‘Expecting An Attack Any Day Now” Venezuela Boat Strikes With John Kiriakou & Ed Calderon

What this episode is about

The discussion centers on the complexities of Venezuela's role in the global drug trade, particularly the fentanyl crisis affecting the United States. Key points include the assertion that much of the fentanyl in the U.S. comes from Mexican cartels using Chinese chemicals, rather than directly from Venezuela. There are implications of geopolitical maneuvers, suggesting that U.S. actions against Venezuela may be more about countering Chinese influence in the region than solely addressing drug trafficking.

Key takeaways

• Venezuela’s fentanyl narrative may mask deeper geopolitical chess moves against China and Russia.
• Despite Maduro's links, most fentanyl in the U.S. is sourced from Mexican cartels using Chinese chemicals.
• Regime change claims can often be cover-ups; Venezuelan oil is too tempting a prize to ignore.
• Venezuela's complex ties to drug trade complicate the narrative; less about drugs, more about global power plays.
• With a chaotic regime in place, U.S. motives shift from protection to opportunism—an ironic twist on 'America First.'

Who speaks in this episode?

• Piers Morgan (Host) · 11 min speaking
• Ed Calderon (Guest) · 18 min speaking
• John Kiriakou (Guest) · 7 min speaking

What is discussed, and when

1. 0:00 – 5:00: cartels, regime change, Piers Morgan Uncensored, Ed Cordran
2. 5:00 – 10:00: mass exodus, regime change, cartels
3. 10:00 – 15:00: cartels
4. 15:00 – 20:00: Ed Cordran, humanitarian crisis, ExpressVPN, Tijuana
5. 20:00 – 25:00: regime change, Piers Morgan Uncensored, John Keryaku, cartels
6. 25:00 – 30:00: regime change
7. 35:00 – 35:58: Piers Morgan Uncensored

Notable quotes from "‘Expecting An Attack Any Day Now” Venezuela Boat Strikes With John Kiriakou & Ed Calderon"

• Drugs. Venezuelan cartels are shipping fentinel into the United States. they say with the full complicity of President Maduro. The socialist leader is thereby contributing to a crisis.

  about cartels · at 1:03

• The military has long since been known for their association with certain cartels, specifically the Senoa cartel when it was existing back in the day. Chapa Buzzman was arrested speaking to members of the military trying to figure.

  about Senoa cartel · at 3:33

• There has been a mass exodus of people from Venezuela, hasn't there?

  about mass exodus · at 7:08

• Pressure right now is to make Maduro reach a deal and extract himself from Venezuela. I'm expecting a plane flying out of Venezuela, landing in Russia sometime Syria style any day now. Hopefully that is the where we're headed.

  about Ed Cordran · at 16:45

• So now add on to that the war aspect and I think we're in for some pretty horrible humanitarian crisis.

  about humanitarian crisis · at 18:09

• America as recently as the 1980s. But this is unusual because we've never used drugs as a reason to institute regime change. Let's let's put it that way. I think that's only a part of it though, Pierce. I think that.

  about regime change · at 21:55

• Too. This could be a bluff, but let's assume for the sake of this question that it's not a bluff. The CIA would be doing everything from trying to recruit or to influence the…

  about John Keryaku · at 27:26

• Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask for only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan.

  about Piers Morgan Uncensored · at 35:26

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

• John Keryaku — Person · Main guest (segment 2) · 1 mention · first at 20:48
  Former CIA officer/whistleblower providing historical context on U.S. interventions, assessing motives (China/oil), and describing likely CIA coup tactics.
• Ed Cordran — Person · Main guest (segment 1) · 2 mentions · first at 1:30
  Provides analysis as a cartel/security expert: disputes fentanyl sourcing claims, discusses trafficking routes, deterrence, and risks of invasion/insurgency.

Companies & orgs

• United Fruit Company — Company · Historical example entity · 1 mention · first at 21:44
  Used as an emblematic case of U.S.-linked corporate influence and intervention tied to Guatemala’s overthrow.
  Latin America. Much of that history has been very ugly. We could sit here and talk for hours about the United Fruit Company, for example, and the overthrow of a democratically…
• Senoa cartel — Company · Referenced criminal organization · 1 mention · first at 3:41
  Cited by Ed Cordran as a cartel historically associated with Venezuelan military elements (as alleged in the discussion).

Concepts & topics

• regime change — Concept · Core debated concept · 9 mentions · first at 0:14
  The central interpretive frame: guests argue drugs may be a pretext for regime change, and discuss historical precedents and post-invasion risks.
• cartels — Concept · Core topic concept · 6 mentions · first at 1:03
  Cartels are discussed as producers/transporters of fentanyl and cocaine, as quasi-governance actors, and as justification/cover for policy escalation.
• mass exodus — Concept · Core consequence concept · 2 mentions · first at 7:08
  Used to describe large-scale Venezuelan migration through Mexico and abroad, shaping the humanitarian and political context.
• humanitarian crisis — Concept · Core consequence concept · 1 mention · first at 18:14
  Raised as a likely outcome of invasion/instability, compounded by existing shortages (water/food) and displacement.

Places & events

• China — Place · Strategic competitor referenced · 2 mentions · first at 2:24
  China is cited as a source of precursor chemicals for fentanyl and as a geopolitical driver (refinery/oil influence) behind U.S. actions in Venezuela.
  Perhaps this is a way to keep the Chinese out of the Caribbean, to keep the Chinese out of Venezuela. You can say you're doing it in order to stop the flow of drugs, even if that's not really.
• Tijuana — Place · Personal background reference · 1 mention · first at 15:28
  Ed Cordran cites growing up in Tijuana to ground his perspective on cartel violence and drug impacts.
  And government in in some of the places they control and the effects of this I mean I grew up on the streets of Tijuana and I've went from there to going to places like…

Media & podcasts

• Piers Morgan Uncensored — Media · Primary show / platform · 3 mentions · first at 1:34
  The program hosting both interviews (Ed Cordran and John Keryaku) and framing the debate about Venezuela, drugs, and regime change.

Sponsors

• ExpressVPN — Product · Sponsor product · 2 mentions · first at 19:39
  Advertised as a privacy/security tool during the sponsor segment, unrelated to the Venezuela analysis content.
  Brokers who steal your information online. The solution is very simple. Use ExpressVPN to shut them down. Top tier encryption keeps your activity hidden, even on dodgy public…
• Optimum Day — Product · Sponsor product · 1 mention · first at 18:47
  Advertised supplement claimed to boost energy and support weight loss.
  Supplements. Thousands of Brits and Americans are already taking them with incredible results. Optimum Day boosts your energy and supports weight loss throughout the day.…
• Optimum Night — Product · Sponsor product · 1 mention · first at 18:47
  Advertised supplement claimed to help relaxation and sleep.
  Incredible results. Optimum Day boosts your energy and supports weight loss throughout the day. Optimum Night helps you relax and get deep, refreshing sleep. They have…
• Michael Owen — Person · Sponsor testimonial figure · 1 mention · first at 19:06
  Mentioned as a celebrity success story in the Oxford Natural supplement advertisement.
  Sleep. They have countless success stories, including from some very familiar faces. England legend Michael Owen, who lost 40 lb. AFTV's Robbie, who lost more than 100 pounds.…

Full transcript with timestamps

0:01 You said fentinel at the beginning and you are right. A lot of that product is not coming from Venezuela. It's coming from Mexico. It's coming from China specifically. It's a very broad sword this narrative designation. I think that is being used to conduct some regime change.

0:16 Right? So that's the key point here. I think there's something global happening here and this is just one part of the uh chessboard. Perhaps this is a way to keep the Chinese out of the Caribbean, to keep the Chinese out of Venezuela. You can say you're doing it in order to stop the flow of drugs, even if that's not really the case.

0:34 What will the CIA be doing right now in Venezuela? To affect a coup, if if you want it to be quick, everything that's important is going to take place in the capital. You have to control the radio and television stations. You have to surround the presidential palace and you have to control the major intersections in the city. Once that happens, all the other dominoes begin to fall. The White House is very clear about why it's ramping up pressure on Venezuela. Drugs. Venezuelan cartels are shipping fentinel into the United States. they say with the full complicity of President Maduro. The socialist leader is thereby contributing to a crisis which has killed hundreds of thousands of Americans justifying a state of war readiness and a series of deadly air strikes on small Venezuelan boats. But not everybody's convinced the majority of all fentinel in the US is made using Chinese chemicals by cartels in Mexico

1:27 from where almost all of it is imported. Well, Ed Cordran is a combat instructor, security consultant, and a cartels expert and he joins me now. Ed, thank you very much indeed for joining me.

1:37 Thank you. What do you make of this? I mean, Donald Trump is accusing Nicholas Maduro, the president of Venezuela, of conducting a narco war, of running a narot terrorist cartel. You're a cartel expert. Is he right?

1:52 U the connections between his family and uh the movement of cocaine into the United States has long since been known. 2015 saw two of his nephews basically arrested for some of these issues. Uh the military in Venezuela has been engaging in these activities for years now. Uh it is something that is happening. Um cocaine though you said fentinel at the beginning and you are right a lot of that product is not coming from Venezuela. It's coming from Mexico. It's coming from overseas, China specifically. Um it's a very broad sword this narrrorism designation I think that is being used in this case uh to conduct some uh regime change.

2:38 Right? So that's the key point here is that many people think it's a cover for regime change aspirations by the US uh government under Donald Trump. Uh and many people speculate it's because Venezuela has a lot of oil uh and that you have a socialist leader who they think is there by default. uh the last election he should have left but he's refused to go and so on. Um and there's also a kind of like like an anomaly here where if you were choosing one of the countries in that region as a place to target for import say of cocaine or illegal drugs generally then you would probably choose Colombia not Venezuela.

3:15 So why why Venezuela? U 10% of cocaine this is these are government US government numbers back from 2009. 10% of cocaine coming into the United States was coming from Venezuela. The numbers are now completely impossible to know because of some of the things that are happening on the seaside.

3:33 Um the military um has long since been known for their association with certain cartels, specifically the Senoa cartel when it was existing back in the day. Uh Chapa Buzzman was arrested speaking to members of the military trying to figure out how to get a close connection Yes, Colombia should be on that list as well. And I think it might be on that list. Um, I think many countries in South America and North America, that being Mexico, are probably on a list. They were attempting to do something in Venezuela that they might want to replicate other parts of the in other parts of the continent. I think um it's it's it's hard to it's hard to it's hard to blame the United States uh as far as how it views the the the situation in Venezuela. I mean, I'm currently in Sweden and I've spoken with some people who are refugees of Venezuela here and they've explained to me how the current government has

4:29 basically stolen their lands, um put in people that they know and family members that they know in in positions of power in that region and basically took everything for themselves. uh they're looking for any single way every single way of making money in that region and uh the military is very much involved in in in some of these activities. So it's it's it's a it's a real thing. Um now how big of a threat is versus other parts of the other parts of the continent and and prioritize and prioritizement that's that's where I I know people are questioning resources specifically in that region. Um, but the the Venezuelan uh government itself has single-handedly destroyed most of its ability to process a lot of the fuel that it extracts from the ground. So, here we are.

5:15 Right. So, you got a sort of chaotic regime, probably illegitimate now. Um, and acting with impunity um and that may be a a collection of explanations for why the US is considering regime change. Of course, Donald Trump has always been very anti-regime change and spoken out against regime change and thinking the America should be America first and shouldn't be inter intervening in foreign countries. So, what do you think is going on here with his change of mind if that's what happens?

5:47 I mean, Venezuela has very clear uh ties to the United States's enemies abroad. I mean Russia and China coincident I mean and to we have to mention that they are nowhere to be seen realistically as far as coming to their aid. Um I think there's something global hope happening here and this is just one part of the uh chess board that the United States is playing. um this it's unsustainable whatever is going on there as far as the governance and and just I mean I I get to speak to a lot of refugees and people I I do a lot of charity work and to speak specifically to the immigrant uh situation. Uh there is something happening there that is driving humanity away from that country that is undeniable. Now, is that a just cause to blow up uh drug boats in in the ocean without really knowing exactly what's going on there? Um and and the people that are on those boats, this is beyond my uh wheelhouse.

6:48 Um but uh people people there are expecting an attack any day now. And people that are not there who are living abroad are jubilant with the uh possibility that the regime is going away. Uh and it's hard to it's hard to ignore those voices as well.

7:08 There has been a mass exodus of people from Venezuela, hasn't there? Yes. Uh we saw the migrant caravans being conformed by many many Venezuelans going through Mexico. Um some of these encampments uh were full of them. Um we we have uh we have this uh narrative in some in some places where some of these where all of these migrants are criminal, which is not the case. Uh again, I've I've been speaking to some in Switzerland who are, you know, highly educated people. Uh people that come from uh that come came from uh wealthy families that were pretty much set in in Venezuela that were stripped of land, stripped of property, uh stripped of everything they they know they they owned and and basically left to the wind. um this this broad stroke that sometimes gets labeled on some of these migrants as all being criminal, as all being part of a part of these uh international transnational gangs is is is false. Um

8:08 but yes, the mass uh the mass humanity that has been moving out of the country and crossing the border specifically in the time of the Biden administration where that border was basically wide open.

8:19 Um a lot of those were Venezuelan. uh a lot of uh a lot of the uh a lot of the there's a lot there's this the thing gets told a lot by the president right now in the United States about prisons being emptied that was actually that actually did happen and prisons were emptied and Mexico specifically right now and I have uh friends who are working at a federal level right now they're are dealing with threata threats in Mexico City for example where they're setting up they're clearing out cartels. They're local Mexican cartels with their their ongoing efforts against the cartels in Mexico. And now you're seeing tenda tenderawa uh people basically setting up shop in Mexico. So yes, it is it is a it is a real threat that is happening not only in uh not only throughout Latin America but in Mexico and yes the United States as well. Uh speaking to some of my counterparts who are are active there that they've seen

9:17 this threat and it is a real one but it's not all of them. again this broad stroke that this broad brush that gets painted against all of them as criminals or as some sort of undesirable people is is just uh it's just not the case.

9:31 What is the general view amongst the Venezuelans you've talked to about the likelihood that these boats that are being targeted are being uh gang operated. Uh they are criminals and they are trying to bring in large amounts of drugs into the United States and therefore are legitimate targets. Uh it's it's it's uh it's it's probably I mean this is a transport job. These drug boats are drug boats. There's no denying that they are moving uh quantities of drugs through the ocean. Now, are they going to make it all the way to Florida uh with the fuel they have on those boats? Probably not. Uh they're transporting from one point to another.

10:10 Most of the trafficking has moved to the ground. That's where the the the real threat as far as drug trafficking happens. Everything's everything most of it is now moving through the ground. You have on the Pacific side the Navy the US Navy and on the Atlant and on the uh the Caribbean side it's it's full of the it's it's full of uh government ships. Uh the sentiment is uh mixed. Um you have to realize that a lot of these people that are probably on those boats are poor marginalized people. I don't think they probably any I don't I don't think there are any sort of military officials on those boats. They're kids.

10:46 They're they're minors maybe on some of these boats. Uh and you know, if you're a human being and you have any sort of sentiment towards uh towards uh humanity, seeing seeing them get blown up in the middle of the ocean and then survivors getting uh blown up again is going to be something that's going to hit you in a certain way. Um but

11:07 will it will it act though uh Ed as a deterrent which is obviously what the Trump administration is saying is that they they believe if they keep doing this the number of boats bringing these drugs over which is you say it's it's you you're certain they are drug boats that if they want to stop the drugs coming this will be a very effective deterrent.

11:25 It is a very effective deterrent. Fear is there I have to say it is a very effective deterrent. the trafficking side of things on both sides of the ocean. We don't hear a lot about some of the boats that have been that that have been um taken out on the uh coast coast of Mexico, but there have been a few as well. And um speaking to people that are in law enforcement still currently active on both sides of the border, both in Mexico and the United States, they have seen some sort of uh stoppage at least of traffic uh on the on the ocean.

11:59 So it is working on that end. But we also have to realize that uh drug prices and the availability of some of these substances hasn't really diminished or moved in any significant way. So yes, there is an effect on the ocean and the way things are being trafficked and fear is on there. Fear is on fear is in the water basically. But the effects of of of these policies haven't been felt in the cities and on the streets in in the United States. Um, so that's I I think that's where that's where at least people on my end of of things who are analyzing this closely haven't really seen that needle move. So then is this working would be the question,

12:51 right? Because these drug gangs, they're very sophisticated. They're very well resourced and presumably if they lose a particular way of transporting their drugs, they'll find another way.

13:01 That's it. Yeah, that's it. Pierce, uh, Colombia is another source. Mexico is another source. So there there's a lot of sources right now. This very broad sword that is this this uh terrorist designation is being utilized in Venezuela for many reasons. And I think uh I think we all know that there there are many more reasons beyond that of this being a specific counter.

13:28 I mean also there's a kind of operation there's a kind of obvious double standard that's just emerged this week where you've got President Trump at a cabinet meeting yesterday saying anyone who brings drugs into the US will die. Let's watch the clip.

13:45 Mr. President, if you are declaring war against these cartels, and Congress is likely to um approve of that process, why not just ask for a declaration of war?

13:55 Well, I don't think we're going to necessarily ask for a declaration of war. I think we're just going to kill people that are bringing drugs into our country, okay? We're going to kill them. You know, they're going to be like dead. Okay? Now that's strong words. But then he has literally just pardoned and released the former president of Honduras, Juan Orlando Hernandez, who in 2024, just last year, was found guilty of conspiring to import cocaine to the United States and sentenced to 45 years in prison. There'll be many people looking at that going, "Hang on, how does that work?"

14:32 It's uh from what I can tell and from what I've seen as far as that release, uh he's basically saying that it was a political motivated arrest and that he was framed for for those crimes by the past administration. The veracity of that is it's it's beyond me if that is a true statement or not. um his threats of death, his threat, his threats of uh killing people that are going to cross drugs into into into the United States is something that I have to tell you, Pierce, it resonates a lot with people that have been the victims of these substances and in these criminal organizations on many parts in many parts of the continent. Um myself included. um these criminal organizations have taken over vast amounts of territory become governors and government in in in in some of the places they control and the effects of this I mean I grew up on the streets of Tijuana and I've went from there to going to places like Portland and seeing

15:35 some of the effects of some of these substances and how it consumes people. Not even that. I mean, I have friends who had kids 17, 16, who just took some drugs at a party. Um, and didn't wake up.

15:49 I understand some of the anger and some of the feelings around some of these substances and some of the people that voted and got the president to the White House and why this is such a a motivating topic uh for for for the populace. Um, now this designation and how it's being utilized and the scope of it, I think is what people are now kind of backing up a bit and trying to see if it's actually feasible or not to be utilizing this designation to continue on with these efforts. I have a feeling that this is going to continue on and I think uh whatever happens in Venezuela is going to be a template for further actions of in other parts of the continent.

16:36 Do you think it is more likely than not that the US will invade Venezuela? I think I think it's I think I think the pressure right now is to make Maduro reach a deal and extract himself from Venezuela. I'm expecting a plane flying out of Venezuela, landing in Russia sometime uh Syria style any day now. Hopefully that is the the where we're headed. Um, speaking to people that know more about military inventions than I do, Venezuela is a very it's going to be a very difficult thing to to hold and to and to control if the regime falls and turns into a guerilla force. We must we we must understand that Venezuela, the Venezuelan military is one thing, but also there's a bunch of guerilla forces in in in around Venezuela that are aligned with the regime that will basically take up arms against whoever

17:35 stays in power. And we're going to look at we're going to be looking at another Afghanistan or another or another Iraq as far as not only the battle not being concluded when the invasion concludes but when the death toll rises from trying to hold that space. And that's not even taking into account the the mass amount of humanity that is already struggling with things like uh portable water or food in in some of these regions by the regime's complete mishandling of everything when it comes to governments.

18:09 So now add on to that the the war aspect and I think we're in for some pretty horrible humanitarian crisis. Hopefully Maduro and his uh family jump on a plane with a bunch of gold bricks like a lot of people that have followed kind of his suit and uh fly to Russia or China, whoever takes him.

18:35 Yeah, let's hope that he sees sense. It could get very messy. Ed Cordwell, thank you very much indeed for joining me. I appreciate it.

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20:13 That's ExpressVPN's lowest price ever, plus four extra months of service. Just scan the QR code on the screen or go to expressvpn.com/pers. From plotting to lace Fidel Castro's diving suit with poison fungus to the execution of Sha Gavara, the CIA has a long and troubled history of meddling in the countries south of his own border, especially when socialists are involved. President Trump says he's authorized secret CIA missions inside Venezuela along with a not so secret massing of naval forces in the Caribbean Sea. For his view on what's going on and why, I'm joined by the former CIA officer and whistleblower, John Keryaku. John, welcome back to Uncensored.

20:53 Thank you so much for having me. It's always a pleasure. So, what's going on here? Is the US using the obviously uh genuine threat of drug cartels bringing drugs in to United States via these boats as a an excuse for regime change? And if so, why?

21:15 I think probably yes. which which I think also is unfortunate because you know there are legitimate reasons to to put pressure on the likes of Nicholas Maduro but you don't have to threaten invasion to do that. I I think that what we're seeing here is a multiaceted program. First of all the the US has a very very long history of course going back to the Monroe Doctrine uh in in Latin America. Much of that history has been very ugly. We could sit here and talk for hours about the United Fruit Company, for example, and the overthrow of a democratically elected government in in Guatemala. Uh we could talk about military dictatorships in in South America as recently as the 1980s. But but this is this is unusual because we've never used drugs as as a reason to to institute regime change. Let's let's put it that way. Um, I I think that's only a part of it though, Pierce. I think that there's a bigger picture issue at play

22:17 here, and that is China's influence in Latin America. Look at it this way. The Venezuelans are sitting on an ocean of oil. That oil happens to be very dirty. It's very, very high in sulfur. And for many decades, the only place where that oil could be refined properly was at refineries in southern Texas. Well, now the Chinese are building a refinery in the Caribbean, and the Chinese will be willing and able to refine high sulfur uh Venezuelan oil. Perhaps this is a way to keep the Chinese out of the Caribbean, to keep the Chinese out of Venezuela. Certainly, having a regime change operation successful in Venezuela would make the Colombian uh military very happy. And then at the same time, you can you can say you're doing it in order to stop to stop the flow of drugs, even if that's not really the case.

23:12 The history of regime change involving United States is pretty messy. Is there any guarantee that if the US committed troops on the ground to actually invade Venezuela, it wouldn't end up like Iraq, for example? I mean, Venezuela has even more oil than Iraq. um you know, could it could it turn into another Iraq if the US is not careful?

23:34 Oh, I think the answer is yes. You you've hit on something very important here. This is something that the United States has traditionally been very bad at.

23:44 It's easy. It's easy to go into a country and overthrow its leadership. That's the easy part. The difficult part is what to do next.

23:51 Regime change is one thing. regime or nation building, rather, nation building is an entirely different thing. You know, I sat in a I sat in a meeting. I think you'll get a kick out of this. I sat in a meeting the night before the US invasion of Iraq. The meeting was chaired by Vice President Cheney. I was the notetaker for CIA director George Tennant. And uh it was the vice president, the secretary of state, the secretary of defense, the chairman of the joint chiefs, the CIA director, all the big principles. And one of the briefers was the director of Sentcom, the Central Command, and he said almost off-handedly that things will go well tomorrow when we cross the border into Iraq, the Iraqis will throw flowers at us. And he said, "If things go as planned, we can be in Tehran by August."

24:43 And director Tennant turned off his microphone and he turned to me and he said, "Did he say Thrron or did he say Baghdad?" I said, "He said Tehran." And George says, "Are these people insane?" Well, the answer is yes. Often times they are insane. At least they they think so highly of themselves and their own ability or the Pentagon's ability to institute forced change and then to live happily ever after. You would think that they would learn their lesson when we fail time after time after time.

25:15 And isn't isn't there a clear I mean, isn't there a clear lesson from what's happened in Syria, right? Where if it's organic and it comes from within and it's Syrian driven by Syrian people who want to affect their own regime change. Actually, it can be far quicker, far more effective, and far less messy. Look, we have to we have to wait and see what happens in Syria, but certainly so far it would be hard to argue that the new regime is worse than the Assad regime. Uh and America didn't have to do very much. Right. And in fact, Putin back then Exactly. Right. So it just seems to me there's an obvious template there for organic regime change always being a better option than enforced regime change particularly from the US who are often get themselves coralled into really messy situation for long periods of time.

26:08 Oh, I think you've hit the nail on the head and Syria ought to be the template for how we move forward on these. Listen, there's there's no problem uh from a policy perspective to supply uh uh aid, for example, whether it's economic aid or or military aid to the Kurds or to, you know, free Syrian fighters. Oddly enough, we had the CIA most recently in Syria, we had the CIA supplying al-Qaeda and the Pentagon supplying a completely different group that was at war with al-Qaeda. So, we almost came out on top in spite of ourselves there. But I think you're right. I think Syria is something that should be studied in the halls of international intelligence services and, you know, implemented with more of a handsoff approach. Going into a country and just occupying it and and thinking that you're going to succeed just because we're the good guys is not a workable plan.

27:06 What will the CIA be doing right now in Venezuela? You know, we know they're there. It's no great surprise, but given all the backdrop of a potential invasion or maybe it's a double bluff by Trump and he's just trying to get Maduro to to leave the country, which could well be what he's trying to do. Um, but what will the CIA be doing?

27:25 Yeah, that's that's a good observation, too. This could be a bluff, but let's assume for the for the sake of this question that it's not a bluff. The CIA would be doing everything from trying to to recruit or to influence um the owners of the Venezuelan media to place anti-Maduro uh articles or or opinion pieces or pro-American articles or opinion pieces to arming factions that may be uh available to them in Caracus. Listen, to to affect a coup, if if you want it to be quick and and it's a place like Venezuela where everything that's important is going to take place in the capital,

28:05 you have to control the radio and television stations, you have to surround the presidential palace, and you have to control the major intersections in the city. Once that happens, all the other dominoes begin to fall. So, it would be like overthrowing the Greek government in 1967. You don't have to attack and invade and occupy the entire country. You just need the center of the city along with the presidential palace and the parliament. I think that's the plan.

28:32 But as we saw, interestingly, as we saw in Ukraine, for example, clearly the Russians thought they could steam into Kev, overthrow Zalinski, and this would all be over quite quickly. And here we are years later, uh, and it didn't happen. Often the best laid plans look straightforward on paper. You make assumptions, but cold hard reality can kick in and take you to places you never imagined.

29:00 That's right. Look at Afghanistan. After years and years, Hamid Carzi was really little more than the mayor of Kabell. And even then, he didn't control all of Kabell. 20 years of American occupation, more than a trillion dollars spent, and uh and still we're we're facing we're facing enemies uh as soon as we leave the the city limits. It's not a way to run a war.

29:24 Maduro, many people think he's there illegitimately now that following the last election, he lost it and he's just refused to go. What is the reality about that? You know, I consider myself to be a person who approaches these issues from the, you know, slightly left of center,

29:41 but I've never believed that Maduro was legitimate. Uh I I've always believed that he was he was pumping up these numbers, stealing these elections. Not to say that the right is is the savior of the country. We don't frankly know what the Venezuelan right is going to look like once it begins to run things. But but I've always believed that that Maduro had serious legitimacy problems.

30:09 What's your hunch about what he may do? We've seen enough of him now for a few years to get a kind of measure of the man. Is he the kind, do you think, who when confronted with the possibility of an invasion and perhaps his death that he will just pull an Assad and get on a plane?

30:28 I think that's the likelihood. Now, the CIA just three or four weeks ago, according to Maduro's private pilot, the CIA tried to recruit the pilot with the idea that were Maduro to run, he would get on the plane, say, "Take me to Havana." Instead, the pilot takes him to Key West, and the FBI is there to arrest him and charge him with international narcotics trafficking. So, I think that Maduro probably has laid plans to leave if he needs to leave quickly. if he does need to leave quickly, I think he'll probably end up in Havana, possibly in Moscow.

31:03 But uh but yeah, I think that's probably that's probably the way it would play out. Now, I think that we would get a very I think we would get a better idea of what the plans are if we were to watch those military leaders closest to him. If we begin to see fissurers among the military leadership in Venezuela, then it it won't be long for Maduro after that.

31:27 And how easy would it be for the CIA to arrange his death? You know, I think that's a lot harder than most people uh would expect. It's not it's not the 60s or the early 70s anymore where the CIA is, you know, a completely renegade organization and it just goes around overthrowing governments and assassinating world leaders. Now, there actually is at least some congressional oversight. There's a a bureaucratic process by which they would have to go through. And it's quite difficult because it's not just the CIA coming up with an idea and then going to the president to approve the idea. There are layers and layers of attorneys in the in the Justice Department's Office of Legal Counsel, in the National Security uh Council's Office of Legal Affairs, in the CIA's general counsel's office. And so you have this army, this army of attorneys that has to approve it before it even gets to the president for

32:21 his signature. Um, it would be easier, it would be more legal to put so much pressure on Maduro that he opts to just get up and run

32:34 than it would be to try to to kill him. And and just in the last year or so, Pierce, there have been um what a dozen a dozen and a half uh mercenaries that have sort of washed up on shore and have said, "Hey, we're here to overthrow Maduro." Only to be then arrested and traded back to the United States for Venezuelan prisoners. It's kind of silly. Finally, these strikes on the boats in the Caribbean Sea, in your estimation, are these legal and justified or not?

33:08 No, I'm not seeing any any even efforts at legality here. Uh, by all accounts, the intelligence is just simply not there to show that these are uh drug boats or if they are drug boats that the drugs are bound for the United States. Uh there was a a a foot in a boot that washed up on shore in Trinidad and Tobago last week and it was identified as the foot and boot of a Trinidadian fisherman

33:38 and now the family wants answers. So, you know, I was in the CIA long enough that I came to learn when a CIA officer or a White House official or a Pentagon, you know, general says, "Take my word for it. I've seen the intelligence. Don't take his word for it.

33:59 I want to play just before we finish a clip from Pete Hegth. He's a secretary of st state obviously for the war department. Is this now renamed? Take a look.

34:09 You didn't see any survivors to be clear after that first strike. You I did not personally see survivors, but I stand because the thing was on fire. It was exploded and fire and smoke. You can't see anything. You got digital there. This is called the fog of war. This is what you and the press don't understand. You sit in your aironditioned offices or up on Capitol Hill and you nitpick and you plant fake stories in the Washington Post about kill everybody phrases on anonymous sources not based in anything, not based in any truth at all. And then you want to throw up really irresponsible terms about American heroes, about the judgment that they made. I wrote a whole I wrote a whole book on this topic because of what politicians and the press does to war fighters,

34:51 the the fog of war. I mean, look, there is a fog of war. Of course there is. But did you find that convincing?

34:58 Uh, no. There there is no war. This was just a unilateral American decision to start bombing these boats. So, fog of war. No. And international law is actually very clear here. If there are survivors who are not able to engage in combat, you can't kill them,

35:15 right? It's it's really quite simple. Yeah, I agree. Uh John Kyoku, thank you very much indeed for rejoining me on Uncensored.

35:22 Thank you. Good to see you again. Thank you. Piers Morgan Uncensored is proudly independent. The only boss around here is me. If you enjoy our show, we ask for only one simple thing. Hit subscribe on YouTube and follow Piers Morgan Uncensored on Spotify and Apple Podcast. And in return, we will continue our mission to inform, irritate, and entertain. And we'll do it all for free. Independent uncensored media has never been more critical and we couldn't do it without you.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "‘Expecting An Attack Any Day Now” Venezuela Boat Strikes With John Kiriakou & Ed Calderon"?

Piers Morgan (Host), Ed Calderon (Guest), John Kiriakou (Guest).

What is "‘Expecting An Attack Any Day Now” Venezuela Boat Strikes With John Kiriakou & Ed Calderon" about?

The discussion centers on the complexities of Venezuela's role in the global drug trade, particularly the fentanyl crisis affecting the United States. Key points include the assertion that much of the fentanyl in the U.S. comes from Mexican cartels using Chinese chemicals, rather than directly from Venezuela. There are implications of geopolitical maneuvers, suggesting that U.S. actions against…

What is mentioned in this Piers Morgan Uncensored episode?

15 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including regime change, Piers Morgan Uncensored, John Keryaku, cartels, Ed Cordran, China. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "‘Expecting An Attack Any Day Now” Venezuela Boat Strikes With John Kiriakou & Ed Calderon"?

The episode runs 36 min; the transcript is about 6,163 words in 69 timestamped sections.

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