towns for a lot of his career is the offense is what we thought it would be. The defense the defense didn't follow. That's the difference between him and an MVP caliber player. What I've seen from Carl Anthony Towns in the last, let's say, month

16:26 is strides in that area. And I think that changes the entire Knicks team. That's the Mike That's the Mike Brown effect. I I think I and I think Mike Brown was when Jaylen Brunson got the MVP last night, but the MVP to me was the coach. The MVP to me was Mike Brown last night.

16:42 Well, two things Mike Brown I believe added to the Knicks. And one Tibido always had two. The difference is, and I think Mike actually got this from his time with the Warriors, is he's added he both him and Tibs, you got to you have to give a valiant effort,

17:00 right? They they are they are effort guys. No question about it. But I think where Mike Brown makes a difference is now pace.

17:09 And when you talk about the Pacers beating the Knicks, the Pacers beat the Knicks because of their pace and depth.

17:14 Pace of play. Yeah. But really pace of And they had guys that really But wait, let's stop right there. The the the difference between Mike Brown and Tibido to me is it's a Mike Brown's more sophisticated. Mike Brown understands that yes, we'd like to win today, but the way we're going to win is important because as you said, a lot of the NBA regular season is getting ready for the playoffs if you're a good team. And Mike Brown understands, we can't have five guys getting all the minutes and then have no bench to have McBride that we and maybe Mitch that we can rely on.

17:49 But I can't say I'll say Mike Brown, again, taking it away from Tibs, is just as sophisticated. You know why? Because he learned because we don't know if what Mike Brown would have done prior to but knowing go like if you're coming

18:05 if you're coaching after someone else is just there and it's up to you to recognize what they were doing

18:12 then you start at a certain so right you start like Rick Carile and Larry Brown with the Pistons back in the same Rick Carile get you all the way there and then the guy put you over the top.

18:20 I don't know if that's sophistication but it's definitely an astute thing. I think Mike Brown I I hear what you I think Mike Brown I think this hits you. I think it hits Mike Brown. I think it hits a lot of people in LeBron James's orbit throughout his career where they don't get enough credit for what they've done because the snap judgment, it's not that people are being lazy. It's that people are living their lives and they got to have a lot of information to take in and come to these kind of quick conclusions is well he's there because of LeBron James.

18:50 Well, he got an, you know, people think of him this way because of LeBron James. I think Mike Brown suffers from that when in fact he it's what's not recognized is the kind of coach he is. What he just like as a Knicks a as a as a little kid who used to be a big Knicks fan in me watching that it's like when you watched the Tibs team you knew that they're not going to win a championship. They're going to burn out. They don't have a bench. He doesn't trust the bench. They're not going to be ready when they're called upon. And this team completely different. Completely different. And you brought up Clarkson, Mitch

19:22 and and and Kohic. Yeah, that's Mike Brown. That's using what you got and and and you know, not overworking your guys. And I think Knicks fans should be feeling good about the way they're going to be positioned in the playoffs. What I saw yesterday different than what I saw before um especially the previous Knicks teams was he was able to get Brunson off the ball

19:46 and and not that not that he's getting them off of it to get it back in different ways that makes the defense

19:54 kind of shift and move around a little bit. Work a little harder. Especially when you're putting a bigger guy on on Brunson because that's the only way because he's Brunson is very brric. Yep. and he and he can he's crafty as well and he really shoots the ball really well from three when if you go under or or you know catch and shoot and he and and obviously he comes up in big moments but that's what I see different I see I see a guy like Brunson being able to get off the ball go back and get it get into his pick and roll actions and then again you got guys slipping you got guys they're advancing the ball you're hitting the short corner you're making Right. The ball is moving a lot more than it did in the Tibs offense, but

20:39 the bench ball is moving. Adjustments are made. But I still think I still think if I'm the Knicks and I'm looking at our situation, I'm saying,

20:50 "Okay, we're we're we're good. We're good. The East is a little depleted. It's a little

20:57 Who do you want to bring in?" All over the place. I I again I definitely think it's from a guard perspective um if you're dissecting if you break it what is your playoff rotation because you got to cut it to eight or nine right

21:12 yeah I think we know what it is so so if you're looking at that I'm really looking at how do I improve the back four

21:21 well that so who drops out so you have your five starters plus Mitch uh Clarkson McBride Kohic. Who's Who's dropping out of that?

21:32 Oh, you forgot Shamut, too. Shamut, that's five guys off. You're right. I mean, you could play you could play 10. You're not playing 12,

21:39 but one of you're not playing one of those five you're not playing if you're bringing in someone else.

21:42 You see, I think in the playoffs, right? And this is why depth matters. And I always say this to teams, and this is what players have to understand about being role players in the playoffs. It's about each series and the style of the fight in each series,

21:58 right? There may be a playoff series where Clarkson matters, right? And you have to lean on that,

22:05 but there also may may be a playoff series where you need Kick, you need two ball handlers. So, it's it's about having that depth.

22:12 When you say bring in a guard, are you talking about a a guard who can also defend, a guard who can playmake, a guard who can shoot? You're not going to get all those or it's a start. What are you looking I think I think a little bit more size.

22:24 Okay. Right. And that can and that can also play with with Brunson. Mhm. Um I like Josh Hart starting, but Josh Hart's the type of player he's going to do whatever you ask him to do anyway. If this is the issue with the Knicks structurally, Josh Hart needs to shoot it better from long range that if Josh Hart shot the three, like he's had a couple seasons in his in his career where if he's not doing it well enough, if he's if he shot the three well enough, let's say at least 35% or above for the season, then they're then he's a then the starting five is the way you want it. The fact is the reason you think that about Josh Hart because he does everything else is he doesn't shoot it well enough.

23:10 Yeah. Well, he's never gonna shoot it like a Desmond Bane would shoot it. But maybe I'm trying to think of a player that kind of turned themselves into a shooter like that on a good team.

23:24 A guard. A guard that that came in known for their defense. Yeah. Hustle. You know, Josh Harts get gets extra. Tony Allen have ever have any seasons where he shot it a little I mean it happened Tony has shot it

23:37 yeah he shot it okay a couple I mentioned Draymond the other day not a guard but Draymond had a season where I think he shot 38 from three

23:44 if they win that game seven he was the MVP of the finals for sure but I mean I I I think that um

23:50 I think when you have a guy like Carl Anthony Towns if you're playing him at the five right then you have enough spacing on the floor that Josh Hart should be getting really good looks you know like Everyone on the floor can OG's shooting it well. Male Bridges shoots it well. Obviously Brunson Josh Hart's getting he should be getting good looks enough for him to shoot it well. He's not. But when Josh Hart shoots it well, they look like teams.

24:16 Not to turn him into somebody he's not going to beat. Just go and go get that guy. Well, just going I'm just saying I never like to be complacent and sometimes I think teams, you know, you ride this regular season without and then you get to a place and you need something. It's like no.

24:34 Who? Who, Rich? Who? Well, I have to think about it more. You know who's available?

24:40 Who? Chris Paul. That's not size though. I want to get it to Chris Paul. Come on, Max.

24:45 I want to get it to Chris Paul because Ramona Shelburn has an article and people watching this have are I'm sure curious about what you're going to say about this because I'm curious about what you're going to say about this. Let me let me let me set this up for you. So, in the article, what comes out is that the Clippers brought Chris Paul in not just as a feel-good look, he'll end his career here, but they want a lowmaintenance veteran on the bench who can provide veteran leadership. He's not going to be getting a lot of minutes.

25:18 Chris Paul comes in, even if he's aware of that, thinking, "Yeah, but I'm still going to compete." Right? When he competes, they see he's actually pretty good. The the right the bench is beating the starters in scrimmages, stuff like that. And he his numbers are decent, right? Look at that. And that creates a problem for the Clippers. And now Chris Paul on my old radio partner here in LA, Marcelus Wy, used to say, "When personality trumps production, you got an issue." And Chris Paul on his best day could be a pain in the ass, right?

25:51 Because he was a vocal leader who was getting it like wants every and this is no longer his best day. So you had this dynamic where even though he's setting up meetings with with uh Frank and with uh and with Tailoo and and and he's trying to clear the air, nothing's really getting done and eventually he's cut loose. So, the reason I'm interested in what you're going to say about this is from where I'm sitting just looking at the as an NBA fan, it's hard to tell. You imagine it's some of both, but it's hard to tell. How much of this is pain in the ass Chris Paul who's not even like he once was, and how much of this is the Clippers clippering because they were a complacent team this year. if he's getting on guys to get it right and to he wants guys to spend more time together off the court. He wants to build relationship build and everyone's kind of lacadasical about that he has a point like maybe they would be better

26:48 with that. How much who who's to blame here and by how much do you think? Well, I think all ideas are good until they're bad. Right. we can sit here and come up with every idea. And in the summertime when you're trying to put a roster together, you you're envisioning what guys probably used to do or what they were really good at and you're trying to feel that.

27:10 Um I'm not sure it's definitely a shared accountability here, right? Um the fact of the matter is we've known who Chris Paul has been his entire career

27:24 and you can't change a tiger stripes. It's just not going to happen. So to expect him to sit at the end of the bench regardless but regardless what was said,

27:36 that's just not who he is. He's a competitor when he when he wakes up. What about the reaction to what he was trying to do? Like in your in from what you know and understand and in your opinion, how much of that is, yo, Chris, calm down a little bit. And how much of that is no Clippers, he's telling you the right stuff?

27:53 Well, here's the thing. your reaction is the problem. But here's the thing. I think you have to you have to read the room. And in Chris's case, I think he again, I don't know what took place, but I think he has to read the room in terms of I'm no longer that guy. And I got to look and see who my counterparts are. You look down the bench. You got a guy like Jeff Van Gundy. We all know Jeff Van Gundy. Jeff Van Gundy's a old school coach. He tried to clear the air with Van Gundy, too, by the way.

28:24 Lawrence Frank is a old Lawrence Frank is a old school coach at heart. That's who he is.

28:30 Chris Paul's an old school player. But here's what I'm saying. He has the same mentality they do.

28:35 But what was being Yeah. But but now you have to have the conversation of what role do you guys actually want me to play? If they say to you, Chris, we want you to be the sixth coach, and you agree to that, then that's the deal, right? But now here's the other part of that. Now you have your peers. And regardless what your peers may say in front of you, cuz you know one thing about athletes, they do not like confrontation.

29:05 They don't like it. They just don't like it. Now, I'm not saying like competing and you get that's not confrontation. I'm talking about confrontation,

29:13 interpersonal confrontation. They don't like that. So now we don't know what was being talked about, what was being said.

29:20 Well, let me say one of the things in the article that came out was Chris Paul was changing defensive coverages and stuff like like he was and and when they would change and the coaches were like, "Why' you why'd you switch it up?" They'd say that they'd say basically what Chris told them and then and then Chris was like, "That was a suggestion, Rich. The reason that's instructive to me from where I'm sitting,

29:44 that's not wrong. The reason it's instructive to me is if the players are taking his suggestions or even taking what he says as authority to me that means the players who are on the field of play on the court think that there's wisdom in what he's saying.

30:00 Well, there there's no think but they're losing every game. So, why are the coaches beefing with him trying to make it better?

30:07 But here's my thing. You don't get a guy that's played that long that does not have wisdom.

30:12 Of course, let's just be clear about that. Now, again, it matters what the conversation was. Put it this way. When Andy Reed wants to make a play call, he leaves up to if Pat Mahomes sees something and he calls an audible, he has he has all the autonomy to do that right? I'm pretty sure in everywhere CP's ever played,

30:40 he's had that if he sees something as well as all of the great players, right? Not anymore.

30:47 But but here's what I'm saying. All the way up until whatever conversation was had and if the conversation was had to say, "Hey, we understand it, but instead of you going to the players, bring it to us." That's one thing.

31:02 Okay. if that if that conversation was not had and he's just doing a natural thing because at the end of the day

31:10 you're in the moment, you know, and you have to be able to feel your way through the basketball game regardless.

31:16 It's not color by numbers. Right. Right. Right. But here's the other thing. I see a lot of players, ex players, etc. They talk about this and they talk about their discourse and things like that. One of the biggest issues on any team, just like one of the biggest issues in any band, right, is being able to be on one accord. Because no matter what, in locker rooms, in bands, in rap groups, there's still a competitive nature amongst each other, even while being on the same team.

31:51 And that's supposed to actually make everything better, but it's supposed to be according to one kind of unit. Yes.

31:57 Yeah. And and that was that also came out in the article is that there was a sense that he was undermining the coaching staff.

32:03 Well, this is what I'm saying. If it's gotten to that point and then that means there needs to be a conversation. If there was a conversation and then there was a still and there there was still an action. Okay. Then there was another conversation and there was still an action. What I'm trying to understand is at what point does it get to where you have to send someone home at that level?

32:30 So that's So let's stop right there. That's that's what I'm really asking is like this is what I'm so curious about. And maybe it's an unanswerable question right now, but

32:40 I think I'm asking I'm wondering who was right. Like in the end, I understand that you're laying out the dynamic, but in the end, to me, it matters whether Chris Paul was right that the team needed more bonding, needed more needed to change up some stuff on defense,

32:58 but needed to confront each other more or was the Clippers brass right or the coaches right like no destructive

33:06 is like a marriage. Yeah. Somebody has to choose. And I'm going to tell you, my lawyer told me this years ago, cuz I always used to see,

33:15 in other words, who had to be the husband and say, "Okay, fine. You're right." No, here's I used to always see him and I'm like, "Wow, Fred, you and Jackie, y'all have such a great relationship. She's always happy. You always happy." It's like beautiful. You know what he told me?

33:30 He said, "Rich, I made a decision. I'd rather be happy than right." Right. So, somebody in that situation

33:38 who should have That's what I'm saying. like but but in the clip here's the difference there. The Clippers were not functioning. They were not functioning.

33:46 But the wins and the wins and losses the wins and losses don't boil down to one player. They're the oldest team in the league.

33:52 No, of course. But maybe but he it's not so much his play as it's this is the way we should approach things.

33:59 Yeah. But here's what I'm saying. when you're already losing sometimes, even if you're saying the right thing, but we're already in this funk and it's just this shut up.

34:11 Yeah. Sometimes you you just have to you just have to really really be able to read the room. And I know Chris is smart enough to do that, but then there's also a competitiveness inside of you. And then there's also like a you know, like how could you, you know, how are we not even looking at this? But again, you have to pick your spots. Anybody have to pick your spots. You have to pick.

34:32 Was he right about it? If what he was saying is we're not we're not there's not enough camaraderie. We're not on the same page. People don't seem interested and plugged in. They seem

34:43 Well, it'll be hard to say uninterested. It' be hard to say that he's not right about basketball things. I would never say maybe still it's not a matter. would never say that Chris Paul isn't right about basketball things. But it could have been the wrong time for him to say,

34:59 you know, was right. What what always impressed me about Chris Paul, and then we could move on, is unless you unless you want to talk about it more, but I think about the kind of point guard that a guy like Larry Brown back in the day would describe like this is what a point guard should do. Chris Paul is like the platonic ideal of a Larry Brown point guard. Chris Paul did like like I just when I was like just listening to when when Larry Brown was going through it with AI or whatever else Larry Brown must have watched Chris Paul coming up and guys like that and been like showing everyone that's how you do it just like that.

35:40 Well that well that that matters. Yeah, that matters. But again, Larry Brown's not coaching.

35:47 No. And the league has changed also. The league has changed. And again, there's some you need some of that. You you definitely need some of that.

35:55 But it's there's a measuring cup to it. No matter if you got young guys, if you have older guys, again, even as kids, your own parents, I mean, he has kids. Like, there's going to be a time and a place to where

36:13 Yeah. And you could you could easily see where Chris would get that wrong. There's a there's a what I would say a um

36:21 um speedometer on how you do things in a locker room. You got to know when to accelerate, when to take some some of the gas off the gas. Yeah.

36:32 Just a little bit, you know. And again, I'm not in the locker room and I chose not to even speak to to Too about it because it's like

36:40 So you're saying Chris Paul's fault? That's how I hear what you said. No, I'm not saying Chris Paul. I'm saying there's a anytime you can't say that. Big picture is from from what I'm getting from your analysis is whether Chris Paul was right or wrong on the specifics, he pro he probably should have handled it differently.

36:57 Well, I'm saying you have a choice in that situation and you have a responsibility and you have to be able to read the room. I don't know what he was trying to get out of it or not. I don't know was said in the in the summer conversation and I don't represent him. So if I tell you this, if I represented Chris

37:17 Yeah. and I was talking to the Clippers about him joining the team, the first thing that you're asking is, okay, what type of role is this? Because I need to be able to let him know. If they say, okay, we want him to play 12 to 15 minutes a game, blah blah blah, you know what his jacket looks like, you already know what his jacket looks like. So coming in, if you have any discourse to what his paperwork says when he comes into that locker room, then let's talk about this now so I can be able to prep my client and say, "Hey, we know who you are. We know what you're used to doing, but just so you know, this ain't the place for that. So they want you to play 12 to 15 minutes a game andor you're not going to play at all. The only time you're gonna play is when such and such and such I want.

38:07 And your job is to amplify the coach's message, not necessarily interesting. Going back to the Cavs, Kobe Alman said, "Hey, Rich, we need a guy in the locker room, but I just want you to know he's not going to play."

38:20 So my thing is, and he actually said, "Actually, he may play a couple games if guy go down or whatever, but my thing is you're not playing at all." I said the same thing to Corey Joseph with with the with the Magic. Corey, you're not playing at all. Don't even think about it. Just go in there, be a pro, you know, be cuz you got to have a balance in these situations, too. You got to be a little pro player. And then, you know, if you're

38:48 see the big picture for the sake of your client. Yeah. But but if you're also working towards if you're the player and you're working towards postc career, maybe you want to go in the front office, maybe you want to go into coaching. So I I was telling Tristan like if you want to go in the front office, spend some time with the front office. If you want to go into coaches, sit in some of the coaches meetings. So I don't know what the setup was is what I'm saying. So I'm what I am saying is yes, CP has a responsibility and I would tell him that if I talked to him, but so does the Clippers. There's a shared accountability in all of it. And really there's no winner.

39:21 Remember when you said athletes hate confrontation? They do. You know who what athletes don't hate confrontation? fighters,

39:28 boxers. Well, they're born to confront that's confrontation. Um Terrence Crawford, who is,

39:36 you know, sometimes rich, uh situation illuminates what has happened in the past. For example, you could have debates about who the best pound-for-pound fighter in the world is, and then events unfold in a way that you go, "Oh, I see that dude was always the best." Right? like he just didn't have the opportunity to show it

39:54 or we were a little confused by events at the time. Terrence Crawford, when you look [clears throat] at his career,

40:02 may have been the best pound-for-pound fighter in the world for over the over a decade, but he just never really had the opportunity to show it because he was so dangerous. Other stars didn't want to fight him because as soon as the other stars fought him, he beat the brakes off him. and and Terrence Crawford who just beat Canelo Alvarez. He's on top of the world. He's a major star now in sports, not just boxing like people know who he is undefeated the only only had one fight in his career where it was even like this guy's really competing with him. And it was way above his natural weight class against a tricky southpaw who was undefeated named Majimov. And and still at the end of the fight, it wasn't like, hey, did Crawford lose that fight? You knew he won the fight. Um, like even Floyd didn't do that. Floyd Mayweather had a fight with Jose Luis Castillo when he first moved up to lightweight where a

40:54 lot of people still think Castillo won. Like if I watched that fight on a Monday, I might say maybe Floyd edged it out. On a Tuesday, I'd be like, nah, Castillo. It's like one of those fights. Crawford never had a fight like that in his career, right? There's no ever never a reason to give a guy a rematch because it wasn't like, oh, who won that fight or who's better? He retired yesterday. Bud retired. Tenth Bud Crawford retired. Um, and if he stays retired, he is one of the very greatest fighters of all time. Like the way I explain this to you, and the way I explain it to people, and you'll get this because like you don't like putting this guy one or this guy. They're all on the top shelf to you, right? There are some

41:37 No, I have another thing about that. Okay. There are there's there's you can be allowed in the room,

41:43 okay? But there's only certain tables that you can sit at. So who and only if the light hits you a certain way on a Tuesday and you Yeah.

41:52 Speaking of Bud and fighting, I had a fight with myself the other day. Okay. I had the I did the hardest thing ever to I I never realized how hard these things is.

42:04 What is it? You ever You ever had to like sneak out of somewhere and people were like having a really in-depth conversation, but you had to leave and you had to sneak out? Yes.

42:13 There's no real there's no real like great way of sneaking out of somewhere because

42:23 you can't announce and be like, "Hey everybody, I'm about to leave." Cuz you're drawing attention to cares like what?

42:29 And it also depends. Do you want to be there or do you wish you could stay or were you trying to leave?

42:35 I was kind of caught between the rock and the hard place because I definitely had to leave. There was no question about it.

42:41 Yeah. But there was like wagoo steak with truffles. There was crab. And then there was a great conversation being had by our 44th president, Mr. Barack Obama. And you know, when he speaks, it's like a calm app. You're just there. And I'm looking at the truffles and I'm like, "But I got to I have to leave. I'm already 40 minutes behind me needing to actually leave anyway

43:12 to go to your own launch party. And I'm And I have people waiting on Yeah. And I have people waiting on me,

43:18 friends and family, and I have to leave. And then I'm like, my chair seems so heavy. I'm like, damn. Like, I'm trying to scoot the chair back without making any noise.

43:31 How many people were at the dinner with you and I hope it's like 12 people. It's only like 12 people and I'm like this is

43:39 Was it commented upon that you were leaving? No, but I'm but also I don't want to interrupt the conversation because there was real topics.

43:46 Big time Barack Obama. No, I did not. Yes, you did. You big time Barack Obama. No, I did not. That is not that because No,

43:54 you were at dinner having a great time. Obama's there with only 11 other people. You're one of the disciples. You're 12 other people. But I did say and you got up and left.

44:02 No, I did say there was an event that I had to be at. So that's true. But what I was trying not to do Yeah.

44:08 is draw any attention to the fact that I had to leave. And I was trying to be what you call it um respectful

44:16 to the people that were also waiting on me to get to a place. And so I'm caught between this rock and a hard place. And I'm looking at the truffles and I'm looking at, you know, I'm a seafood lo. I'm looking at the this fresh crab that was flown in. There's a great conversation and I'm like, is there a seat belt on this chair because I'm trying to get up?

44:37 Yeah, you can't do it. And so I go for the I go for the I'mma go to the bathroom play. But then when I get to the bathroom that is closest to the door so I can just some it was occupied. So now they have to take me to a different bathroom.

44:52 You have to walk through back. I had to walk back through but but it threw me off my my my course. your exit strategy

44:59 and I'm just like this I felt like I was you're like Larry David. Yeah. I feel like I was episode I'm like this is crazy

45:07 because what you said what you just said is the last thing you want somebody to think. So now I'm sending text message to everybody you know with my excuse me you know but what do you do in that situation? Yeah. I'm sure everyone has been in a situation where

45:26 where they're having where they're having dinner with Barack Obama big time about have you ever been to a Baptist church.

45:32 Yeah. When you're trying to leave, you know, I thought about that. I have, but not on a Sunday for service like I've been. But when you're trying to leave in that situation, so I was just like

45:42 there was a fight within myself. What it was felt like I was fighting Bud Crawford for sure in the fact that

45:49 I'm trying to get out of a I'm trying to be respectful to a situation. Yeah. To the president, former president of the United States.

45:55 Get to a situation where So it was, you know, was but I just wanted to know like

46:01 have you ever been in that situation? It was so hard to to to make that decision.

46:06 I can't think of it off the top of my head that I that where I tough spot to be in.

46:10 I mean I've had to everyone's had to dip out of places. You know what I mean? Usually most places I don't actually want to be there. I want to be like at home watching the game, you know,

46:19 but I want to make it clear to Barack, you know, that was not the case. He knows that, by the way. But he says he's going to say you want to do your micopa like I did to Adam Silver.

46:31 Why don't you apologize to Barack Obama for big time? Because No, I did not big time him. You had

46:36 I don't need to do that. But what I will say, it wasn't what it looked like. Mhm. Barack, it was not what it looked like. He knows that because

46:44 Call Barry, you're on a first because he say he's going to watch the show, too. So, all right. And I I don't want to mess up what could be an opportunity. So, I just wanted to be clear and it must be transactional with you. Yes.

46:55 To the gracious host as well. I wanted to be very clear about that. So, yeah, but that was a tough one.

47:01 Meet with Barack Obama. You have to parlay it into something else. You're always parlaying everything.

47:06 Just meet have dinner with Barack Obama. Well, the parlay is the relationship. What is it?

47:12 Well, you know, I'm you read the book, Lucky Me, I'm a gambler. I see that. Yeah,

47:15 that is the parlay is all part of it. You know, I I I was The only reason I'm going to finish this thought because we should end on that, but I was I want to say something about Bud before we get out of here.

47:25 Okay. You said about because this started with the top. You reminded me when you brought up Bud. You said what this was the um the other day about Jordan and Steph. You said Steph is on the same shelf as Jordan. And I said different shelves and you were, you know, whatever it was. There are when I interviewed Bud after he beat Canelo and I said, you know, you're the GOAT of this era. And what I and people were like, what do you mean goat the greatest of all time? You can have greatest of all time of a certain era. The point is of all time. And

47:59 well, Michael always made that point. Yeah, he did. He did. And but what I was saying and what I am saying is there are some athletes that come along in different sports where the people who watched them through that era, the people who grew up with them or who paid attention to their careers, who lived through their era,

48:22 you will never be able to tell them anything about that player. The kids who grew up watching LeBron James or Kobe Bryant, you can't like to them, you try to tell them about Michael Jordan, they know, come on, man. No one could have I put eyes on this dude, right?

48:39 No one could have been better than this dude. There are some athletes like that. There aren't so many of them, but they exist. I mentioned two of them in the NBA.

48:48 That is what Bud Crawford is in boxing. the people, the kids, the people who grew up, the people who watched him through his era, you will never be able to tell them that anyone could have beaten him. He's one of the like Floyd Mayweather was like this. Sugar Ray Robinson was like this. Bud is one of those dudes and they're not that common.

49:08 The only thing, first of all, love Bud Crawford. Y everything about him. Yeah, me too.

49:14 Literally everything about Bud. The only thing I hate is that I think Bud was a little cheated in his career because now you had things like the UFC and there was all eyeballs wasn't on boxing where those other guys came at a time where all the eyeballs was on boxing.

49:39 If all the eyeballs was on boxing with Bud, I don't know, man. I mean, I'm not the boxing guru like you are, but you have to put him there. You still have to do

49:53 in this era like what what because I'm talking about in any era. I'm saying but like in the re in modern boxing or in recent boxing history, last 20 years, let's say, the the comparison is always going to be with Floyd. They were around the same size. They can't they their careers overlapped. And Floyd was a better defensive fighter and he was faster. But if people think about that matchup, Bud's IQ is just as high. He's a better puncher and he's a savage finisher. So when people think about those guys fighting each other, Floyd is up on points. Of course, eventually at some point Bud's going to tag him with something and who knows what happens then. I mean that's a

50:28 but he's one of those dudes. The thing about Bud Bud fears there's no fear. There is no fear.

50:35 Well, there is fear of one thing for him. His mom always told him, "Oh yeah, you ain't going to be shit." That's what she told him.

50:41 Yeah, that's different. Bud's fear is proving her right. That's what he's scared. That's why you could put him in with Godzilla. Godzilla doesn't scare him. It's proving his mom right that scares him.

50:52 He's um Yeah. One of a kind. If it's really over, it's amazing. The way that he switches I mean I was at the fight, too.

50:58 The way that he switches styles. Southpaw Orthodox. Yeah. And then I saw I saw an interview today by um what's his name? Tim uh what's the boxer? Tim

51:10 Bradley. Tim Bradley and he was saying how he sparring stories. Yeah, the sparring story and he was like let who is this kid? He came by himself.

51:21 They had a they had a they had a um a redeye flight for him to go back if he was just

51:27 Yeah. Tim the best. Yeah. And he said he got in the ring. They were supposed to go six rounds and they only went four.

51:33 Yeah. He usually it's a sparring partner that taps out. Yeah. Right. And then he said he called his

51:38 Cameron Duncan, late Cameron Dun, can I get this guy out of his contract because he just wasn't getting a support.

51:45 That's happened. That's happened throughout boxing history where one fighter sees another fighter. Sometimes they don't want to fight him and they'll

51:52 know. He said he went and watched the film from the sparring match and was coming in the next day or the next time they sparred to give him the constructive criticism.

52:01 No, no, he was watching the film. I know what you're talking about because I saw the same reel. He was watching the film. Tim was to make adjustments for the next day.

52:10 Exactly. And then he adjusted and Crawford who had no access to that film was adjusting to the adjustments and that's when he knew it's different.

52:18 This guy is and and the reason he was ducked for so long Crawford and I remember this cuz I was there at HBO when there was another fighter Adrien Bronner. You probably remember him from he was at his best 101 15 years ago. Really good talented junior lightweight. And Bronner was out of Cincinnati like a class clown type personality and and rambunctious and all this. And and there was a sense back then that there was pressure for black fighters to for African-American fighters, meaning black fighters in this country to oh, they if they don't have a gold medal, they can't sell tickets, right? So if you're if you're Mexican or Mexican-American, you have this huge built-in fan base because it's a huge sport in Mexico and they'll show out for their fighters. they'll show up for their fighters. But if you're a black fighter, you have to be clown yourself somehow or you have to say be outrageous or

53:10 controversial in order to generate the kind of coverage of you that would then generate the money to get other fighters to fight you. And the idea was back then, and I I was there. I was at HBO at the time. I remember the idea was back then in the boxing kind of press and the and the power brokers is that if you were a black fighter and you didn't have an over-the-top personality and you didn't have a gold medal and you weren't a heavyweight, let's say, couldn't be a draw

53:38 and you were as good as Crawford, you were beating the hell out of guys, how are you going to get them in the ring with you? And so I used to ask Bud about that back in the day. I'd talk to him and he was very shy in the beginning, you know, but he'd be like I'd be like, "So, how do you what do you think about this?" And he's like, "I'm just going to be me and I'm just going to be keep beating in front anyone they everyone they put in front of me." and he was principled and true to himself the entire time and because he was so like there's a famous quote in boxing that Joe Frasier saw Marvin Haggler and when he was coming up in the ranks and he said Frraasier told him you have three strikes against you you're black you're southpaw and you're good right now Frasier was wrong only because Haggler wasn't good he was great so he kept winning and eventually he got there and so was Crawford. Same thing. It

54:33 didn't matter how dangerous he was or how quiet he was. He just kept kicking everybody's ass and eventually the world had to recognize.

54:40 I equate that to a music artist that stays align with who they are. The theatrics we don't need. We're not going to get out of art and I'm just going to build a very core fan base. And when you and that so now when you talk about yes streaming and all that and you talk about hard ticket sales

55:05 a guy may outstream this artist but they're not going to out sell that artist and they're not going to last by the way what my mind immediately goes to is Wuang

55:14 the like the creator the but remember when when this might be before your time the genius was had a deal at you know what was the song we love you Rahheem and it was very pop type stuff. And they covered this in in in the show that they did on Wuang on on I think it was on Hulu.

55:31 That was a great show, by the way. It was It was good. Um, but the point was he learned early on, I'm not going to sell out just to get a record deal. And then once they were true to themselves, now they're one of the most legendary fan base. So that's what Bud did. like you have to you have to

55:47 be enamored and by his everything that he brings to the sport of boxing and how he went out

55:53 and even his message yesterday, you know, it was just profound. So yeah. Yeah. You know,

56:01 yeah. Listen, cheers to Bud. Cheers to Bud for sure. Congratulations, champ. What's up?

56:05 The NBA Cup. I thought about something. Yeah. Go ahead. Before we get out of here, let's go back to the NBA Cup.

56:11 The 2028 Olympics is going to be very interesting. Okay. And I'm looking at Wimi and I'm thinking about team France and I'm also thinking about team USA. We don't have to talk about this today,

56:24 but I'm just like this is interesting if you're going where I think you're going. Go ahead.

56:28 This is going to be very interesting because we saw team France just this past they were a lot to handle. A lot to handle. The USA team is not going to have LeBron. They're not going to have Steph. At least I don't think so.

56:50 Right. Can Anthony Edwards lead the USA against the world? Well, here's the thing. It's not just like, who knows? Is Jason Tatum going to choose to play or not play? Right.

57:02 I'm just saying. And I was just saying we're the underdogs. We're kind of the underdogs,

57:07 but the pressure is on us because the Olympics is in LA. Woo! Rich, that's so good. We got to get into this. We Not right now. Not right now. We We We got Listen, we have holiday shows coming up. That's an evergreen. Let's do it. Let's do it for the holiday shows.

57:24 Oo, I love that. I thought we was talking about Kobe today. What happened? We'll do that for the holiday shows, too.

57:29 So, I wore my Nothing. What'd you wear? You didn't see the BTS? Oh, you wore it in?

57:35 Yes. We both got Tims on today, by the way. Different styles. You know the last time I had Tims on

57:40 you were a little Cleveland Benedictton. I mean this is what in New York but that's you know

57:46 growing up that was the the uniform was either Tims or what they call uptown which is white on white Air Force Ones jean shorts undershirts you know

57:54 but those are can't even say what they were called back then. Those are super fly.

57:58 Yeah. You know when I used to wear those when I knew everyone else would be in something different.

58:02 Uhhuh. Because I wanted to go from for this this preppy look. Right. That was a very preppy look.

58:09 It was. Yes. These are universal. These could One thing about these, these could be house shoes.

58:16 They could be You can You can They could be for actual work. They got a mark on them and you got to You got to get That's the problem. Yeah.

58:23 Didn't you hear Didn't you hear Chic Luke? Come on, man. I rock a waistlength mink do- rag under my fitted and I don't even want waves. Tims be halfway new. The halfway new Tims is the way to go.

58:34 No, I'm just saying in New York these are halfway new. You think these are new in New York growing up the Tims this is it was really it's a form of conspicuous consumption because if you had the white-on-white uptown the the Air Force ones

58:46 or those Tims the constructs they were so easy to mess up that since they were always new it was like a flex

58:52 but that no the flex yes the no the flexes Tims is halfway new not always new the flexes the Tims is half it is

59:02 that's why that's why you had to wear the beef and broccololis back in the day cuz you could keep mean the beef and broccoli, the goreexes. I had them all.

59:09 By the way, when when when Bishop comes in the in the Super Tams, we used to call them,

59:17 right? Those two. So, but no, the Tims being halfway new is the flex. New outfit.

59:24 If only that were true. Okay, we could take a poll on this. I mean, new new outfit and halfway new Tims is a real flex.

59:33 Could they do halfway new uptowns? That'd be great. Wouldn't have to get rid of a

59:36 different story. No. You can't do halfway new uptown. No, no, no, no, no, no. See, there's a certain That's We'll talk about this

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Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Knicks Take the NBA Cup, Details on CP3’s Exit, and Crawford Retires"?

Max Kellerman (Host), Rich Paul (Guest).

What is "Knicks Take the NBA Cup, Details on CP3’s Exit, and Crawford Retires" about?

The discussion covers the recent NBA Cup victory by the Knicks and highlights the significance of Chris Paul's departure from the league, as well as Jamal Crawford's retirement. Insights from notable figures in basketball, including coverage by Ramona Shelburne, are examined to provide context and implications for the future of the NBA.

What is mentioned in this Game Over with Max Kellerman and Rich Paul episode?

15 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Buddy Rich, NBA Cup, Knicks, Chris Paul, Mike Brown, Terence Crawford. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Knicks Take the NBA Cup, Details on CP3’s Exit, and Crawford Retires"?

The episode runs 1 h 1 min; the transcript is about 11,911 words in 263 timestamped sections.

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