Expert FBI Profiler Breaks Down What's MOST Important About Disturbing Nancy Guthrie Crime Scene

What this episode is about

The investigation into the disappearance of Nancy Guthrie has intensified, with reports suggesting that her brother-in-law, Tomaso Cion, may be a prime suspect, although this has not been confirmed by law enforcement. Authorities have impounded the vehicle of Cion's wife, Annie Guthrie, and while officials deny identifying any suspects, they continue to conduct interviews and stress the importance of refraining from spreading unverified information.

Key takeaways

• Family ties tighten when it comes to crime—85% of murders involve someone known to the victim.
• Law enforcement's vague wording—'may be a suspect'—hints at cautious investigation rather than headline sensationalism.
• Towing a car isn't just a mundane procedure; it's a legal maneuver that often signals deeper scrutiny.
• Inquiries into familial relationships? Standard. Cops investigate all ties—love doesn't shield you from suspicion.
• Surveillance data and cell pings: modern sleuthing means even a silent phone can raise eyebrows.

Who speaks in this episode?

• Megyn Kelly (Guest) · 9 min speaking
• Jim (Guest) · 14 min speaking

What is discussed, and when

1. 0:00 – 5:00: Ashley Banfield, Annie Guthrie, Savannah Guthrie, Tomaso Cion
2. 10:00 – 15:00: Ashley Banfield, Tomaso Cion, Birch Gold Group

Notable quotes from "Expert FBI Profiler Breaks Down What's MOST Important About Disturbing Nancy Guthrie Crime Scene"

• Says that the brother-in-law of Savannah Guthrie, whose name is Tomaso Cion is quote may be the prime suspect. And with respect to Mr. Cion, we have not had any interaction with him. We have I'm assuming that he denies this.

  about Tomaso Cion · at 0:16

• Know repairmen and visitors of the house whatever. and family always has to go first and Ashley brought it up to concentric circles. You know 80 to 85% of murders are committed…

  about Ashley Banfield · at 2:21

• Think it was Annie Guthrie that brought the mom back from playing Ma Jang. We were also told that it was a church event. So, I'm assuming it was Ma Jang at the church on Saturday night at 9:45.

  about Ma Jang · at 4:29

• And connected to Mrs. Guthrie. the of course they would say to everyone who had interactions with Nancy within the hours leading up to her disappearance I you tell me but I…

  about Nancy Guthrie · at 6:38

• That gold has risen over 700% in the last 20 years and a never- ending list of reasons smart Americans diversify a portion of their savings into precious metals with Birch Gold…

  about Birch Gold Group · at 12:06

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

• Nancy Guthrie — Person · Missing person / victim referenced · 2 mentions
  Central figure in the discussion; the segment analyzes investigative steps and evidence related to her disappearance/abduction.
• Ashley Banfield — Person · Referenced journalist / reporter · 4 mentions · first at 0:06
  Cited as the reporter who 'exclusively' relayed law-enforcement-sourced claims about a potential suspect and the impounding of a vehicle.
• Tomaso Cion — Person · Referenced alleged suspect (unconfirmed) · 2 mentions · first at 0:21
  Named as Savannah Guthrie's brother-in-law and described (via a reporter's law-enforcement source) as someone who 'may be the prime suspect.'
• Annie Guthrie — Person · Referenced key witness/family member; vehicle owner discussed · 2 mentions · first at 0:56
  Identified as Savannah Guthrie's sister and wife of Tomaso Cion; her vehicle is reported to have been towed/impounded and she is described as last known to have driven Nancy home.
  Of that, law enforcement sources told Ashley Banfield that police have now towed and impounded the vehicle belonging to his wife, Annie Guthrie, who is Savannah's sister, and the missing woman, Nancy Guthri's daughter.
• Savannah Guthrie — Person · Referenced family connection (relative of involved parties) · 2 mentions · first at 0:18
  Used to identify relationships among the people discussed (her brother-in-law and sister), anchoring the alleged suspect link in the narrative.
  Who's been around the block, who says that the brother-in-law of Savannah Guthrie, whose name is Tomaso Cion is quote may be the prime suspect. And with respect to Mr. Cion, we have not had any interaction with him. We have.

Concepts & topics

• Ma Jang — Concept · Key argument · 1 mention · first at 4:30
  Mentioned in the context of the last known activity of the missing person, suggesting a possible connection to the investigation.

Sponsors

• Birch Gold Group — Company · Sponsor · 1 mention · first at 12:15
  Promoted as a service for diversifying savings into precious metals, particularly gold, during economic uncertainty.

Full transcript with timestamps

0:00 Jim, a lot has happened in the past 24 hours since we last spoke, so we wanted to get your reaction to all of it. Let's just start with the biggest piece. Um, Ashley Banfield reporting exclusively based on what she describes as a source high up in law enforcement, someone who's been around the block, uh, who says that that the the brother-in-law of Savannah Guthrie, uh, whose name is Tomaso Cion is quote may be the prime suspect. And with respect to Mr. uh Cion, we have not had any interaction with him. We have I'm assuming that he denies this vehemently. Uh we haven't heard from the family at all and he's not been expressly accused as being the suspect, but may be this the prime suspect was the wording that Ashley Banfield's law enforcement source gave her. And on top of that, law enforcement sources told Ashley Banfield that police have now towed and impounded the vehicle belonging to his wife, Annie Guthrie,

1:02 who is Savannah's sister, and the missing woman, Nancy Guthri's daughter. Um, Bashville went on to report that there was some connection to Annie Guthri's car and the son-in-law. So that's again, take it for what it's worth because it's one reporter with one law enforcement source unconfirmed and unresponded to by um the actual target of the report. The sheriff's office has come out, just to reiterate to the audience and tried to dismiss the report somewhat. Um it was an express denial, but they did say there is no suspect or person of interest who's been identified at this time. Um yeah, that's it. We have not identified a suspect or a person of interest. We continue to speak with anyone who may have had contact with Miss Guthrie and we're working daily. We appreciate public's concern, but sharing of unverified accusations or false information is irresponsible. It does not explicitly deny that they've

1:57 that they're looking at the son-in-law or that they towed and impounded Annie Guthri's car. So, your reaction to all that?

2:05 Okay. Uh, a lot there and a lot. I listened to your interview with Ashley. Very informative. Um when we started yesterday talking you and I uh victimology was the first term I mentioned. Yeah.

2:18 And in victimology we said family, friends. Then we broke it down to you know repairmen and and visitors of the house whatever. Uh and family always has to go first and Ashley brought it up to concentric circles. You know 80 to 85% of murders are committed by someone who knows the victim. how well they know them, you know, in passing tangentially or or actually, you know, a close, you know, very specific close family member. So, it's nothing unusual about family members being looked into uh in this sort of investigation. Um impounding a car um either through consent of your of the owner or certainly with a search warrant, which covers them more legally down the line, those would ever go to trial or pre-trial motions, whatever. Uh you know, makes the most sense there.

3:00 So, they must have had probable cause for something to bring in uh this car and consider this person.

3:06 They did it via warrant. She's not she's not sure whether he just gave it over.

3:12 Sure. Which they would sign the consent forms. I've done that hundreds of times in my law enforcement career. People if they have nothing to hide or even if they do sometimes, they would still sign uh the property over whatever it is. So, uh in a consent form. So, uh that happens all the time. And I'm I'm I'm a linguist too. And we can talk about that a little bit later with maybe these alleged ransom letters. But um

3:31 yeah, we definitely want to get to that. Interesting qualifier that this the word may m a y may be a prime suspect. And I get it. The source, whoever it is, is sort of covering their tracks in that regard. Uh uh because maybe they're very close but not that close that they have more information than that. But uh again quite frankly looking at the a a an immediate family member would not that be that unusual. Now why they were perhaps interviewing one or more family members the sister the brother-in-law perhaps they were also running phone uh cell phone tower checks and they see some activity late you know 2 in the morning Sunday morning that could have been part of the probable cause.

4:14 Exactly. This is where I want to go with it because forget Ashley's report for a second. If you're law enforcement out there and you know that it was Annie, I think it was Annie Guthrie and I don't know whether the husband was with her or not, but I think it was Annie Annie Guthrie that brought the mom back from playing Ma Jang. We were also told that it was a church event. So, I'm assuming it was Ma Jang at the church on Saturday night at 9:45. Hence the interest in her car potentially. But you would, of course, even though you assume a loving relationship between a mother and a daughter. That's not how cops work. They they actually don't assume loving relationships with anybody. They everybody's on the table until they're not on the table. So, they would have, wouldn't they, as a matter of due course, Jim, have done a search on her phone and where it was all night long and on her husband's phone and where it

5:03 was all night long. and Megan. Besides that, she's the last person ostensibly that saw her alive, certainly on the record. So, it has makes every sense and every common sense from an investigative perspective to look at that phone and then while they're looking at her phone, you know, look at the husband's phone, too. Uh the meaning uh Savannah's brother-in-law and that that makes perfect sense. And maybe something came up investigatively, uh, calls, you know, incoming, outgoing, maybe text messages, but if nothing else, just the pings on the local towers that said, "Hey, you know, this car was here." And if she, if the mother was dropped off at 9, 10, even 11:00 at night, it seems like everyone sort of signing into the fact that whatever bad happened to her was around 2:00 a.m., give or take. So, that's when the pinging would have to start again. may be very normal for the daughter uh Annie's car to show up there at again

5:55 nine t o'clock when mom's being dropped off. But if then goes back at two o'clock in the morning, that's when questions have to be asked. And the phone may not even indicate well it probably wouldn't indicate what car is being used. Who knows how many cars Annie and her husband have. And it's interesting it's we only hear one car being taken uh uh and by the search warrant and impounded but and not multiple. And there's no indications that the home was searched. So perhaps the police just going one step at a time. Stick with the obvious thing.

6:25 Maybe they know the car was the one that dropped her off or that's the one that was out at 2 a.m. and that's why they're looking to search it for little graphic here, but you know, obviously blood uh tissue uh anything that could be found and connected to uh Mrs. Guthrie. the of course they would say to everyone um who had had interactions with Nancy within the hours leading up to her disappearance I you tell me but I think they as soon as they sat down with Annie and Tomaso the next day they would have said can we have your phones wouldn't they Jim I mean isn't that standard of course may I can we have your phones like just to rule you out

7:05 well two things yeah for exclusionary purposes of course ask for the phones but I hope when the early interviews were done and you don't know yet, but I hope they separated uh husband and wife and did separate interviews uh and that way you could find out any kind of conflicting stories there. We don't know. I mean, everyone was probably crying, upset. The police go in there and and who knows, they may just interview people on the couch and and uh and Annie and her husband were there at the same time. I'm hoping at some point we have separate interviews uh and they can actually break down and really get into the weeds about who was where when and of course that is if they haven't lawyered up yet. Uh that remains to be seen.

7:44 True. As Ashley's one law enforcement source has told her that they have now towed and impounded Annie's vehicle. What does that tell you? Okay, so let's let's assume they didn't get a warrant. Let's assume they just asked Annie if they could take her car and they took it and they impounded it. What does that tell us?

8:06 Well, the word impounding doesn't really mean anything from a legal perspective. I mean, you could argue it could, but just if it's consensually agreed to, they could just take it to the parking lot of of the police or the sheriff's department and they have their their evidence response team go through it. They probably would bring in the FBI and those who do this stuff all the time. And of course, they're vacuuming. They're taking any kind of uh of of liquid samples, whatever they may be, and and they may have a cadaabver dog.

8:32 We talked about that a little bit yesterday, Megan. So, they're doing all kinds of forensic searches. They have, you know, material they spray. They have they have, you know, laser lights and all this stuff to look for, we'll just say remnants of of someone being in there, uh uh, you know, most likely against their will. I'm thinking in the trunk or the back seat, not just riding in the passenger seat. the the the the mother may have very well been in that car. So, her DNA in that car in and of itself touch DNA.

9:01 I think we know she was, you know, when when Annie dropped her off. Now, that would be the front seat or maybe the back seat. Was she in the trunk? Was she in some other part of the SUV? I don't even know what kind of car it is that you wouldn't have an 84 year old person uh riding in. And that's what they'd be looking for some of this very specific

9:20 Well, of course, we know that she was she was bleeding. We we know that from the blood spatter. But but before I get to that, um is there any reason if they didn't suspect Annie or her husband? I haven't heard that that they suspect Annie. If they didn't suspect her her spouse, Tomaso, is there any reason they would take that car? Like why would they take that car? Jim, I'm trying to find like a benign explanation for why they would, again, reportedly, according to one law enforcement source, take their car. and it wasn't denied in that sheriff statement.

9:55 Investigatively, they're trying to cover every possible lead, every possible potential they can. And they certainly want to make sure it's not damaged or somehow, you know, cleaned out or or or something else done with the car that could cover up evidence. So, someone came up with the idea, and again, I'm listening to the denials that you related from the from the sheriff spokesperson and that, you know, no prime suspect, no one is a person of interest, but they felt let's cover all our tracks here. Let's get the only car that we knew at least that Saturday night uh you know before midnight that that the mother was in. Let's go in there and see if perhaps any of those forensic materials there. So on the grand scheme of things uh Megan, I don't think it's all that unusual uh that this car would be taken. I I don't want to jump the gun here and right away point the finger at Tomaso. Um, you know,

10:44 we've been all been down the path before of cases like this and well, this guy looks really good, but you know, it it turned out not to be that person. So, uh, and I, you know, I'll respect Ashley's source. I've never a big fan of sources. I was never one while in the FBI, but that's another story. So, um, and I know they got I'm familiar with cases I worked, including the Anthrax case where an high up source got things really wrong and, uh, uh, and that didn't actually help the case when Chief Moose was not supposed to release the information from the tarot card. That's a piece of history there for your listeners. But uh so these source the source information is not always correct, but assuming that he's on to something there or she uh through Ashley uh it's not that unusual to take the closest people to a missing victim or a murder victim and and and just search out everything about them and that way

11:32 you can safely say you've ruled them out. And and and Megan, you're an attorney. I can see the investigator, the detective in court two years from now. Well, did you ever even consider searching the car of uh of of the brother-in-law, you know, and and then the sister? And they say, "No, they didn't."

11:47 Well, and that in front of a jury, that can create a whole sort of exculpatory sort of situation. So, they're covering all their tracks here. They may have 100% grounds for doing this. Or it may also be sort of an exclusionary thing. Let's get it out there.

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12:31 Birch Gold can help you convert an existing IRA or 401k into an IRA in gold. Just text MK to the number 989898 to receive your free info kit on gold. There's no obligation, just useful information with an A+ rating from the Better Business Bureau and tens of thousands of happy customers. Consider letting Birch Gold help you diversify with gold so you too can have peace of mind regardless of the uncertainty. Text MK to the number 989898. So, it's possible they just took that card to say, "We tracked down every lead." And it's possible this guy, this law enforcement officer, as you point out, we don't know if it's a guy or gal, saying the brother may be the brother-in-law, may be the prime suspect. Could just be him speculating this is on the opposite side of the ledger. We we should do both because we have no idea whether this is going to bear out or not, and we don't want to wrongly condemn this man. Nor does

13:20 Ashley Banfield, by the way. She But she's a very solid reporter. So, we're following step by step. I'll just end this part or I'll go on as long as you want, but I would actually say at this point the investigators would be remiss if they did not take that car and do a thorough search of it. Turn it back and say, "Hey, we found nothing in there." And go from there. That doesn't mean they won't find anything. I don't know. You and I are on the outside, so it's Ashley technically, although she's talking to someone on the inside. So, we don't know. But I I feel that's a very logical investigative step for them to take, including the phones, as you said earlier, and say, "Folks, this is very routine. you have no problem with this, right? There's some other cases. I know the John Ben Ramsey case, the parents, you know, fought tooth and nail. We don't have to get into all that, but there are some parents or some family

14:04 members that don't want to give up information. Uh or they fight it for months, uh, you know, interviews, things like that, and you wonder why.

14:12 Well, this would have been so strange. I mean, I I just can't imagine that Annie and Tomaso would have said anything other than, "Please take our phones and look at them, even if there was something to hide in this, you know, whatever scenario." uh because they called the cops at noon on Sunday. She had only been they'd only been alerted at 11:10 that she hadn't shown up at mass. So the sheriff has been pointing out they took about an hour to look for her themselves. They were worried. They they realized like this is very strange.

14:40 She's not where she's supposed to be. She's not in her home. Um but my point is like the sheriff then shows up at noon and you know at some point during the day when they realized they actually had a missing person, he he might have said to them, "Can I see your phones?" He might not have. He might have just been treating them as just complete victims. And um but I I it would have been so bizarre if he said, "Hey, can I see your phones just because you were last with her?" So bizarre at that point for for somebody to be like, "No, you can't." Like I feel like they would have been handling the whole investigation differently if somebody had said that.

15:12 So, okay, let's just keep going because that's all a discussion about what we don't know and what it might mean, which is not that helpful. But we do know that we've now seen blood out in front of the house. It is true that the the Nest camera is gone from the front of the house. Ashley's reporting that it was there was one there and then there was one behind the house and that they were destroyed. Um, so what did you glean from the blood evidence in the front?

15:40 Um, I mean obviously Mrs. Guthrie didn't go of her own accord. I mean that's that's that's very simple to stay there. We kind of discussed that yesterday and that is clear blood uh spatter to some degree. It looks like it's falling from a gravity perspective straight down. I don't see the uh you know the the the brush stroke so to speak going off in different directions. I didn't really look at that closely, but uh so it looks like someone's being carried out uh or or at least you know supported under their arms because we know this woman can't walk all that far on her own. And if someone punched her in the nose, punched her in the mouth, uh of course she's going to need help walking or she has to be carried. So somehow the blood from a gravity perspective is flowing downward. Who knows how the body was repositioned uh uh in in some way, shape or form? Was a was a cover, you know, did the person

16:30 have a, you know, whatever paper towels, whatever. Put it over mouth or nose to make sure the blood hopefully wouldn't get in the car. They probably didn't care about it on the on the street or the driveway, uh whatever that is, the pavement, but they probably didn't want it in the car. Now, the odds are it still wound up there anyway. there's going to be trace evidence if that if if if Mrs. Guthrie was put in the car, there's going to be trace evidence of her certainly what she was wearing, etc. So, uh, without seeing more of a of a of a of a longitudinal, uh, from inside the house to outside, the exact length and breath of the blood droppings, I'm not sure what else to make, although the body just could have been re repositioned where the blood came down more on top of Mrs. Guthrie, whatever she's wearing, and for the moments from wherever it stopped at the front door into the car, uh, we have an absence of

17:16 it, and it could be a very logical explanation having to do with physics and gravity.

17:20 Yeah, you ra you raised a good point about how the it's blood droplets. There's not a smearing of it

17:27 and there's a there's a significant amount, but I don't it could be from like a nose bleed that to me didn't look like somebody had been, you know, shot in the femoral artery, right? It wasn't that level of blood.

17:40 No. And I It doesn't look like arterial bleeding as you just uh intimated there. Uh but you know, someone had to slap this and I hate to you know get as graphic as it but you know probably to control her. She may have started yelling, screaming, who knows? And we discussed yesterday, did someone ring the bell, knock on the door? Did they have a key to the door? This brings in the family situation. We can't rule anything out at this point. You know, is it that stranger? Is it a stranger that she kind of knew that knocked on the door and recognized, oh, can you help me? And they let her in and then, you know, she's uh coldcocked by somehow hiding someone behind uh you know, behind the door jam, whatever. So, it's uh there's still a lot of scenarios to look at here, but the blood itself, I'm not going to put any high level of sophistication that these, you know, special bandages were used to stop it.

18:27 It could have just very well been that let's just pick the person up and put in the car. And you raised a point early on with Ashley and I think both of you agreed on it and um uh if this was a stranger and somehow she was killed um just leave the body there. There's no reason to take the body, especially now that there's been no kidnapping demand certainly of which we are aware. But if somebody knew the person, that's a whole different set of of criminal activity. There's then staging involved. And staging doesn't have to be real sophisticated where you pull out drawers and you you take some jewelry to make it look like it was a burglary of some sort. It could simply be uh just removing the body and uh or the person and and that could be the sort. So if you're if you know the person and again we're now talking that it's not a kidnapping for ransom. If you know the person and you think you could be a

19:20 logical suspect, you do a lot of things different when you commit a crime to avoid being named in that suspect pool. M mhm. It's just so strange that she was removed. I mean, if if this isn't a kidnapping for money, why was she removed? I like we talked about yesterday, maybe it was a kidnapping for money all along, but she passed once she was kidnapped because she's an old woman and she isn't in great health. But either way, you were pointing out they could still try a ransom demand and that does not appear to have happened so far, which I'm going to get to those ransom notes in one second, but I'm still on the House. Ashley's also reporting that there were two Nest, not Ring cameras.

19:58 We saw one was used to be at the front door and her reporting is that the second one I think I think she believed it the second was at the second the back door and that the back door was open. She reported that as well from her law enforcement source. So, um it is interesting that the two cameras her reporting is that they were destroyed and then we believe though it hasn't been confirmed that then law enforcement took them. Um, so that is that a sophisticated thing or no? And what does it tell you? Like I would imagine if I'm going to break into a house I don't know, I'm probably only worrying about the Nest camera that's on the the door that I'm using. I mean, it's kind of interesting that they're both allegedly destroyed on front and back.

20:41 You know, I like throwing in quasi historical elements sometimes when I'm looking at these cases. And when I was a young police officer at our FBI, Hen Buries, the better knew to unscrew the L top of the door, uh, you know, the front door.

20:57 Wait, can you repeat that, Jim? I missed that. Sure. As a young, uh, police officer and then FBI handling burglary cases, big ones, little ones. Sometimes the bad guy would go up and unscrew the light on top of the front door, and that just gives them privacy. They may do it the night before or sometime during the day, then come back. So that's not what happened here, but it shows that someone's thinking a little bit in advance. And I didn't use the word yesterday, but I truly believe that the term that this person was missionoriented. They went there with a purpose. Uh, and they knew enough. You didn't have to unscrew the light bulb like I said before all these cameras are out there, but they knew enough to take one or both cameras.

21:37 Perhaps they did both cameras first because they weren't sure how they would get in ingress and how they would get out egress. So, they wanted to cover uh you know, both angles, so to speak, and and just take out both cameras and smash them. I'm not sure why the police wouldn't say either they have the cameras or they don't have the cameras. Uh but, uh you know, smashed or not, but whatever that they're not admitting to that. So, perhaps it's evidence they know they can find on the person, although you think there'd be no reason for them to keep the cameras if they took them with them, meaning the kidnapper, the abductor. So, uh, so again, a little bit of sophistication I'll give to this team. I person or team. Uh, I I I but I won't put them in some sort of a, you know, ultra level of of criminal mastermind. They knew to smash a camera, maybe take it and and and do whatever with it. In the old

22:28 days, they would have unscrewed the light bulb on top of one or two doors leading into the place.

22:34 Thanks so much for watching. If you like what you just saw, hit the subscribe button for more clips and full episodes.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Expert FBI Profiler Breaks Down What's MOST Important About Disturbing Nancy Guthrie Crime Scene"?

Megyn Kelly (Guest), Jim (Guest).

What is "Expert FBI Profiler Breaks Down What's MOST Important About Disturbing Nancy Guthrie Crime Scene" about?

The investigation into the disappearance of Nancy Guthrie has intensified, with reports suggesting that her brother-in-law, Tomaso Cion, may be a prime suspect, although this has not been confirmed by law enforcement. Authorities have impounded the vehicle of Cion's wife, Annie Guthrie, and while officials deny identifying any suspects, they continue to conduct interviews and stress the…

What is mentioned in this Megyn Kelly episode?

7 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Nancy Guthrie, Ashley Banfield, Tomaso Cion, Annie Guthrie, Savannah Guthrie, Ma Jang. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Expert FBI Profiler Breaks Down What's MOST Important About Disturbing Nancy Guthrie Crime Scene"?

The episode runs 23 min; the transcript is about 4,638 words in 44 timestamped sections.

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