Transcript

Last Update on the Left - Episode 11 - Return to Skinwalker Ranch

From Last Podcast On The Left · Episode page · Watch on YouTube

· 52 min · 10,773 words · 226 timestamped sections

This is the full, timestamped transcript of "Last Update on the Left - Episode 11 - Return to Skinwalker Ranch", an episode of Last Podcast On The Left published January 9, 2026 (52 min, about 10,773 words). It mentions 15 people, works and ideas, including Skinwalker Ranch, History Channel, Axel Rod, Robert Bigelow, Hunt for the Skinwalker.

What this episode is about

The discussion centers on a humorous and irreverent examination of skinwalkers, incorporating personal anecdotes, cultural references, and comedic banter among the hosts. They explore the concept of skinwalkers, weaving in themes of identity and transformation, while punctuating the conversation with lighthearted commentary about their own physical experiences and dietary habits.

Key takeaways

  • When guilt-induced cannibalism makes a comeback, you know the diet culture has gone too far.
  • Your belly's a fickle friend: one sandwich away from chaos, one workout from tranquility.
  • Skinwalkers: the original shapeshifters, proving even cannibals can have an identity crisis.
  • Skinwalker Ranch: where UFO sightings meet an impressive resume of bizarre animal transformations.
  • Grandpas might believe in ghosts, but can they handle the existential dread of a portal in the sky?

Who speaks in this episode?

What is discussed, and when

  1. – 5:00: Skinwalker Ranch, Marcus Parks
  2. – 10:00: Skinwalker Ranch, George Knapp, Hunt for the Skinwalker
  3. – 15:00: Hunt for the Skinwalker, George Knapp, Skinwalker Ranch
  4. – 20:00: Skinwalker Ranch, Skinwalkers at the Pentagon
  5. – 30:00: Skinwalkers at the Pentagon
  6. – 35:00: Skinwalker Ranch, Brandon Fugal
  7. – 40:00: History Channel, Skinwalker Ranch
  8. – 45:00: Axel Rod, Skinwalker Ranch, George Nap, History Channel
  9. – 50:00: Skinwalker Ranch, Axel Rod, George Nap, Thomas Winterton

Notable quotes from "Last Update on the Left - Episode 11 - Return to Skinwalker Ranch"

  • I think it has to be. Welcome. My name's Marcus Parks.
    about Marcus Parks · at
  • Remember exactly what tribe it was but that I'll catch up right now. The Skinwalker Ranch just remember it was a family lived on Skinwalker Ranch.
    about Skinwalker Ranch · at
  • Listened to George Knapp and Cole Keller recently that they wrote the original book on this subject called Hunt for the Skinwalker Ranch. Now this is Hunt for the Skinwalker which has been around now for a minute.
    about Hunt for the Skinwalker · at
  • And so they wrote skinwalkers at the Pentagon. And I'm just going to tell you now, you should go buy it and read it.
    about Skinwalkers at the Pentagon · at
  • Yeah, we know it. Brandon Fugal.
    about Brandon Fugal · at
  • It disappeared in a second. And he said that it changed his whole life. And by then the History Channel came a calling.
    about History Channel · at
  • Yeah. Then you got the ranch manager Jim Morse. He was Jim was like Fu Fugal's like first big developer client like way back in the day. And of course like you know Jim just seemed like okay.
    about Jim Morse · at
  • Which I love which is like he talked to a guy. He was a federal employee with Axel a man by the name of Axel Rod went by the name of Axel Rod. His name wasn't Axel Rod.
    about Axel Rod · at

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

  • Axel Rod — Person · 4 mentions · first at
  • Robert Bigelow — Person · 4 mentions
  • George Knapp — Person · 2 mentions · first at
    Like truly suspicious. And I listened to George Knapp and Cole Keller recently that they wrote the original book on this subject called Hunt for the Skinwalker Ranch. Now this is Hunt for the Skinwalker.
  • George Nap — Person · 2 mentions · first at
    Single favorite images from the Skinwalker Ranch book. I love this. I love this idea. So, according to George Nap, now George Snap, he does a good job of always being Hey, I…
  • Marcus Parks — Person · 1 mention · first at
  • Brandon Fugal — Person · 1 mention · first at
  • Jim Morse — Person · 1 mention · first at
  • PB – Chiropractor (Dr. Bard — Person · 1 mention · first at
    Then you got Eric Bard. He's the principal investigator. The normal guy.
  • Thomas Winterton — Person · 1 mention · first at
    It's something else. Yeah, there's many good. Yeah. Thomas Winterton. He's the guy who keeps digging. and he keeps having accidents and like he's got like this thing on his head. He's like got this fluid that keeps [ __ ] like.

Books & papers

Companies & orgs

Places & events

Full transcript with timestamps

That's when the cannibalism started. Last update on the left. I thought my belly was going away and then I ate a sandwich and it came back.

What do you mean? I I was doing the workout and I thought my little belly was going away.

It goes in and out and then I ate a sandwich and it came back out again. You said you tell you're really thin. Yeah, that means you're like a boa constrictor.

You know, if I could see the outline of the recent lunch that you've had, BT, [clears throat] you got it.

Incredible. I can see the ruffles of the lettuce. Is the am I talking about my belly going to be the start of this episode of Last Update on the left?

I think it has to be. I think it has to be. Welcome. My name's Marcus Parks. It's me, Henry Zabrowski. And wow, we're back here again.

Yeah, I'm Ed Larson. And the update is Marcus now has a stomach. It's the best thing to happen to the show. I like him a little I like you. I like you comfortable.

I And I am comfortable. I am. I had a bagel and then I had a sandwich and now I got a belly cuz I'm a little skinny man.

Well, guess what, man? If I have one sip of yeast, my body expands. But we're not just talking about our bodies expanding.

No, no, no. We're talking about the everex expanding coverage of the skinwash. Now, my first question is,

oh, aren't we all skin walkers? Because we have skin and we walk. No, but it definitely

couldn't think of like a scarier actual term than something that we all do and have back in the day. Technically, it comes from it's actually it should be the SW word because uh it's actually an oldtimey ghost racist term for humans.

Oh, ghosts say it to us. Yes, it is an old They think they're [ __ ] better. Yes, they do. because they know where aliens live.

This [ __ ] abandoned house was GREAT BEFORE ALL THESE GODDAMN SCARY WALKERS MOVED IN.

GRANDPA, HEY, I know I only died of CO and I'm 9 years old. But hey, listen, you got to keep up with the times, Grandpa.

Shower. Yeah, sure. Reason why they're called skinwalker is that skinwalker comes from the old Native American uh legend. And I think skin walker is like the literal translation for and I might be talking out of my ass here. I'm just thinking it's like the literal translation of what the UN basin people. I can't remember exactly what tribe it was but that I'll catch up right now. The Skinwalker Ranch just remember it was a family uh lived on Skinwalker Ranch. They would go ahead and experience and it was a 500 acre farm in the middle of Uenta Basin, Utah. It is this area of the world is known for its UFOs. when we covered this a long not that long ago.

No, I mean it was like six years ago, dude. Jesus Christ. Uh it is long, but if you go through all of the stuff like this area has years and years and years of various UFO experiences that have built up over time and and this one phenomena called the skinwalker phenomena. So at the time, I forget the name of the tribes that you lived around the Uenta basin, but they

it starts with an I. I do know that they did have a war with Mormons uh that was quite bloody.

It was really brutal. But they wouldn't good for them. They wouldn't go into this area of this canyon.

Thank good they would not go into this canyon because they legitimately thought it was creepy. And a part of what they did was they called the trail of the skinwalker said went through this area. Now, skinw walkers are shamans, magical people that instead of taking their magical responsibility to their community and using it responsibly and and in a positive way, they normally what they do is the final tabo, which is what Armen says, we talk about all the time, the final tabo, which is cannibalism. And what they do is they do some form of evil cannibalistic ritual where they give up their own humanity in order to be able to change form into various animals to do nefarious [ __ ] Essentially, it's to kill or to steal and then not be recognized. It's to leave. But it comes with a host of other negative associations and bad juju powers.

So they turn into like dire wolves and stuff like that and oversized wolves is a thing that does come up quite a bit at Skinwalker Ranch. Yeah. It's a Ute Indian tribe.

The ute. Yeah, that that's Yeah, that was their that's their name. The two utes. [clears throat]

The two utes they walk. He's talking about But it came from a But this has now been researched up and down. It is called the mo most researched 500 acre plot of land in the world. They've had several different gigantic paranormal slash not paranormal studies done in the area to kind of see where all of these these various stories come from and if they are true or not. When will they stop? Uh they won't because they are making too much money.

Yeah. Yeah. And I think there's still so much to be learned out there. Like I I I really feel like with Skimwalker Ranch like we went through it on our episode like how many strange events happened there. Like there was a like a what was it? Bingo the everything dog. Yeah, there was a weirdass dog that did change into several different shapes. It was owned by the Sherman family. Yeah. And they saw UFOs uh very similar to Nope.

Like there was a lot of stuff in Nope. That was straight imagery that was taken from Skinwalker Ranch that I thought was [ __ ] awesome. I thought it was going to go more into Skinwalker territory, but it didn't. But I still love Nope.

Yeah. Nope. Incredible. But the idea of like clouds that stay still in the sky. Yeah. One thing that's also really weird about Skinwalker Ranch is portals saying things that are opening up in the sky. They say that they literally saw like buttholes gape in the sky and then ships would come in and out of the buttholes. There was also uh giant wolves, direwolves,

poltergeist activity. Poltergeist activity. Yeah, it would like there would be cows that would suddenly like basically teleportation where cows would suddenly be crammed into a trailer and nobody would know like how they got mutilated. That was super [ __ ] weird. And there's been multiple cattle mutilations, which is also one of the top phenomena on Skinwalker Ranch.

And there's been cattle mutilations described in Skinwalker Ranch going back as far as the 30s.

Yes. Now, what's the CTV situation on Skinwalker Ranch? Constant. Constant. It is. It is filmed all over the place. But one of also the weird phenomenon is that thing cuts the cords to the cameras. They find cords missing, pulled out of the back of cameras, stuff that's like suspicious. Like truly truly suspicious. And I listened to George Knapp and Cole Keller recently that they wrote the original book on this subject called Hunt for the Skinwalker Ranch. Now this is Hunt for the Skinwalker Skinwalker

which has been around now for a minute. It was in 2005 and they I just watched that doc

and it's I love that you know I love them. You know I love them and so the Sherman family they were so freaked out by this that they could didn't want to be there anymore and they saw a lot of [ __ ] up [ __ ] Like one thing was that like a giant wolf approached the father that was like uh approached Terry Sherman and he shot at it and it didn't die. It ran away and a lot of other weird stuff. And so they finally got sick of it. So they sold it to the man who runs the extended stay universe and studed the extended I would say that the extended universe of the extended stay hotels. It's Robert Bigalow.

Um he's trying to create space hotels. Okay. Uh that's his main thing. He's a huge huge um Well, if there's portals to space, it's a great place to start.

He owns a lot of rental property. Yes. Yes. And he is a he's a weird/Republican donor, but also a very very uh curious man who spent a lot of his millions of his billions researching this phenomena. So, he bought the ranch and then he put this group on it called NIDS. That was a thing that he put together. And uh

what does NIDS stand for again? The National Institute for Discovery Science. And they uh they did a very very serious research program there for I want to say it was something like 20 years they were there and Robert Bigalow for forever jealously held the data that he had control of all of these years.

He let out a little bit here and there to keep to keep the the interest in the project going. Well, also because he's he gave money, but also Senator Harry Reid also helped get a lot of government money applied to this area as well. Eventually, the United States government arrived and said, "So, what are we getting out of this?" And they're all like, "Oh, the phenomena is very interesting." And they're like, "Uh, uh, we're done here." And so they cut them off.

Yeah. I mean because I mean they as you said earlier like they kind of created like an X-files underneath everyone's noses but just relegated to one 500 square you 500 acre ranch in Utah and they gave them $22 million. Correct.

They did have $22 million to work on the project and they found nothing. Well conclusive nothing conclusive.

Well nothing that we necessarily know about. You have the witness testimony which is this is from the original research. There's lots of witness testimony most of the evidence

and a lot of what they discovered which I do think is interesting part of what came out what one of the weird fun shady things that came out after the fact a lot of the guys that were hired security they essentially were used as barometers for the effects of the ranch whether they knew it or not.

Yeah. So a lot of the times it found out that the call was coming from inside the house is that the measurements that they were using were coming from the humans that were there and their reactions to the phenomenon.

Well, who else is going to know? Well, that's we it has to be THE PEOPLE THAT ARE THERE, but you have to but you have to tell them, hey, that's why you're here. And they weren't telling these guys, hey, this is why you're here. I mean, it's the same type of [ __ ] that the government has been doing for years upon years where, you know, like the time they dumped a whole bunch of like fake poison into the water supply or they did a what was the mist in San Francisco

to see how far a aerialized an aerosolized whatever the term is a virus and see how a biological agent could possibly move along a coastline. They just sprayed us all like just willy-nilly with essentially a quote unquote harmless bacteria to see what it would do.

I got 16. Yeah. Yeah. Something like that. It was basically to see if an aerosolized anthrax attack would work and they found out that it did, but they also killed two people doing it.

You say they had a bad reaction to the test [ __ ] but yeah, this type of stuff happens quite often. They also did it in Edgewood, which we're going to be doing an update very soon about Edgewood.

Yeah, I'm excited for Edgewood. Now, I'm not as skeptical cuz I I after talking we talked to George Knapp and uh Jeremy Corbel and I'm not as skeptical as much, but I just don't get it. I don't feel like there's that much actual evidence.

Well, cuz it's more examining how difficult it is to know how to capture the evidence. It's I mean, yeah, that might actually be a good way of putting it is that it's a study on how to study this stuff, you know, like it's an experiment on how to experiment because they're trying to figure because that's one of the things that paranormal activity or paranormal research has really struggled with over the years is what are the what how do we quantify this stuff? How do we how do we measure this stuff?

Because guess what? You can't get unless you can quantify the stuff. Government funding for your research programs.

Yeah. Nor can you get any academic institution to take you seriously unless you have some sort of quantifier, if you have some way of classifying. And I think Skinwalker Ranch, that's a big part of what they're trying to do.

I feel like this $22 million in my opinion was just like shut up money, you know, like this is not real money to invest in a [ __ ] like a true investigation

because the other half you can't even make like a romantic comedy for $22 million.

It's true. It's true. That's absolutely correct. It's a government scale. Well, it's cuz Robert Bigalow was also self-funding. Yeah. So, one half was coming from the government and the rest was coming from the never- ending cash flow of Robert Bigalow until he finally offloaded the ranch. And when he offloaded the ranch was kind of when we stopped covering. It was 2016 and the book had come out. We had did hunt for the skinw walker. And at that point, we had covered when we did our episodes. We talked about the various stories that happened on the ranch. And we talked about how we knew that because it came from Hunt for the Skinwalker. And which I do find one of my favorite things now after one thing I learned was that George Knap originally was not super pleased that we had done a show using his book because he was like he had heard these group of jokers were talking about his his [ __ ] That's his baby.

That was one of his babies. Yeah. Like George Knap is truly one of the most in the end I think will be named one of the most important men in eupfology because of his singular dedication to the proper investigation of these bringing an air of legitimacy to the investigations of all of this type of

and not backing down and like you know because he knows that it like makes him look crazy and he doesn't give a [ __ ]

But guess what? He's hardcore and he still won awards. He still does crime reporting. He still does all his other investigative journalism. I feel like you have to to make yourself legitimate enough to get funding for this.

He came after he went after mobsters. He did stuff on the Las Vegas mayor that went to jail. Like he's done a lot of [ __ ] Like I love George Nappy unironically. And so when I found out that he was angry, we're all like, "Oh no.

Oh god. What are we going to do?" Until he listened and then he listened and he said, "Oh, you guys did some of the work." And we're like, "We're trying, Mr. Nap. We're trying."

He said that we went a different way with weed. He appreciated it. And so you guys got to talk to him at a contact in the desert and you know got to have a great conversation with him.

It was very cool. But the thing about him is that the more I talk I hear him talk, the more I at least buy that what he brought to the table was extremely honest and he believes cuz like there's a lot of talk about Robert Bigalow trashing the records of what happened during the NIDS investigation of the hunt for the skinwalker during that hunt for the skinwalker time period and George Nab like many times has said

we in our bookw writing it is that is the record That is what Bigalow had. What Bigalow probably has that none of us have seen is probably a couple of choice pictures,

which is again what we've learned is these guys either don't have them or they they use that as a cudgel against many people to be like you can't get it. But the word is

wouldn't that get you funding? I don't know. I actually don't know anymore because if he goes out because this is what now this is an interesting phenomena that we're at now in the post postformational world is that if let's say you have a great picture of a UFO and and you you do have one and you are this guy Robert Begalof vaguely shady but you know technically a hotelier

could be anything of you have a you might have a picture of Bono the everything dog you might have a picture of a massive wolf you might have a picture something that will make the world stand up and say woo so one of The worst things that you could do is release that, have everyone come out and be like, "Oh my god." Have it earth chatter, right? Like let's say every like, "Oh my god, this crazy picture." And then let's say somebody does a hit job on it. Like I just out of there. Like just is a total nightmare scenario.

Someone does a hit job on the photo, does everything possible to try to show that it's debunked. Now you've given this guy a bunch of money on his the the the back of this incredible uh release of information. The information is now debunked. You now got to get the money back from this [ __ ] You got to do so. No one wants to do it. No one wants to finally put that last piece out because what if then my last piece everybody [ __ ] doesn't even believe it.

Of course it's going to happen. And it's not only that, but by saying I have this photo, I have this last piece. People will still pay attention to you. People Yeah. People will still give you, you know, people will still invite you to things. People will still do interviews with you. But if you give everything that you got, then it's like, okay, well, we got everything we got from that guy. Don't have to talk to him anymore.

But when we recovered Skinwalker Ranch, like at the time, too, it was still very mysterious. And so it was it was a mysterious place. And a lot of

the TV show had not happened yet. It had not become a part of like, you know, the the zeitgeist as it sort of is now where basically everyone knows what Skinwalker Ranch is now. Back when we covered it, it was still very under the radar. Mysterious.

Can we go? No. Nuh-uh. I don't want to go. No. We I know you not wanting to go, but like are we allowed to go?

I think that you can take tours, but you have to know somebody by invitation. Yeah.

Yes, you have to know somebody. I I was I got I got some flirts going on. Oh, nice.

Couple of old men. Okay. That's my favorite cuz I can give them something they don't got no more.

It's certainly not a bunch of attractive young ladies. No, it's never. Yeah. It's never weird, right? It's never a girl named Valentina who's also an Instagram model. Like it's never her. It's always blur,

you know, like it's always some guy like know about rocks like oh great sometimes are scary Robbie Williams.

Love Robbie Williams. But no, I don't want to go to Skimwalker Ranch. again. But the reason why I don't want to go to Skinwalker Ranch is because of something that we discovered after covering the ranch on the main feed is the hitchhiker effect. I am terrified of this.

Hitchhiking ghosts. Hitchhiking ghost. Like your favorite magic. It's not like that.

It seems like it. No. No. Does hitchhiking ghosts give you autoimmune diseases? Unless you're [ __ ] him without a condom. I don't know.

I don't know. Fly from your grave. All right, we covered we covered it back in the day. We can kind of go a little bit more about what has expanded since then. Since then, George Knap wrote a book with two guys, two sexy guys named James Lacatsky and Cole Keller. Now, James Latsky is a former intelligence officer, defense guy that was so spooked by what happened to him after he went to Skinwalker Ranch that he decided it was enough for him to tell these guys what he knew because he was like, he basically was like, I want to go see it.

And he went with Cole Kellaher and George Knap and scared the living [ __ ] out of him. And then it weirdly also semi- ruined his life after the fact. And so they wrote skinwalkers at the Pentagon. And I'm just going to tell you now, you should go buy it and read it. And it is not like it's not Game of Thrones. Sure, you know, but it is a really interesting investigation into how to talk to these guys about something none of them want to talk to. And one of the main components that came out was really breaking down what the New York Times got wrong in December 2017 when it named AIP. It named a couple of these inner groups and they were wrong.

Yeah. The big the 2017 article is when it was the first time in modern history that a major publication has given UFOs or UAPs as it were uh the time of day.

Yes. But they were incorrect. We thought they're following the money of where the actual because Luellando sort of put himself he luando was the man that released helped leak this UFO material to the New York Times in December of 2017. He worked for a thing called ATIP which was a this inner group within the I believe it's the aran aerial aerial nautical threat.

Not anymore. ATIP is part of the Pentagon at the very least. Right. Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program. Now, what they were supposed to do was look at things in the sky, figure out whether or not they were weirdly anomalous, figure out whether or not they were trying to hurt us, and whether or not we could do whatever that they were doing and turn it into weaponry for us. Now, Lou Alzando came out and said, "Oh, I'm the leader of this group. We now kind of know that this probably not the case. He's probably was a guy somewhere within it who man but has now done some since a lot of good work trying to get this stuff out that we can see so that we can see some of it because the main contention is all right we don't know what it is the government doesn't know what it is but it's not hurting us yet and that's what they're really afraid of but still like why can't we know about

it turns out it's actually a lot more complicated than that so ATIP what this book then talks about has how ATIP was moved into a thing called OAP which is you like this You like this, Marcus? Like this is like being married to me.

This is it. This is our life. Hey man, I'm g I gave this one over to Well, I didn't actually give this one over to you. You just sort of took it.

I have just sort of kidnapped it. Yeah, cuz I tried taking like I I tried. Do you want it back? Do you want this back?

No. Please, please continue. So, the Advanced Aerospace Weapons System Applications Program. No, now we're locked in. Now we're locked in.

I'm I'm letting you finish this thought. Yes, absolutely. Yeah, but what we're really seeing is so I'm just kind of the main points of the book. The advanced airspace weapon system applications program is the next version of this. That is actually what got the $22 million. That is the thing that was all like and that was one thing that this the the investigative book pro proved was like it followed the money and it kind of untangled a bunch of stuff that the New York Times accidentally tangled up for a lot of people cuz immediately people went looking for ATIP. They couldn't find it. They found a thing called OAP. They thought that like, oh, this is all disinformation, but they showed these are the technically very tedious differences.

Yeah. Between these organizations. Can I Who is boss? Bass. Bigalow aerospace studies. That's Robert Bigalow's personal aerospace technology company. That's his guy, right? So, and the other thing that the new book comes out is explains this concept of the hitchhiker phenomena and really why truly at the core that of our US government's hesitancy to research any of this stuff and it's because of the religious angle and because of this hitchhiker effect.

Yeah. Well, basically what the hitchhacker effect is is that most people who go to Skimwalker Ranch Mo and in some cases like some pools of questioning, every single person that they questioned after they went to Skimwalker Ranch brought something home with them. And what that something is, no one really knows. All they know is that it is paranormal activity that manifests itself in many different ways. Some people it manifests itself in disembodied voices. Uh some people it manifests as moving objects like poltergeist activity. Other people they see blue orbs that will just suddenly appear in their house and one person had a blue orb. He said it moved through him and very soon after uh he developed a very aggressive form of cancer and died.

But did he die? I'm not sure if he died. I do know the guy who the blue orb went diick but he got he got a very aggressive form of cancer and some people even see shadow monsters. Uh not monsters but you know shadow people.

That's the most dangerous form of ghost. Did you know that? That's what I hear according to Ed Warren.

The shadow monster. Yes. The most dangerous form of ghost. And in fact the biggest thing though is that these you know hitchhikers and you know these people that you know the this phenomenon that makes people sick. Robert Bigalow, it's speculated that the reason why he sold Skimwalker Ranch, is because he believed that Skimwalker Ranch, one of these hitchhikers, he believes it killed his wife because she died of a very aggressive form of leukemia very quickly.

Did she die on the ranch? No. Has anyone died on the ranch? We don't know. Well, yeah, but actually that's a better answer is we don't know.

Okay. Yeah, we have no idea. Cuz it was an Indian burial ground. Well, not yet. I mean the whole Indian burial ground thing is if I may say a bit of a racist idea that was put forth like that's when we'll talk about it you know a little bit when we do our Amityville update but the whole idea of the Indian burial ground that was sort of created around the time of Amityville like out of some other like piece of media that came afterwards

because they had mounds in Amityville. That's the reason why they try to attach it to the to the Native American burial grounds and even that it's fine.

It's even dumber than that. But like the the Shinikook tribe came out and said like we don't do that. Like there no he said like why would our spirits come like he's like why would our spirits come back and haunt you? Our spirit we don't believe in that sort of thing. That's not that's not what we're about, you know, just to say like, you know, and then, you know, buried on an Indian barrow ground became just kind of a term like it became a joke.

Why would it is a racist thought to think that their graveyards are are more haunted than ours?

Extra scary because they're old school. Yeah. That goes back like they're more evil. It goes back to the old like whole like savage idea of like the they're more evil than we are. They're more savage than we are. Therefore, like we can, you know, they're going their ghosts are going to be meaner. Yeah. But of course, you know, polter guys, those ghosts were say, "Yeah, BUT YOU MOVE THE HEADSTONES, BUT YOU CAN'T MOVE THE [screaming]

THOSE ARE JUST PLAIN old white folk." And we do that all the time. It happens way more than you think it does.

I got no problem with it. Cemeteries are a waste of space. We all We've talked about this. I believe that. Uh but truly the the it's interesting because what also the skinwalkers at the Pentagon really elucidates is kind of what we're coming up against. One thing that was interesting that I learned was that there was a period of time where Robert Bigalow's bass, whatever the the offices were, whatever you'd call that, they were supposedly, and you can take this with a [ __ ] mountain of salt, they were told at some point during their contract, prepare for a shipment of this what they called exotic materials. So, there's a period of time where apparently they were preparing to move something that they had inside of some hanger somewhere that they didn't know what it was and they were about to give it to Robert Begalo for him to research and then it just never happened. And then it seems and I again I'm all of

this is on the to me the the believability of George Knap which is he went looking and the more and more he would bounce against what seems to be the major major big big secret which is that they got something and we don't know who's in charge of the thing. It legitimately might be like a construction company. It legitimately might be something that's outside of the government purvey like thing alto together that there is there is somebody that is holding on to something they found this is according to them that's one that's the one big secret and the second big big big secret which is I which was pointed towards I don't know if I should even say this secret information sources I can't reveal

this is what they all say I think you're just enjoying finally being able to do this

now I can say it now you can do it I got some inside information as well. Mhm. Yeah,

cuz I know people. Well, don't reveal your sources, but what is it? Yeah. Dr. Theodore Seuss.

That's your source. That's my source. Green eggs. Ham is bad. You know why? Because they are [ __ ] spoiled. Repulsing. But um

Was it a Was it a blue fish that did this? No. Two fish. No, it was a three fish.

But the Actually, it's kind of racist to call it a tooth fish. Yeah. You [ __ ] piece of [ __ ] How dare you? Uh but I uh it is the fact that the whatever it is is making us very sick and that what the people having contact with any form of the quote unquote phenomena is making people get something not unlike long co getting something not uh some kind of autoimmune disease that is really hurting people and they don't know what the hell it is cuz it's not radiation poisoning it's something else.

But nothing's happened to Nap. He's been there a bunch of times, but Knap says that he brought back [ __ ] to his own house and he says that's the reason why he'll never go back. He will not go back.

Oh, really? Yes. He's done. He's done. He says he's done because he said the last time he came back, [ __ ] started moving around his house and then his wife started seeing things and he said, "I got to stop going."

But his house is all spooky [ __ ] He's not. He's the opposite. He says to me, according to what he's

just an investigator. Yeah. He's like, "This is not his life. He's the He tried to explain that to me. He's just been like, "I'd rather be anywhere else." Like essentially like basically he would much rather

he much rather be hanging out with like LeBron James. He should have been a sports reporter.

Mhm. Just for his own life. Just for his own life, but he just likes a long cigar and a tall glass of scotch.

Yeah. And the rat pack. Yep, he does. Yeah. Well, I mean, I can see his point because you know what Robert Bigalow in an interview that he gave to George Knap in like 2021, like Robert Bigalow says, and a couple of people have confirmed this, like the the [ __ ] that people bring back from Skimwalker Ranch, it's again sort of like Long Co, there's no set expiration date on it. It's not like you come back, you experience stuff for a week, and then it's done. Some people have been experiencing things for years, years upon years that it just doesn't stop. And as far as they know, it's going to keep happening for the rest of their lives. It's just never going to stop for them.

If it's never going to stop, then why not keep going back to try to figure out what the [ __ ] it is to try and stop it?

Pay your bills. Yeah, dude. Get more, dude. And then you go back. Nothing going back is is stopping it. And like that's a part of the main issue with all of the research is that we really haven't gotten anywhere. Which tech technically brings us to the secret of skinwalker ranch.

Live from your grave. The craziest thing about that you say why don't people go back and try to figure it out is that a lot of these people that come back with something when they go to Skin Walker Ranch when they've gone to Skinwalker Ranch they experienced nothing.

Yeah. Nothing. They they experience not a single [ __ ] thing. and they're like, I don't know what the big deal is. This is just, you know, this just some place in Utah and it's only after they go home that they experience very real phenomenon.

That's was my problem with all the the the docs that I watched is like it's just a bunch of people walking around A FIELD.

YEAH. WELL, AGAIN, as you're seeing more and more with the paranormal world, it's subtle and that what you're seeing is an actual paranormal investigation, not led by somebody like the Warren. Even though technically it is being sold, it's being sold to us as a mysterious thing. But it sounds like whatever was happening at Skinwalker Ranch, like the way that George Knap described it is that by the end of the NIDS run in by 2016, activity had all but stopped.

Like by the time they had gotten to the end of their scientific like whatever that round was, they like no one was seeing jack [ __ ] ever. Nothing was happening. Nothing, nothing fun, nothing weird. And then what happened was that they gave it a break, which is kind of what we talked about on side stories. Remember we talked about how they talk about the UK is running out of ghosts.

Yes. And they were saying this concept, which is interesting, that they're that ghost hunters are talking about less famous ghosts are not showing up anymore.

Oh, like that the ones at Borley Rectory. Yeah. That they're going in a partially

they finally went to heaven or hell or whatever. They finally got destroyed by all the [ __ ] electricity in the air.

Yeah. Something happened or battery ran out. And it does sound like what happened is that people Skinwalker Ranch got like burned out.

Yeah. On being explored and it did not want to be [ __ ] investigated anymore and it everything stopped.

But then the next guy bought the Skinwalker Ranch. Like we know who that is. We do now.

Okay. Yeah, we know it. Brandon Fugal. Yes. Is his name. Real estate cartoon. Speaks in movie references.

Oh, he is such a pain in the ass. Is he going to build like a hotel there? No, I mean he's there for the paranormal. I mean,

he he really is. Yeah, he really is there for the paranormal. Like he's And I think it's I think he it seems like he likes it because I mean this man wants his life to be a movie. Like I mean he owns a [ __ ] you know, endoskeleton from Terminator 2. Like he owns like the [ __ ] T800. Like he owns the [ __ ] glasses from Harry Potter. He specifically drives the Lamborghini that the uh that Bruce Wayne drives in the Dark Night Begins. That was that that one that he pulls into the restaurant with the models. He bought that Lamborghini, the screen used one.

He doesn't drive it on the dirt roads out in Skinwalker, does he? I mean, THAT SEEMS IRRESPONSIBLE.

THAT'S HIS PROPERTY, BRO. You wouldn't do donuts on Skinwalker Ranch in Batman's Lambo? That's [ __ ] incredible. That's an afternoon, dude. So, is anything happened to this guy?

Uh, not that we know of. Well, he said that No, he is a straight He's a straight experiencer.

Well, I mean, well, anything bad happening, I guess. What I I would say is that yes, he did see a UFO. He did see that he saw like a full silver disc in broad daylight.

Yeah, he's an experiencer and had changed his mind because for a while he had just bought it to have it. So when he found out it was for sale, he flipped out because he's a pop culture [ __ ] and he really wanted to get his any his hands on something that he could [ __ ] tell whole the world he has. Look how cool I am. Look what I have.

Just out of sheer curiosity, how much was it? Um, I think it was 4 million. Four 6 million.

Yeah, it [clears throat] was a lot. But he he already owned like a ton of property in Utah. He was like sort of like he was a real estate magnate in uh in Utah.

Yeah. No name. I know this sounds irresponsible and I'm probably answering my own question as I ask it, but why not make it into like a [ __ ] theme park like and like that's how we're REALLY GOING TO FIND OUT,

you know? PACKING IT WITH [ __ ] people and seeing if they all go home with cancer.

But I feel like that's a hard way to start. I feel like everyone's going to be angry about getting ghost cancer because they went on a roller COASTER

FOR IT. THEY KNOW THEY SIGN A WAIVER. I COULD GET GHOST CANCER. HE'S NOT WRONG.

ACTUALLY, everyone who goes on Skinwalker Ranch does have to sign a waiver saying I might get ghost cancer.

They do. Every single person who enters the property has to sign a waiver saying like, "I understand that I may suffer adverse effects from visiting this place. I do not hold the owners or anyone who goes with me responsible for anything that may happen to me on or off the ranch afterwards." Yeah, man. They're already signing the [ __ ] waivers. So, I don't think we're going to get real statistics until we start putting real numbers in there.

That's what But that's what they tried to do with the government. Like they they did have a fair amount of people in there. And this with this [ __ ] TV show, there's people in and out of there all the time.

Yeah. There were people in and out all the time now. And so, for a while there was just government guys watching the outside exterior and it was empty. And they we talk about that there was a people would get kicked in and out. And eventually when when Fugal bought it, he's like he was just kind of had it for a while. And it sound like for a while at first he wasn't expecting to do anything with it. He wanted his name to be secret. He did not want to be identified with the property because he was like he didn't want to get harassed.

He didn't want to people ask him about it all the time. Um you know he's like you know I give you my name, you tell your friends, they tell your other friends. He's calling me. You know that's all the buy it cuz you don't want to talk about it.

Exactly. So, but according to him, but he was also this whole time he was also doing the monitoring, you know, he was he wanted to figure out like he kind of took the mantle from Bigalow as far as the investigation goes. So, he did not he didn't

even though he's just a real estate guy who likes movies. Yeah. Yeah. He didn't buy it just to have it. He was continuing. He carried the torch.

Yeah. He wanted it. He wanted this responsibility. But then 6 months into the ownership, he said that he was in the command center, which was the old homestead for those guys who are like, "We're not going to be explaining every single run down barn in the middle of the place."

Thank you. He was seeing some there were some people there, quote unquote, he's according to him visiting dignitaries, which is probably Ted Nent, Robbie Williams.

Yeah, again. Yeah, again. Always. I'm going to say Grimes. G Grimes. I can see Grimes hanging out there. Fred Durst. Oh, my boy.

We can say this now. Probably he was a contact in the desert. We We couldn't find him.

Yeah, man. I saw him though. We did see him once. Yeah, he looks good. He looked great.

I like old man Fred Durst. It's awesome. He's doing real well with it. He really is. Um but then he said that according to Fugal that he was at the old homestead

or he was on his way back to the homestead. Yes. And he said first he looked in his line of sight, he saw an object in the sky. It was a full disc 40 to 50 ft long. It hovered in broad daylight. And then he said that it just blinked away. It disappeared in a second. And he said that it changed his whole life. And by then the History Channel came a calling.

Mhm. By 2018 his ranch manager started getting calls from History Channel producers. They wanted to collaborate on a TV show. Fugal reluctantly agreed.

Reluctantly. So long as they signed the NDA. And during their launch, one of the producers asked if he was a believer. He said, "I'm not a believer. I'm an experiencer." Yeah, it did.

And he said he had three conditions. Nothing could be faked. They had to use his team, his people. They couldn't History Channel couldn't bring in their own people.

Like what? His like own his cameramen and [ __ ] His researchers. No, his researchers.

His guys. I'm like, "NO, I GOT A GRIP. YOU GOT TO SEE MY GUY JOEY using another grip of my grip.

HE'S THE ONLY DEAF SOUNDMAN IN THE BUSINESS. WHAT? He's great. He's a FUNNY GUY.

I SAID YOU HIRE HIM. WHAT? NO, his researchers, his doctor, you know, his PhD guys, his paranormal guys, and he also had the condition that they not reveal his identity, but the History Channel people smartly said like, "Yeah, okay, first two points, great. We won't fake anything. We'll use your I'm sure they went and interviewed the dudes and like okay these guys are they may not be you know the pawn stars but they're entertaining enough.

What do you what how dare you insult dragon? Well I mean they're great but you know do they have a chumly?

No they don't have a they don't have a bumbling. They don't they don't have a chumling.

Do they have an old man? No they don't Hunters is by far a better reality show. All right, I understand there's more paranormal activity that happens at Pawn Stars and has happened in all of Search for Skinwalker Ranch, but still I'm I I don't [clears throat] begrudge it.

Yeah, I don't begrudge it either. But on the third point, they're like, "No, you got to be a character. We we have to know who owns this place. If you want to take this if you want to take this

if you want to be on TV, you got to be on the TV." Yeah. If you want people to take this investigation seriously, like you can't just we can't just have some unnamed guy owning the ranch.

Yeah, cuz in the Corbel documentary, they shot him like he was Dr. Claw from Inspector Gas.

Yeah, it's kind of fun. I like that. I miss that. I wish that he did more of that. I wish he understood how much more fun that is. Like if he walked around with a [ __ ] like mask on, that's so much more fun.

Yeah, it would be He's just petting an ALIEN LIKE OH YES. But so secrets to Skimwalker Ranch that it's but basically this guy and all of his buddies or like former colleagues like

Dragon Bryant Dragon Arnold which dragon doesn't like the name Dragon. I will say at first I did I was laughing but now I understand that it was a joke. At first I laughed because he had like too much booze on his breath.

No, it was because there was a guy. So according to lore before the they took over for the show there was security officers off and on the the skinwalker ranch that were hired by Robert Bigalow and there was one guy that was a [ __ ] [ __ ] that they called the dragon that used to threaten people with like shooting them in the head and [ __ ] and then eventually enough people asked this dude who was the fake head of security because it was Fugal's buddy to come to it and they kept asking him is he the dragon of old and they just started ironically calling him dragon and then it stuck.

Yeah. Well, they put a picture. Someone was like, "Yeah, here's dragon." And dragon, you [ __ ] dragon. You're dragon now. [ __ ] you. You're dragon. You're dragon. I don't like being dragon. [ __ ] you. You're dragon.

Yeah. He's angry that he's dragon. Yeah. And after Google brought the property, someone visited and met this guy and as like so you're dragon now. He's like, "No, I'm not." But they were like, "Fuck you. You're dragon now."

Here's what I think. Barbecue restaurant. You call it the mutilated cow. This is not that man. The dragon dragons mutilated cow.

Yeah, it's a barbecue restaurant. I mean, well, dragons mutilated cow is at the very least a dry rub.

Well, it's all honestly just call it cattle mutilations. That's what I eat [ __ ] once a week now. I'm down. I'm down on the red meat.

Nice. Yeah. But although dragon, he does carry a 12 gauge shotgun with him everywhere he goes.

Everywhere he goes cuz you never know what's going to happen. You're out in the middle of nowhere. Direwolves.

Yeah. Then you got the ranch manager Jim Morse. He was Jim was like Fu Fugal's like first big developer client like way way way back in the day. And of course like you know Jim just seemed like okay this is the right guy for the job. Yes.

You know he's the only one of the cast to claim that he's seen an actual skinwalker on the ranch.

Okay. Then you got Eric Bard. He's the principal investigator. The normal guy. He's fine. You know I I like

he's a he's a scientist. You know. Did you watch any of the show? Um, I don't think I watch There's so many shows. I don't think I watched the right one. I find it so interesting. Well, there they are two now. There are two shows. I But it is interested the one that was on Netflix that only has season two.

Yes, that's all you need. You're fine. I think you watched the wrong one. Yeah.

Yeah. This is the History Channel. The Doc. Yeah, The Doc is the best one. The Doc's the best.

That's the best one to watch. And this show is like they try. They really really try.

They really do. I couldn't get far into that. The Netflix show. They got a guy named Dr. Travis. Um

Yeah. Dr. Travis is the technically he's the handsome skeptic. Yeah. But he's now a believer.

He was uh in a show from 2011 to 2012 called Rocket City Rednecks. Yeah. And that was about him, his father, his brother-in-law, his best friend, and his nephew uh setting off rockets.

Yeah. He's got a star power. He's got good hair. Blowing up Boon Shine Distillery basically.

He's got good hair. He looks good. Well, they could tell the history of rocketry. like the reason why we built this rocket. This goes back to the V2. Oh, wait. We can't talk about the V2. Never mind. They're not They're not going to be really They're not Well, actually, but uh speaking of the V2, his father did build satellites at WY Laboratories under Verer Von.

Hey, no one comes out clean. So, he probably did know quite a bit about the V2. But going back to skim walkers at the Pentagon, Travis Taylor, he was the guy, and maybe we can wrap up on this. He also knew the mysterious axle rod.

Yeah, Axel Rod. No, this thing's October rain. Yay. No. How dare you? This He's an important man.

I'm truly one of my single favorite February snow. Don't you sick of listening to my uncle do these horrible G&R parodies? Um, he, this is one of my single favorite images from the Skinwalker Ranch book. I love this. I love this idea. So, according to George Nap, now George Snap, he does a good job of always being like, "Hey, I hear a lot of ridiculous things. I just report the shit." The first thing that him and Cole Keller got into a lot of trouble for, this is true, when they were talking from uh, Skimwalkers at the Pentagon is the dino beavers.

beaver versus the size of dinosaurs that according to Nicole Keller he saw. And so that was one thing he got a lot of [ __ ] for. But one of the other things that he got [ __ ] for was this story which I love which is like he talked to a guy. He was a federal employee with Axel a man by the name of Axel Rod

went by the name of Axel Rod. His name wasn't Axel Rod. Now according to her so during the Bigalow era they experienced phenomena inside of their home after they left witnessed by his wife as well. She witnessed what could only be described as a wolf standing on its hind legs in their backyard leaning against a tree with its paws crossed across his chest. Smoking a CIGARETTE like it's a [ __ ] 1950s greaser. Like one of my favorite

I lost the bones, [ __ ] Dude, but they talk about but Axel Rod is dropped by several different things. Axel Rod is a guy, but it's just a part of the mystery here that we don't know what the [ __ ] happening.

Yeah, Dr. Travis said he said he's made experiments with scientific instruments in Axel Rod's house. And this is actually interesting is that there have been simultaneous events within a microssecond of each other taking place in Axel Rod's house, Dr. Travis's house, and a house on Skimwalker Ranch. Okay. And many people Dr. Travis knows have had blue orbs and other things in their home. And a neighbor of Axel Rod, he that was the guy who developed a very dangerous form of cancer right afterwards. A guy was just over at Axel Rod's house. The blue blue orb flew through him and all of a sudden, ah, [ __ ] I got cancer.

It seems like it also attacks women like like the wives back home. It attacks everyone.

Yeah. Just make sure that knows that you shouldn't be in love if you like UFOs.

Yeah. It attacks wives. It attacks children. It attacks anybody that's in the house really. So, what does Natalie say about you trying to go to Skinwalker Ranch?

She'd love it. She loves it. Oh, yeah. She wants to go. She wants to go. Yeah, of course. Cool.

Oh, no. We want to go. All right. Oh, no. We ain't afraid of no UFOs. I ain't afraid. No ghost cancer.

Yeah, I'm getting in there. I'm going to wear a [ __ ] lead vest. I don't think that's going to help.

Why not? It's not We should go in. Lead vest, lead hat. Right. Go in. Protect ourselves against vibes.

I don't think it's going to work, man. Could be magnets. Yeah, could be magnets. No, no,

no. I'm not going. They're saying there's natural magnet deposits. That's one of the big things in the TV show that they kind of looking for. And one also thing that does happen in the TV show that they keep trying to do is that people get things happen to people who dig on the land. So, they have the one guy that they send out to go dig and then bad [ __ ] happens to him.

Magnus in the ground. Every time I throw a magnet in the air, it goes right back to the ground.

It's something else. Yeah, there's many good. Yeah. Thomas Winterton. He's the guy who keeps digging. Uh, and he keeps having accidents and like he's got like this thing on his head. He's like got this fluid that keeps [ __ ] like building up and a bump on his head. He keeps getting a drain. Anytime he talks about digging, the fluid starts building up again. Like it's just it's like Skinwalker Ranch is just it's one of the weirdest places on Earth. It really is. It's just weird. It's a weird place where weird [ __ ] happens. And that's the that's the most update we can possibly do.

The only thing I'll understand the Utah Triangle. But it is interesting. It is. But it is for me for it is so

more hole than a triangle. Basin. But it's like it's it's amazing to think that it's gotten so much coverage. This was extremely a secret untrodden place for thousands of years and now it's everywhere. Millions of people know about Skinwalker Ranch and the activity that happens in Skinwalker Ranch and still we know nothing. And I think that's an it's one thing that it it shows is that we're we're evested and people want it to be real. They want it to be real and it's hard to pin down. And I think that's one of the main what you were talking about is that it's hard because you're watching all this stuff.

You want something to come out of it, but it's never going to give it to you. Yeah.

It's never going to ever ever ever give it to you. It doesn't want you to have it.

It seems like there's nothing there. It's because it's honestly if it I'm I don't know. I know that it's it is makes total sense to say that there's nothing there, but it's more like it doesn't want you to have it.

Whatever is there, it doesn't want you to have it and it's not yours to have. Really? Stop putting cows there.

No, man. They That's their dinner. I think we just don't know how to record it.

I think I think there's there's absolutely something there. But people are probably yelling at us and saying that we're dumb or whatever already. But I but I still I' I've

But I'm not going to use a [ __ ] I'm not going to use a camera to take a picture of an atom, you know? It's like it's not the right tool, you know.

Camera's made out of atoms. There you go. Well, that's the thing is that we can use a, you know, like I'm not going to take a a camera to take a picture of bacteria, but I can use a microscope to take a picture of bacteria. And we had the we had the abilities to take pictures of people long before we had the abilities to take pictures of bacteria. And I think we're just in that same we're in that same technology like off a weird gap.

We need to be developing better cameras or different cameras. do that unless we spend the money to go do it, which requires us to waste $22 million of tax money in order to go and try to make something that might record something that would let them get more money.

Maybe. Yep. Yeah. Is that fun? There's a lot, you know, there's a lot there's a lot going on here. Um, but yes. Yeah. So,

I just believe goddamn George Nap. Yeah. I believe him and he the way he talked about it. I believe him. I believe that he doesn't want to go back. I believe that he said that what he what he was coming up against was far far bigger than when he uh uh is allowed to talk about and that he also has private information that he can't share, but it's the kind of stuff that keeps his hair white according to him.

You're telling me his hair can grow back color? THAT'S ENOUGH. THAT'S IT. THANKS SO MUCH FOR LISTENING to Last Update on the left, everybody. Uh go to patreon.com/lastpodcast on the left to see video episodes of our podcast. Follow us on Instagram, LP on the left, and on Tik Tok. Go see all of our shows that we do streaming with at twitch.tv/lpnv. And don't forget to go check out all of our live dates at lastodcast ontheleft.com. We're doing some East Coast shows coming up real soon. We're going to be going over to DC, New York City, uh, and we're going to be going to London and Reikuic in addition to Australia later on in the year. All those dates are at lastodcast ontheleft.com and go and see if your city's there. Go wait don't wait until we're in town at the airport the next the day here.

Yeah, the day after THE SHOW YOU WHY OH MAN, WHAT are you doing in Seattle? WE'RE TRYING TO TELL YOU.

WE'RE TRYING TO TELL YOU. YOU GOT TO CUT OUT THE SHOW. WE GOT IT'S A GOOD SHOW.

IT'S A good show. It's a good show. Just go check and see if maybe your city we're going to be coming to it or near it. We're coming to Boston.

Yeah. Also, Philadelphia and Chicago side stories is coming. So, check basically sold out, but we're going to be there. Buy the ticket to Chicago. We're going to be there. Nice.

All right. Goodbye, everybody. Goodbye. Hell. Okay. Hell nap. Yeah. Yeah.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Last Update on the Left - Episode 11 - Return to Skinwalker Ranch"?

Marcus Parks (Host), Henry Zabrowski (Host), Ed Larson (Host).

What is "Last Update on the Left - Episode 11 - Return to Skinwalker Ranch" about?

The discussion centers on a humorous and irreverent examination of skinwalkers, incorporating personal anecdotes, cultural references, and comedic banter among the hosts. They explore the concept of skinwalkers, weaving in themes of identity and transformation, while punctuating the conversation with lighthearted commentary about their own physical experiences and dietary habits.

What is mentioned in this Last Podcast On The Left episode?

15 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Skinwalker Ranch, History Channel, Axel Rod, Robert Bigelow, Hunt for the Skinwalker, George Knapp. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Last Update on the Left - Episode 11 - Return to Skinwalker Ranch"?

The episode runs 52 min; the transcript is about 10,773 words in 226 timestamped sections.

More from Last Podcast On The Left

About this transcript: the episode's spoken words as captioned on YouTube, split into timestamped sections. Reclip.Me locates every person, work and idea in the text, keeps the time it is first named, and quotes the words around it verbatim. Last updated January 24, 2026.