Transcript

Democrats SLAM Trump Over Election Takeover Plot

From Pod Save America · Episode page · Watch on YouTube

· 1 h 37 min · 18,813 words · 213 timestamped sections

This is the full, timestamped transcript of "Democrats SLAM Trump Over Election Takeover Plot", an episode of Pod Save America published February 6, 2026 (1 h 37 min, about 18,813 words). It mentions 27 people, works and ideas, including Donald Trump, Pod Save America, ICE, Janet Mills, Minnesota.

What this episode is about

Democrats are expressing alarm over Donald Trump's potential attempts to manipulate the upcoming midterm elections, highlighting concerns about election security and the implications of political interference. The discussion also covers various political issues, including immigration policy, media dynamics, and the changing landscape of major media outlets like the Washington Post.

Key takeaways

  • When voting security becomes a circus, election integrity is the main act, and we're all stuck in the audience.
  • Trump's election theft claims might be a distraction tactic—while his cult double-checks the locks on the ballot box.
  • In the battle over ICE, the real tension boils down to fighting for truth amidst a sea of misinformation.
  • Mass layoffs could mean the Washington Post might drop its pen—will journalism survive, or is it just a headline?
  • Trusting election results is like trusting kids to keep their hands off a cake—good luck with that!

Who speaks in this episode?

What is discussed, and when

  1. – 10:00: Minnesota, Donald Trump, Pod Save America, Congress
  2. – 20:00: Fulton County, Janet Mills, Minnesota
  3. – 30:00: Minnesota, Fulton County, Quint, Simply Safe Home Security
  4. – 40:00: Department of Homeland Security, Minnesota, Donald Trump, Congress
  5. – 50:00: Better Help, Donald Trump, Renee Mlin Good, Mint Mobile
  6. – 1:00:00: Alex Jeffrey Prey, Jeff Bezos, Donald Trump, Renee Mlin Good
  7. – 1:10:00: Jeff Bezos, Washington, Washington Post, Donald Trump
  8. – 1:20:00: Janet Mills, Department of Homeland Security, Minnesota, Congress
  9. – 1:30:00: Donald Trump, Congress, Fulton County, Sean Bannon
  10. – 1:36:51: Donald Trump, Washington, Janet Mills, Civil War

Notable quotes from "Democrats SLAM Trump Over Election Takeover Plot"

  • On today's show, Trump already seems deadly serious about his intention to interfere with the midterm elections.
    about Donald Trump · at
  • Stories and cover the stories we didn't get a chance to here on Podsave America. We just added a new bi-weekly subscriber only episode of Pods Save America called Pods Save…
    about Pod Save America · at
  • We're going to have ICE surround the polls come November. We're not going to sit here and allow you to steal the country again. And you can th you can whine and cry and throw your toys out of.
    about ICE · at
  • Let's imagine that it's really close in Georgia. And he's already made this big deal of Fulton County and the FBI raided them and he comes back and says, Oh, 2020 was rigged…
    about Fulton County · at
  • Minnesota. Speaking borders are Tom H. Homeman announced this week that 700 Department of Homeland Security officers will be leaving Minneapolis. though that leaves about 2,000 in place.
    about Department of Homeland Security · at
  • On Thursday that he's definitely not going to fire Christine Gnome and Republicans in Congress don't seem very open to even modest reforms to reign in DHS and ICE. Democrats…
    about Congress · at
  • Is saved for transparency. number three independent transparent investigations into the killings of Renee Good and Alex Prey. And number four is warrants, right? You a judicial warrant.
    about Renee Mlin Good · at
  • Care about this a lot because I went to college in DC. I've read the Post forever. It is not just a great political newspaper that covers Washington, although they do a great…
    about Jeff Bezos · at

Who and what is mentioned in this episode?

People

  • Donald Trump — Person · Primary referenced political actor / antagonist · 12 mentions · first at
    Central figure in the episode’s discussion of alleged election interference plans, ICE actions, and attacks on the press; repeatedly quoted from an NBC interview and discussed as driving federal actions.
  • Janet Mills — Person · Main guest (interview subject) · 5 mentions · first at
    Interviewed about Maine ICE activity, DHS funding guardrails, election security, and her Senate campaign against Susan Collins (not in entity list) and primary context.
    Into the massive layoffs that may mean the end of the Washington Post, at least as we know it. Then Maine Governor and Senate candidate Janet Mills talks to Dan about her race…
  • Dan Pfeiffer — Person · Co-host; interviewer · 2 mentions
    Co-host driving the analysis of election interference scenarios and DHS/ICE strategy; conducts the featured interview with Janet Mills.
  • Sean Bannon — Person · Referenced political operative / media figure · 4 mentions · first at
    Cited as escalating rhetoric about deploying ICE around polling places; used as evidence of intimidation narratives moving from MAGA media into governance.
    Fulton County elections office and take all the ballots from 2020. Earlier this week, Steve Bannon decided to up the ante on the crazy by saying this.
  • John Favreau — Person · Host · 1 mention · first at
    Co-host of Pod Save America; leads discussion framing threats to elections, immigration enforcement, and media layoffs.
  • Jeff Bezos — Person · Referenced business figure / media owner (case study) · 8 mentions · first at
    Discussed as the owner whose decisions allegedly contributed to Washington Post layoffs and editorial shifts; contrasted with “independent” media funding models.
  • Renee Mlin Good — Person · Referenced victim in immigration enforcement controversy · 7 mentions · first at
    Cited as an American killed in an ICE-related incident; discussed as needing independent investigation and as subject of administration rhetoric (“domestic terrorist”).
  • Alex Jeffrey Prey — Person · Referenced victim in immigration enforcement controversy · 6 mentions · first at
    Cited as an American killed in an ICE-related incident; discussed in context of administration labeling him an “assassin” and calls for investigation/accountability.
    Is saved for transparency. number three independent transparent investigations into the killings of Renee Good and Alex Prey. And number four is warrants, right? You a judicial warrant.
  • Tulsi Gabbard — Person · Referenced government official / actor in alleged election-related action · 2 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as accompanying/being involved with federal activity at an elections office; discussed as part of a ‘foreign interference’ pretext narrative.
    We talked last week about Trump sending the FBI and Tulsi Gabbard to raid the Fulton County elections office and take all the ballots from 2020. Earlier this week, Steve Bannon decided to up the ante on the crazy by saying this.
  • Kaitlan Collins — Person · Referenced journalist / target of criticism · 2 mentions · first at
    Discussed as being berated by Trump and JD Vance; used to illustrate attacks on press and sexist/hostile dynamics in political media interactions.
    Judge that her job sucks and the system is broken. we'll also talk about Trump and JD Vance berating CNN's Caitlyn Collins for not smiling while she asks a question about…
  • Graham Platner — Person · Referenced political candidate (race opponent) · 2 mentions · first at
    Identified as Janet Mills’ opponent in her Senate race; also referenced regarding a policy position (abolishing ICE) contrasted with Mills’ stance.
    All right, let's talk long term. or medium-term, I guess. Your primary opponent, Graham Platner, has called for abolishing ICE. in a CNN interview, you didn't go that far. Can…

Companies & orgs

  • ICE — Company · Business focus · 2 mentions · first at
    Discussed extensively in the context of immigration enforcement and election interference.
  • Department of Homeland Security — Company · Business focus · 5 mentions · first at
    Discussed in the context of funding negotiations and ICE operations.
  • Washington Post — Company · Business focus · 5 mentions · first at
    Mentioned in the context of layoffs and the decline of legacy media.
    What Jeff Bezos, another person we love, did to the Washington Post this week. On Wednesday, the Post laid off about a third of its employees. the sports and book sections were…

Concepts & topics

  • Congress — Concept · Key argument · 7 mentions · first at
    Discussed in the context of legislative actions and election security.
  • SAVE Act — Concept · Key argument · 1 mention · first at
    Mentioned in the context of election security legislation.
    In that NBC News interview and previous interviews. Here's what the White House told us. Quote, President Trump cares deeply about the safety and security of our elections.…

Places & events

  • Minnesota — Place · Setting · 12 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as a location where ICE operations are taking place and affecting public perception.
    We do. A new episode just came out this week where we looked at in great detail how what's happening in Minnesota has affected Trump's approval ratings on immigration and…
  • Fulton County — Place · Setting · 7 mentions · first at
    Mentioned in the context of election interference and ballot seizures.
  • Maine — Place · Setting · 2 mentions · first at
    Discussed in the context of ICE operations and the Senate race.
    Into the massive layoffs that may mean the end of the Washington Post, at least as we know it. Then Maine Governor and Senate candidate Janet Mills talks to Dan about her race…
  • Washington — Place · Headquarters · 13 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as the location of political activities and DHS headquarters.
    Victims. and the we'll also get into the massive layoffs that may mean the end of the Washington Post, at least as we know it. Then Maine Governor and Senate candidate Janet…
  • Civil War — Event · Key argument · 3 mentions · first at
    Mentioned metaphorically in the context of political division.
    Pod Save Blue America coming to you in 2027 after the Civil War starts.

Media & podcasts

  • Pod Save America — Media · Host · 3 mentions · first at
    The podcast itself, hosting the discussion.
  • Pod Save Blue America — Media · Referenced media · 3 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as a future podcast in a hypothetical scenario.
    Pod Save Blue America coming to you in 2027 after the Civil War starts.

Sponsors

  • Better Help — Company · Sponsor · 3 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as a sponsor of the podcast.
    BetterHelp's quality therapists work according to a strict code of conduct and they're fully licensed in the US.
  • Simply Safe Home Security — Company · Sponsor · 2 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as a sponsor of the podcast.
    Every 26 seconds in the US, a family experiences a break-in. Scary, yes. But that's why Simply Safe has worked to make home security accessible to more American families.
  • Quint — Company · Sponsor · 2 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as a sponsor of the podcast.
    Everyday staples that feel easy to wear and easy to rely on even as the weather shifts. Quint has everyday essentials that I love with quality that last. They have organic…
  • Mint Mobile — Company · Sponsor · 2 mentions · first at
    Mentioned as a sponsor of the podcast.
    Who's still overpaying for wireless. Be a good friend. and tell your friends about Mint Mobile. Stop paying way too much for wireless just because that's how it's always been.…

Full transcript with timestamps

It's going to be too late once we're in election and be like, "Oh, how did the voting machines get stolen and the ballots are gone? Now what are we going to do?"

Pod Save Blue America coming to you in 2027 after the Civil War starts. You know, welcome to Pod Save America. I'm John Favro.

I'm Dan Feifer. On today's show, Trump already seems deadly serious about his intention to interfere with the midterm elections. So, uh, we're going to talk about why the rest of us should take the threat just as seriously. Uh, we've also got more on Minnesota and immigration where Trump has choice words about Alex Prey and Renee Good. Uh, and a Trump DOJ prosecutor goes viral for telling a judge that her job sucks and the system is broken. Uh, we'll also talk about Trump and JD Vance berating CNN's Caitlyn Collins for not smiling while she asks a question about underage rape victims. Um, and the uh, we'll also get into the massive layoffs um, that may mean the end of the Washington Post, at least as we know it. Then Maine Governor and Senate candidate Janet Mills talks to Dan about her race against Graham Platner. election security, getting ICE out of Maine, and whether Democrats have an age problem. Uh, lots of news to talk

about, one reason uh, you should consider becoming a subscriber. Uh, every week on our subscriberonly pods and our growing number of Substack newsletters, we go deeper on all the big stories um, and uh, and cover the stories we didn't get a chance to uh, here on Podsave America. We just added a new bi-weekly subscriber only episode of Pods Save America called Pods Save America Only Friends, which will go alongside our subscriberonly show called Polar Coaster with Dan Feifer,

who I hear you have a new episode out of that too. We do. A new episode just came out this week uh where we looked at in great detail how what's happening in Minnesota has affected Trump's approval ratings on immigration and public's perception of ICE and what that might mean for Democrats in this upcoming battle over ICE funding in Congress and in the in the midterms.

So excellent subscriberonly show much like Pod Save America only friends. We also have a new weekly Pods America newsletter called Open Tabs which is outstanding. Um, and you know, as a subscriber, you get ad free episodes of all your favorite crooked pods, and you get to feel good about supporting independent pro-democracy media that is not owned by Jeff Bezos. It would mean a lot to all of us here at Crooked if you considered subscribing at crooked.com/friend. Okay. Uh, let's start with this week's five alarm fire. Dan. Uh, in the clearest sign yet that Trump and his goons are worried that they're going to lose the midterms, they are already openly plotting to steal the election.

We talked last week about Trump sending the FBI and Tulsi Gabbard uh to raid the Fulton County elections office and take all the ballots from 2020. Earlier this week, Steve Bannon decided to uh up the ante on the crazy uh by saying this.

We're going to have ICE surround the polls come November. We're not going to sit here and allow you to steal the country again. And you can th you can whine and cry and throw your toys out of the pram all you want, but we will never again allow an election to be stolen.

Pretty crazy, right? Uh but you know, per usual, the insanity traveled from the uh the swamps of MAGA media right to the Oval Office. Uh and we heard this from Trump during his interview with Tom Yamis of NBC News.

You've recently suggested nationalizing elections. What do you mean by that? Uh when and I didn't say national. I said there are some areas in our country that are extremely corrupt. They have very corrupt elections. Take a look at Detroit. Take a look at Philadelphia. Take a look at Atlanta. There are some areas that are unbelievably corrupt. I could give you plenty of more, too. If they don't want voter ID, that means they want to cheat. We can't allow cheating in elections. Now, if we need to put in federal controls as opposed to state controls, if they can't do it honestly and it can't be done properly and timely, then something else has to happen.

Will you trust the results of the midterms if Republicans lose control of Congress?

I will, but if the elections are honest, look, I I want the last one that wants to complain.

Speaking of of counties, what what is happening? I'm not doing anything, but the FBI went in.

Why is Tulsi Gabbard there? I don't know. But you know, uh, a lot of the cheating comes from, uh, it's it's international cheating. We

we know that foreign governments try to influence a lot of things in this country.

Well, she's she's foreign government. There should be nothing wrong with the fact that they went in, got ballots from a while ago, and they're going to look at him and now they're going to find out the true winner of that state.

Nothing wrong with that. Um, at least at least we know that the Republican with the power to decide contested election results that could determine control of the House would never go along with Trump's scheme. Right.

We had three House Republican candidates who were ahead on election day in the last election cycle. And every time a new trunch of ballots came in, they just magically whittleled away until their leads were lost. It just it looks on its face to be fraudulent. Can I prove that? No. Now, the red states have done a lot of good work in that in that front, but it's the blue states that I'm frankly concerned about.

Yeah, I'm sure you are. Um, so Dan, because uh we are a real news organization, uh Crooked Media's own Matt Berg asked the White House specifically uh what Trump meant when he called for nationalizing our elections uh in that NBC News interview and previous interviews. Here's what the White House told us. Quote, "President Trump cares deeply about the safety and security of our elections. That's why he's urged Congress to pass the SAVE Act and other legislative proposals that would establish a uniform standard of photo ID for voting, prohibit no excuse mail and voting, and end the practice of ballot harvesting. You feel better now?

I don't, Chen. I don't feel better. That is an absurd answer that bears no connection to what Trump actually said. like do we when Trump was very explicit, he talks in there about the federal the states being agents of the federal governments, us the federal government taking over in certain places. He certainly was not referring to the passage of a national voter ID law that has no chance of passing. Like he's being very explicit. And I have a question for you because I think generally when there is sort of alarmist discussion from Trump or maybe it like bubbles up through liberal media or online, you're you're the of us. you're the least likely one to be alarmed typically like you dig in deep to the details you try you come back and say actually it's not as bad as you think it is yet you seem quite concerned about this or more concerned than I am and I will I will go to what the parts that do concern me but

where's your head on this yeah so having read all this and watched all this uh last night I I have now become quite concerned um and and it's it's specific concerns right um this idea that they're going put in place federal controls like that doesn't that doesn't mean anything. The federal government cannot put in place federal controls. It is against the law. The federal government has no role in uh elections. That's the states run the elections. We know that that is in the constitution. It is the law. Um so him's talking about putting in federal controls whatever else. But um the what Bannon was saying, the ICE agents by the polls um which Caroline Levit was asked about it today at the White House briefing and she said, "No, no, I don't think so." She's like, "Well, I can't I can't promise you there's not going to be any agents anywhere near any polls.

That's for sure." So, I worry about that. I worry about the intimidation, especially because of everything we've seen in Minnesota and elsewhere over the last year. Um, I think what I'm most worried about is uh Trump and all of his goons reviving the um let's seize the election machines, let's seize the ballots because now that they've gotten a taste for it in Fulton County. Uh, and if you remember in 2020, um, they had an an executive order drafted that supposedly would have given Trump the authority to send in the military, the National Guard, federal agents, whoever, and seize the voting machines.

And um that is the one that really worries me because I think a lot of the stuff can you can litigate in court and I think even though the Supreme Court is the Supreme Court on issues where sort of the the sanctity of our elections and I'm not talking about like you know voting rights act voter suppression they're horrible on all that. They're horrible on all that. But when I'm talking about like like throwing out ballots, try you know the craziest election stuff that Trump has tried to do, the Supreme Court has been good on it. Okay. Um but when you talk about the federal government going in and just seizing an election, like it doesn't matter what the court rules at that point, they have the ballots.

That's it. That's like the end. I mean, it's an interesting So, I am I'm concerned about this. I've been concerned for a long time about um the National Guard originally and now ICE being at polling places. And even just Bannon and the right-wing media saying ICE is going to be at polling places will dissuade people who are American citizens who can vote but are of color and worried about getting picked up and detained by ICE from going out to the polls. And that's going to be particularly prevalent in states that don't have uh readily available early voting or male mail and voting. And by the way, and by the way, another way that this could work, um, so Trump and the White House decide not to be so obvious as to say, "We're going to deploy a bunch of ICE agents to the polls on election day."

Yeah. They just put them in the cities. Yeah. They say, "Okay, the the next operation, next on our list after Minneapolis is all the cities where there are close races, in all the states where there are close races in the Senate and the House." And those operations are happening, I don't know, maybe three weeks before election day, but they are. And so just enough time uh so that people like they are in Minnesota in Minneapolis right now so people who of who were worried that they're going to get picked up by ICE are hiding in their homes and don't want to go for even groceries let alone to go vote. The test of this will be Texas, right, where Democrat there's been a huge swing in the Latino vote based on the special election this past weekend and some polling we've seen and ISIS stayed out of Texas in this sort of way because Trump really just deploys them in blue states to to try to spark a

reaction of some kind. But if all of a sudden they start showing up in Houston or Dallas or San Antonio uh at a time in which control of the Senate may come down to a race between Jasmine Crockett or James Helerico and a Republican, that would be the real test there. I mean, there's some other things I'm worried about here. Um, one, just using all of this to, you know, suggest you need federal monitors at elections that you're going to put people there to make sure that, you know, nothing is happening, right? Just is it just it's pure, this is this is prevoting rights era voter intimidation, right, is what you see here. And then the big one, and I think the absolute biggest one is creating this climate of, you know, fraud and corruption that allows Mike Johnson the pretext to not seat Democrats in a in closely contested races even though they have

That's the other big one. Yeah. Even though they've been certified by the recount, the hand recount, the the process in those states to claim that there was enough there not to seat them to hold on to the majority. If this comes down like I don't think he can't pull that off if we gain 30 seats and we have but if this comes down to essentially the majority the Republicans had after 2022 where you're down to two seats could you see that happening that seems very very possible and and remember Mike Johnson is someone who was intimately involved in the stop the steel effort and pushing the the big lie in 2020. So this is not this is not Mitch McConnell or maybe even a Paul Ryan who's just like a long for the ride. This is a true believer in those conspiracy theories.

Yeah. And so just to give everyone an example of how this might work. So um Georgia, say control of the Senate, it's a really close race in Georgia. That's it that probably won't be the state that it comes down to because John's doing quite well right now. But anyway, let's let's imagine that it's really close in Georgia. And he's already made this big deal of Fulton County and the FBI raided them and he comes back and says, "Oh, 2020 was rigged and we're going to have extra DOJ monitors around Fulton County." Which, you know, they can do.

Um and uh it's really close and now Trump says, "Oh, there's fraud and we're not going to certify it there." Now the Fulton County Board of Elections is run by is is majority Republicans, specifically like election denying Republicans and they won't certify. Now, the court could make them certify, but maybe before that happens and it's contested, you know, Trump sends in federal agents to grab the voting machines and now control of the the Senate uh hinges on Georgia. The same thing could happen in the House. I guess it's more it's it's probably more likely that that it's a it's a Mike Johnson House thing, right? Because what happens

it's it's it's harder to seat in the House or Yeah. But what happens is in a contested election where there is no certification of the final result yet and January 3rd rolls around, you're right that if the if it's obvious that Democrats are going to control the House at that point, the House automatically just switches over to to the Democrats and then they figure out who they figure out the contested House race under a Democratic majority. But if that contested House race or several contested House race is what the control of the House hinges on, then Mike Johnson and the rep the current Republican House, they're still there on January 3rd until they figure it out.

And the House, according to the Constitution, gets to be ultimate uh arbiter of seating their own members and the results of an election. So that's that's when you'd really worry. I if I remember correctly, there are some limits in some previous court cases on this, but there's real room for monkey business that could delay a Democratic majority or prevent one if it's close enough.

Yes. Because they went down this road with Adam Clayton Powell, I think, and a couple other times over the course of American history. And but sometimes control of the house has hinged on uh some of these close contested uncertified elections and the vote has gone to the house and and and someone who has won or at least appear to have won via the vote count um isn't the one who gets seated. It's happened before.

Um this is one of those things where just the the well people are listening to this and they're panicking and say what do we do? What do we do? What do we do? I mean not to steal something from Trump here, but it has to be a too big to rig. You just have to win enough that you have to take the power out of their hands because there's really not a lot we can do right now other than raising awareness of this possibility to prevent Republicans from doing very very bad things. We learned that in 2020 when the election was very close and so therefore like just we got to go out and win. We got to go out and win enough seats that that it's too big to rig.

Here's another that's correct for all of us. I believe um I think there's a role for Democratic governors, state and local officials. And I don't know when it is, but at some point, I'm just throwing it out there. But right now, you hear them say like what Trump wants to do would be unconstitutional or, you know, Newsome's out there being like, I I don't think I'm worried that we're not going to have a free and fair election. Right? So, there's a lot of either uh Democrats expressing concern about what Trump might do, Democratic officials, or Democrats saying like this is authoritarianism. This would be bad. I would like Democratic governors to go out there and say like it is illegal and unconstitutional for the federal government to deploy any kind of federal agents or troops around polling place.

It is illegal and unconstitutional for the federal government to seize voting machines or to have the military seize voting machines. And I think that every one of them should go out there, every Democrat should go out there and say if they see federal agents anywhere near a polling place intimidating voters, they will be immediately ordered to leave. If they see them try to seize voting machines, they will be immediately ordered to leave. And if they do not leave, they will be arrested and they will have I mean, we we've heard about this in Minnesota, right?

Like in Jacob Fry, the mayor there was like, "Oh, could we technically have local police arrest ICE agents?" Yes, legally maybe. But obviously that gets really uh that gets really dicey to actually have that conflict. But if you get to the point where federal agents are intimidating people at polls or trying to seize voting machines, which is uncon, which we know is flatly unconstitutional, I think that you you uh you let Trump know early. You know, you don't do the like look what all the Europeans finally did around Greenland, right? instead of just like letting Trump keep doing this, they were like, "No, it's not for sale and you're when we're going to put troops in Greenland to make sure you don't do it."

And he backed down. Like, and maybe not maybe now is not the time. And what what month is it? February. But like, I think that sometime before the election, they have to there needs to be a shot across the bow there that like you send federal agents in, they are no, they are not going to be welcome. I I asked Janet Mills about what they were doing in in Maine to secure elections and get people can listen stay on and listen to the answer. But what is clear is that Democratic governors are beginning to think about this and pro and I didn't ask this but I imagine there are conversations happening amongst Democratic governors about what they can do together because it's there are some simple the things like make clear the points you're making just make it clear that the I mean this is an insane thing to say and the United States of America but that state troopers will be guarding the the counting centers or the the voting

machines like there's just has a message has be said earlier that this is not going to be tolerated and we're not going along with this. I think that's right

and it is as much I think because what Democrats have done in the past, what we love to do is it's like we got our we got all our lawyers in line and it's a big legal strategy and that's very important, but it's just as much of a communications strategy at that point as it is a legal strategy. We got I I feel good about our legal strategy. We got we got some great great lawyers in the Democratic party, but on election night, if if the count is close, you know that Trump's going to be out there and every Republican is going to be out there saying like, "Oh, these mailin ballots, they're late. The all the they did in 2020, all the they do all the time now." And Democrats just got to be out there right away being like, "Absolutely not. Do not come near us. Do not come near our, you know, we have the state troopers there. We we don't want to see you here. You're not welcome."

like they just got to show a little a little fight on this and not be not be like crying authoritarianism. Actually tell them what you're going to do and why they're not allowed to actually violate the Constitution. Uh especially when it comes to our elections. Um so that's that's just a thought that I've been having. Um now that it's been a week or so since the uh the Fulton County raid, do you have a better understanding of what what specifically Trump is trying to do there aside from just relitigating 2020? And obviously, you know, I think we can guess that he wants to use the madeup fraud that he's going to come out with from 2020 as a pretext to screw with 2026. But like, how? Like, what a Yeah, I think I don't think there's a master plan here. I think this is the product of having a diluted conspiracy theorist in the Oval Office with a capacity to send federal agents down the rabbit holes he'd like

to explore. And but so that's why this happened. like he he's obsessed with this. He can't get over it. Even though he's back in the White House, he's wanted to do this for a long time. Now he's got no one who's going to stop him. He has a director of national intelligence who was doing yoga on the beach during at the last major military operation and is trying to win back favors. So, she is spearheading this process. It's just worth noting that the director of national intelligence is spearheading an effort to investigate election fraud, fake effort to investigate fake election fraud from five years ago, six years ago. That's totally ridiculous. But I do think this this is a pretext and a pretext like along the ways we talked about. So there's what the federal government can do and then what can you do if you create this you know let's say they find they make something up they doctor something they find one ballot

where the signature didn't match even though they were all matched by hand because of how this went and they use this to suggest fraud. So then that can lead to a couple things that can lead to not just pretext for federal government action. can lead to getting Republican election officials to change how votes are received or counted or certified to change procedures or laws to limit mail-in voting. Um early voting like making the signature match that much harder, throwing more ballots out, purging the roles again, ways to do that. Now they are limited in what they can do because a lot of the especially a lot of places where the house races will be decided are in states run by Democrats. California, New York, a lot of states in the Midwest and P including Pennsylvania and then Pennsylvania. But you know the Senate the path to the Senate runs through red states.

Yeah. Georgia the states with Republican governors uh that are going to matter in 2026 both in the Senate and in the House to an extent as well. Iowa, Ohio, Texas, Georgia, Florida, Alaska. Yep.

And those are the ones and you know like Maine, New Hampshire, North Carolina, Michigan, Minnesota, all Democratic governors. There's some house seats in Arizona, Democratic governor, Pennsylvania, Democratic governor. But yeah, those are the those that's the concern there

and that and that's where they they can really with things. And do do they do they need this fake 2020 ballot thing to do that? Absolutely not. But it would make Trump happy if they found it.

And when he talk the Fulton County thing, it's not necessarily if they find something and make a big deal of it, it's the federal government that can do something. But if the Fulton County Elections Board is now majority MAGA, then they can just get them to um you know to put in place restrictions, controls, whatever it may be. Um which

and so people un Yeah. And so so people understand Fton County is where Atlanta is. This is where the overwhelming majority of Democratic votes are. And so if you were able to reduce turnout in Atlanta through a series of things that you can do, they are can be explicit like changing voting procedures. It can be but also as implicit and devious as reducing the number of machines in certain precincts so that um fewer people the lines are too long for people to vote etc. then that would really hurt John John Oaf's chances to win if he can't count on a huge chunk the same chunk of votes that he's gotten War's gotten and Joe Biden got in 2020 out of Fulton County.

I've been wondering about the Tulsi angle as well. Why is the director and he's talking about foreign governments in that interview? Foreign governments, there's some cheating and interference. I hadn't realized because when I was going down the rabbit hole on the executive order to seize the voting machines from 2020, I realized that that one of the orders that he was going to use as justification or thought about using as justification to seize the machines is about foreign election interference. And it was basically saying if they if there's you know evidence of foreign interference then a it authorizes him to you know uh levy economic sanctions on the country but also to somehow seize the voting machines to to look at them for national security reasons because they have been attacked somehow by uh foreign foreign governments. So I do that's that's the that's the Tulsa angle.

Yeah. Once again, not a master plan here in the sense that like most of right-wing big lie, stop the steel world is so up in the head that they think Venezuela was involved in this. They thought Chavez was doing this from the grave at one point. U there's a lot of speculation online that Maduro is going to cut a ple plea agreement by copying to some sort of Venezuelan experience. We know that uh even though this is not foreign interference, but we know that that Tulsi Gabber was investigating some conspiracy in Puerto Rico uh connected to Venezuela. like this is this like we are so far through the looking glass of insanity with the things that is guiding this conversation that it like that it all comes back to this international stuff and like they would love after you know Russia Russia Russia to have some make this argument that no it was actually Venezuela or Cuba or some other country

that interfered with our elections that cost Trump you know the office. One other um on on this topic before we go, one other scoop that uh Crooked Media got or Matt Berg again just crushing it. Um remember you know uh Nevada Secretary Secretary of State um Cisco Aguar uh from Nevada. So he talked to Matt and told him that uh Aguar and basically all the secretaries of state uh got an email from the FBI uh organizing a call uh in a couple weeks with all the various agencies in the federal government to talk about election security. And uh Agriar told Matt, I was just like this is the strangest thing in the world that the FBI is reaching out to us and trying to coordinate election security. It has never happened in the past. the casualness with which they did is just beyond crazy. And uh and Matt got a hold of the email and it is just like a it's hey every hey everyone hey every secretary of state this is the FBI

reaching out. We're going to do a call soon. What like if like with in this Trump administration especially in this poorly run FBI like that can be one of two things. It could be some doofus organizing a grand conspiracy election. Or it could be the one soon to be fired well-meaning bureaucrat in the department who wants to actually secure our elections. You just never know.

Or both. They might be the person gets fired and they're like, "Wait, I have an idea now."

Yeah. Exactly. So, you know, something to keep an eye on. But it I think too big for everyone listening. Too big to rig. Unless you're Democratic official, then you know, make sure that you uh you

start just start talking tough if you're Democratic. Yeah. You have a you have some state troopers. You got some National Guard. use it. Um, all right. Let's talk about the Just think about that for a second.

Oh, that's you know, it's going to be too late once we're an election to be like, "Oh, how did the voting machines get stolen and the ballots are gone? Now what are we going to do?"

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Free shipping and 365day returns. quint.comcrooked. All right. Uh let's talk about the latest with Trump's invasion of Minnesota. Speaking uh borders are Tom H. Homeman announced this week that 700 Department of Homeland Security officers will be leaving Minneapolis. Uh though that that leaves about 2,000 in place. Uh and the way the White House is thinking about the uh mass deportation campaign doesn't seem to have changed very much at all. Um, Trump and Tom Yamos of NBC talked about this a lot uh in the interview. Uh, here's a sampling.

I learned that uh maybe we can use a little bit of a softer touch, but you still have to be tough. I'm not happy with the two incidents. It's not, you know, it's both of them, not one or the other. Uh, he was not an angel and she was not an angel. You know, you look at some tapes from back, but still I'm not happy with what happened there. Nobody could be happy. And ICE wasn't happy either.

Two people. It's bad. I hate it. I hate even talking about it. Two people out of tens of thousands. Okay.

Mhm. And you get bad publicity. Nobody talks about all of the murderers that were taken out of our country. They don't talk about it too.

They don't talk about we have the smallest trucks. As an example, we've been very tough on the waters and soon, you know, pretty much overall. But if you look at If you look at the waters where we knock out boats,

think of think of all the people think of all the Americans ICE agents haven't killed. Why aren't we getting publicity for that? You kill two Americans and suddenly everyone's up your ass just complaining about this and that. But think of how many boats we've blown up. Isn't that cool? Think of how many potentially innocent people we executed on the high seas. I went through that same journey with Tom Yamas in real time, which was the waters.

The waters. Oh, the waters. Waters. Well, you don't know if he's going to talk about how he saved Los Angeles by turning off water in Northern California so it could

or the shower heads or the shower heads. Yeah. You just you wouldn't flush. You just don't know. This is a man focused on water.

Been very tough on the waters. But you know what he's trying to do there, of course, is the the message. And you see this from Steven Miller and JD Vance and all the rest of them on Twitter. All they do is they're like, "Well, you know, we don't hear the Democrats um showing any sympathy or or remembering the people that undocumented immigrants have murdered." What what the does that how what does that have to do with anything? Yes, people who murder other people should be arrested and if eligible for deportation, deported, and if not, thrown in jail after a trial.

That's America. Welcome. like it's totally unconnected to ICE agents shooting two American citizens in the street and then the administration lying about the incidents for the world to see.

You think that uh you think Trump's Trump's answer there that's the right messaging for a uh a national TV audience that will be watching the full interview during the Super Bowl?

Yeah. Are they going to air the full interview? Well, everyone kept saying it's the Super Bowl. Is it Is it like during the Super Bowl? Is it before?

It's It is. I mean, John, we only did this for eight years. It is. It airs in the pregame. Long before the Super Bowl. Usually before people even Super Bowl parties start.

This is the one that you advised Joe Biden not to do. I was just thinking that it had been two years since that debate. Two years since that. And I guess no one did one last year because well, I guess Trump did Trump do one last year? I don't remember.

No idea. Who knows? Time. But this year, if you tune in before the Super Bowl begins,

if you're just milling about, you're filling out your Super Bowl squares, you are uh, you know, waiting in line to get access to the six-foot sub or the wings, and did you just hear Trump say that two people who were murdered who the vast majority of Americans think were unjustly killed were no angels?

No angels. In fairness, they were no angels. I hate I hate that they died, but in fairness to who? In fairness to who? In fairness to who?

Yeah, right. Yeah. just oh my god. Um Trump also said on Thursday that he's definitely not going to fire Christine Gnome and Republicans in Congress don't seem very open to even modest reforms to reign in uh DHS and ICE. Uh Democrats sent Republicans a list of 10 demands this week that include banning masking, racial profiling, militarystyle weapons, and raids near schools and daycare centers. They also want to require body cams and ensure better conditions and congressional oversight at detention facilities. Um they also want to ensure um you know that you uh that you go find a warrant before you arrest someone.

Wild idea or before you you know break into someone's home. Usually they think that's a it's a crazy extremist idea from the Democrats. Um, but then again, lead negotiator uh for the Senate Republicans, Katie Britt, called the letter, quote, "Political posturing and quote, a ridiculous Christmas list of demands for the press." Um, a reminder that there's a two-week clock on these negotiations before the Department of Homeland Security either shuts down or gets funded at current levels. Uh, what's the best play for Democrats here?

Democrats have to recognize that the American people are on their side here. And it's not just Democrats. It's not just independents. You have a quarter of Republicans who believe in a recent data for progress poll that ICE should not be funded without real guard rails on what on what ICE is doing. And so I do think they have to narrow that list. And so one recognize that you have you have the political high ground here. You have limited legislative leverage. Like we should be very clear, but you do have the political high ground. And I think you should narrow that list to three, maybe four very popular, easy to understand, very substantial guardrails.

I would on that list I would include no masks, body cams. I know Chrissy Gnome said she was going to put in body cams, but let's have a law about it. And that law should contain, as Janet Mill said to me um in our interview, uh like requirements to make sure that footage is saved for transparency. Uh, number three uh independent transparent investigations into the killings of Renee Good and Alex Prey. And number four is warrants, right? You a judicial warrant.

Warrants is at the very top of the list for me. Really, this is asking Yeah. And then I guess the fifth thing, if I was going to do a fifth thing, is to ensure that ICE and CBP have to operate with the same use of force and other standards as the rest of federal law enforcement, including the FBI.

Yeah. Yeah, like that those are very simple, very popular things that would make a difference. They're not going to solve all of the problems with ICE. Far from it. It's not going to abolish ICE or anything like that, but if you could get those or some of those, it would make a difference. And that is a position of strength to argue from.

Yeah. I think if you're if you're going for something that every American understands, um, banning warrantless arrests, I think that'll I think that'll get people going when because because you know, John Thun today, he he basically agreed with Katie Brit that like, oh, these demands aren't serious. And he's like, well, if you know, the Department of Homeland Security shuts down, then um that means uh TSA uh will shut down and we could have some of those travel problems. And it's like, you know, if you want to tell people your plane is delayed, um your flight is canled because uh Donald Trump um refuses to require ICE agents to get a warrant before they arrest you or break into your home. I think you could probably win that battle.

I will be bringing this up to you uh in about a week when we're flying home from Australia to see how you feel if our fight is canceled.

You know, there's extra time in Australia. Yes. I mean, I I do think like at some point that's going to happen, right? They're not going to agree to this They're just not. And so we're going to head to a shutdown and then it's going to be who is who feels more pressure about the fact that there are flight delays, right? Is that where we're heading?

Yeah. I I mean the Republicans did like the fact that they agreed to this in the first place suggests that they feel real political vulnerability here now. The attention is starting to focus elsewhere. There's less attention on Minnesota. There's, you know, they sort of pulled the we're deescalating uh and like attention turned, the narrative switched a little bit, but they're still in a really bad place here on immigration and ICE. It's a huge vulnerability for them. Like both sides are talking tough right now. The question is, like nothing's getting resolved in the next however many days we have left here. The question is, can you do another short-term extension to keep negotiating another couple weeks? Like I think that would be a very reasonable thing for Democrats to do. These are big changes and just to think that you're going to get them done in like 10 days um is hard to imagine, but you know, maybe maybe

you get another short-term extension. I don't know that the I think they're I'm not sure the Republicans want this fight as much as they'd like you they like Democrats to think they want this fight.

I think that's true. I I I wonder if Democrats have the stomach and are ready strategically um when the shutdown happens, if and when the shutdown happens, um to go out there and stick with the fight because I just you got to like, you know, we're we're right back to ACA subsidies, which by the way, negotiations over the uh ACA extensions are over. So, there will be no ACA extension at all. Even though the Republicans felt like maybe they, you know, felt a little pressure, but once again, news moved on and so they feel like they can get away with it.

I mean, news moved on. The American people did not move on. Correct. So, they're going to they will pay they will pay the a stiff price for this one in the fall on I think the question is not do Democrat like we can we can say do Democrats have the right communications plan. Are they going to be able to do all the right things? I think they did a pretty good job during the last shutdown. The question is, are those Democrats who reopen the government, what's their stomach, right? Like that is the question because I think the vast majority of Democrats will go in the House and definitely in the House and certainly in the Senate will go to the mattresses on this. It's that last group there that you have to worry about. And I just don't know where they where they will come down on this since they were so willing to fold, you know, back in December or November. I guess that was

just to give everyone an idea of what a nightmare DHS is right now. There's a story that caught our eye this week about um DHS lawyer Julie Lee um who had been detailed to the US attorney's office in Minnesota from the Department of Homeland Security. Uh on Tuesday, a judge pressed her on why ICE violates so many court orders. And according to courtroom transcripts, Lee responded, "The system sucks. This job sucks. and I'm trying with every breath that I have so that I can get you what you need. Sometimes I wish you would just hold me in contempt, your honor, so that I can have a full 24 hours of sleep. She also said, quote, "I am not white, as you can see, and my family's at risk as any other people that might get picked up."

Um, her family came from Vietnam. Uh Lee told the judge she'd already tried to quit uh but that they can't find a replacement for her and that she'd even taken to emailing ICE officials in 24point font to try to get their attention mostly unsuccessfully. Uh Lee has now reportedly been taken off the Minnesota assignment and is back at DHS headquarters in Washington. Wild story. It also comes from there was a political story about how overwhelmed prosecutors are everywhere, but especially in Minnesota um trying to deal with the legal fallout from what ICE is doing.

Particularly um basically everyone that uh DHS picks up rounds up whether you're legal resident, whether you're an asylum seeker who is legally supposed to be here, whether you are an undocumented immigrant, they all they file habius petitions. You have the right to file a habius petition. meaning like why have you put me in jail? And you've got, you know, the government has to like have a reason. And every one of these habius petitions then goes to trial or at least has some kind of a hearing, not a trial, but hearing. And um and there's just too many. There's too many for the court.

There's too many for the prosecutors that they have. There's just too many. And so all these prosecutors, parillegals, everyone working around the clock. No one. and and ICE is so irresponsible that they are just they're not responding, they're not cooperating, they're not doing anything. They're just a rogue agency. That's what they are.

Yeah, it seems sub-optimal. Um it it like the system is not set up for this level of mass deportation. Even if ICE was doing everything right, they were crossing the eyes, dotting the tees, then just processing this number of people, having these number of hearings would stress the system. But the fact that you have an incompetent rogue agency that is just sweeping up people because of their accent, because of the color of their skin, because they looked at an officer the wrong way means you get a lot of people who are being detained, who shouldn't be detained. And they're under the court put for good reason puts tremendous pressure on the government to respond to these habius petitions because there's a person in detention center who maybe shouldn't be there. and like that this is what the courts are for and it can't operate with this level of incompetence and disregard for the the law and human decency that

you're seeing from ICE. And by the way, it's probably incompetence as you get um sort of down uh down the food chain there to to like random ICE agents at at DHS. But it is also a pretty intentional strategy on behalf of Steven Miller and the people who are running the show because what they're doing is they're rounding people up. They're putting them in these detention centers which are just under horrific conditions. Many of the detention centers they put you in if you're rounded up are not in your home state or your city, but in Texas or somewhere far far away. And what they're telling people once they get them there is yeah, you can file your habius petition and wait for your hearing or you can stay in this uh uh you can stay in this and you can wait for your hearing in this horrific detention center under these awful conditions or you can sign this piece of paper right now and we'll just deport you and you

can wave your right to a hearing. And so for a lot of these folks, they don't know if they're going to be successful at their hearing and maybe they need medical care. Maybe they're want to be back with their families. Maybe they have young children and so they feel this pressure to sign the document to then be deported as opposed to waiting for the habius hearing. And this is like Miller's strategy to try to get as many people deported as possible.

Yeah. I mean, this has always been true of Trump and the people around him, which is it is a stunning combination of incompetence and malevolence, right?

Did you uh did you check out that Wall Street Journal story about Steven Miller? Did a big profile of Steven Miller?

I did. I did. I was going to send it to you, but I was like, there's just no way John hasn't read this yet.

I mean, there's a couple points that I First of all, it's interesting that um Donald Trump is maybe starting to realize that uh Steven Miller is causing him some political problems. Um it says uh in one paragraph, Trump told advisers he isn't comfortable with how far Miller has gone on some fronts. Uh there were business he's mad that business officials were calling to complain about uh getting their workers rounded up. Um, and then he at one point he sees Miller on TV talking about Venezuela and Trump um, talked to aids nearby and he said, "Why is he on TV? He doesn't do foreign policy. Why is he talking? He doesn't he doesn't talk about foreign policy." So Trump's there's a little, you know, maybe Steven Miller's going too far, but like some of the stories about that guy and that and these are all from White House officials uh who were sourced in the story that um he basically decided

to uh label Renee Good domestic terrorist and uh Alex Prey, an assassin without any approval or review from anyone else in the administration. After Alex Prey was murdered, Stephen Miller was just texting directly with Border Patrol agents on the ground and then it went from the text from the border patrol agents to Miller to Twitter calling him an assassin. That's it. That was the whole process.

Not a good process apparently cuz he was the one who suggested the insurrection act apparently at the in in Minneapolis. He was the one. So after apparently after Renee Good was killed, there was this debate in the White House like should we just withdraw from Minnesota or at least draw down the agents there because like things are getting out of control. And Miller was like no, we got to send in more. We got to double down. He's he's the cancer at the heart of the administration in the country. He really is like he's a deeply dangerous individual who is obviously a huge narcissist but also a megalomaniac with very very I don't even know if disturbing is a strong enough word. A set of odious views about the world that are like as like white nationalist as it could possibly be. Like he has a very explicit project about making this country whiter.

Yep. Like that is what he wants to do. And look, none of that is going to convince Donald Trump ever to get rid of him. But Republicans do poorly in the midterms. Steven Miller's fault. everyone. It is it Donald Trump can look around and realize that he lost Congress or lost one or both houses of Congress. If that happens, it is Stephen Miller. Stephen Miller is probably more responsible for that than anyone else around him, I would say.

And you know, and you know who will get fired? Christine. Yeah, maybe. Maybe. I there is I mean this is like such nerdy old people political talk but there is a lot of um like these are in these are imperfect historical analogies so I don't want to stipulate that but immigration is becoming to Trump in 2026 immigration ICE in particular is becoming to Trump in 2026 what Iraq was to George W Bush in 2006 and the people were telling

exactly like that is exactly right which is you they they refused to fire the people responsible or at least make a firing to acknowledge that even if it's just purely symbolic that something is going to change and they don't do it until afterwards because they're so afraid of admitting failure or weakness that they make their political problems much worse. Positive America is brought to you by Mint Mobile. Every group has someone who insists on doing things the hard way. That one friend still paying for a subscription they forgot they had.

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That's betterhelphp.comsa. Um, one last thing on immigration here. JD Vance did an interview uh with the Daily Mail. Not sure why. Um, where he got this question.

Have you apologized? Did you plan to apologize to the family of Alex Freddy? For what?

For you know, labeling him an assassin with ill intent. Well, again, I just described to you what I said about Alex Prey, which is that he's a guy who showed up with ill intent to ICE protest.

No, but if it is determined if it's determined that his civil rights were violated by this FBI investigation, will you apologize to that?

So, if if this hypothetical leads to that hypothetical leads to another hypotheve investigation determine, we're going to let the actual law come to the surface and figure out what happened

for what? For what? What I said about Alex Prey is that he showed up with little intent. First of all, no, he didn't. Second of all, you can't know what his intent was. Third of all, you called him an assassin. Or you late or or Steven Miller called him an assassin. You retweeted Steven Miller. Still up on your Twitter feed.

You called Renee Good a domestic terrorist. You called Renee Good a domestic terrorist.

Yeah. So maybe you apologize for that. I don't know. Thought you were a Catholic. No. No. Don't don't feel as a uh as a Christian that perhaps um sometimes you make mistakes uh that you're fallible. He's so smug. I cannot that it's the smuggness that just takes it to a whole new level for me with him. He is the most obnoxious high school debate nerd you could ever possibly meet. Oh, so this hypothetical to that hypothetical and to he the way he just uses nonsense logic to run circles around these reporters or at least get out of answering questions is incredibly frustrating. But he is missing something fundamentally human.

Donald Trump is also missing it. Um but he just he can't like there is no shame. There is no guilt. Like you said he's Catholic. He certainly didn't get the the guilt part that comes with that. He there was no there's no inherent decency. I couldn't like I just can't imagine saying something like that about someone and feeling no obligation to the family, to yourself, to your family to correct that publicly. and said just to stand by it because you've been convinced that to admit failure or to admit being wrong is weakness and and treason in MAGA world and that is just a really that is stupid politically but it's a really toxic way to go through life.

Yeah. He really combines like the smuggness of the most annoying coastal elite, you know, with the soul of Steven Miller with the charisma of a shoe. That is that that is JD Vance.

A shoe a shoe is in candidate president. A shoe has neutral charisma. Like it is something much worse than that. You know, like we, you know, everyone missed Trump in 16, how, you know, Trump could never be president, but people thought like Trump could never be president because they thought, oh, he was too offensive for America. It's not that JD Vance is too offensive or too extreme. It is that he is like so smug and just devoid of charisma. Like, I don't know, man. Who knows? Who knows in this country? But it does he does not have what Trump had.

No, of course not. Like, not even close. And you see I think Ronda Santis looks better than him.

I I maybe you know that that that's that's a lot. I think a tough one. I think he probably is a little more deaf than Ronda Santis, but um Ronda but I think he's more odious.

Yeah, more repulsive for sure. Yeah, more repulsive. Look, I look I I have a lot of thoughts about this. This is coming maybe next week uh depending on how my long flights go. But a that's coming in at message box soon is I have a lot of thoughts about JD Vance what we should be doing right now to frame JD Vance because we have this advantage as Democrats. I

feel like we're trying every week here Dan that we we are we are I mean I'm trying to I'm trying to take what we're doing here and move it out to the rest of the world and also maybe focus what we're doing. Uh maybe be be motivated by strategy not just pure unadulterated rage. Um but like we JD Vance is going to be the Republican nominee. There's almost no history of a sitting vice president not getting the nomination. Will he have to fight for it? Will he get a primary? Probably. But he's probably he's almost certainly going to be the nominee. So, we have another three years to shape his public image.

And Republicans did this very successfully with Al Gore from 1996 to 2000 by the point where everyone thought that Al Gore, this like famous boy scout, was now this inate liar who made up things about inventing the internet and was corrupt in all these ways. JD Vance, we just have to let people see who he is. And but like he does not have any of the charisma or cool factor. I know that that's gross to say about Trump, but like Trump has something that powered his rise that JD Vance does not have and we can be weaponized against him.

He's a he's a smug weirdo who probably only appeals to incelss. How's that? If I if there was

that John that's no that's a stage direction. That's a stage direction. That's not a message coming down from the top of the mountain with the tablet saying the message says that JD Vance is in line with the oligarchs and he's going to hurt working people. I don't want to get

it's to it's to ridicule the living out weird. He's a he's a odious individual. That's the message.

All the other stuff is right, but that's that is the message. Um he's out there doing a bunch of media. Uh he also did a sit down with Megan Kelly. Uh, speaking of, uh, people we love, um, where he brought up, uh, Trump's attack on Caitlyn Collins earlier the week, earlier in the week, um, we will play that uh, for you first in case you haven't seen uh, the the Trump attack on Caitlyn Collins. Let's watch.

You know, she's a young woman. I don't think I've ever seen you smile. I've known you for 10 years. I don't think I've ever seen a smile on your face.

You know why you know why you're not smiling? Because, you know, you're not telling the truth.

No, exact. She was trying to say she wasn't smiling because she was asking about survivors of Jeffrey Epstein's sexual abuse of underage girls. That's that's what she was asking about a couple times when he did that. Uh but here's what the vice president had to say about it.

She's asking a question. The president says, "Why don't you ever smile?" Yeah. And it's actually like so perceptive. Even if you're asking a tough question, even if you take your job very seriously, like why does it always have to be so antagonistic?

Well, I laugh cuz I saw online everybody was calling him sexist for saying that. And I literally said the same thing about Caitlyn Collins a year ago on my show. She never smiles. Every once in a while you have to smile. Roger Als used to tell us that. Every once in a while you remember smile.

I bet he did. I bet he I bet Roger Als did tell them to smile and a whole bunch of other things that they have alleged in court documents. I mean, this is this goes back to the earlier point, but like to understand JD Vance is understand him as someone who is an empty vessel for ambition. He just wants power and he'll do anything. If he's has to be against Trump, it'll be against Trump, it has to be for Trump, before Trump. You and I have debated about how much he actually believes this stuff. I think he does, but it's not neither here nor there. But I think the lesson he's taken from Trump is that the path to political power in America is to be an unapologetic And maybe you can get away.

Trump has gotten away with that. But Trump has like a showmanlike appeal, right, that works for him that JD Vance does not have. So he's just an He's not a funny

Once again, right there, he added the smuggness, too, of like a of the most annoying pundit because he did punditry about Trump. It wasn't just like I agree with what Trump said, right? Which would have been bad enough. It was like, and if you actually look, it's so perceptive. It was so perceptive to uh just scream at a at a female reporter that she should smile more while she's asking about victims of sexual abuse. So perceptive. He's like he's like

he sucks. He sucks. Yeah. His approval rating is not great. He's like they were asking college young college Republicans who were like, you know, as extreme as they get these days, college Republicans, and he's like 18 points underwater with college Republicans. uh these are supposed, you know, he's supposed to be like the young next generation leader of the party, not not

he is not he's not he's not going to appeal to young folk. I mean, Sarah Longwell has pointed out in multiple occasions just how poorly he does in focus groups with young Republicans and also she said on Twitter recently that uh in focus groups of women, JD Vance gives consistently gives them the ick Sarah's words. Um he like he has real

and then you know people like Clavvicular think that you know Gavin Newsome Mogen Yes, he's very he's very mogable. Yes,

that's his problem. Is that the way to use it? I have no idea. I honestly have no idea. And

Austin's shaking his head. No. Anyway, um while we're talking about the assault on the free press, we should mention what uh Jeff Bezos, another person we love, uh did to the Washington Post this week. On Wednesday, the Post laid off about a third of its employees. Uh the sports and book sections were eliminated. The metro section and international coverage were also hit hard. Uh a lot of incredible journalists, including guests we've had across all of our crooked pods, lost their jobs. Um adding insult to injury, neither Bezos or Will Lewis, the publisher Bezos appointed in 2023, had the balls to log on to the Zoom uh where the layoffs were announced. Uh this is according to Ashley Parker, our our pal Ashley, who's a former Postjournalist now at The Atlantic. Um, meanwhile, uh, this is what Jeff Bezos has been up to lately. On Monday, he welcomed Pete Hegsth at his, uh, Blue Origin rocket

facility. Afterwards, writing to Hegsth on Twitter, "Huge honor to have you at Blue Origin today. Lovely." And of course, uh, Amazon also sank around $75 million into the Melania dock. That's $40 million for the licensing rights, 35 million for marketing, which, you know, they're they hit 8 million so far. So, so close to making that money back. Um, I know you wrote about all this uh uh all what happened with the post this week in Thursday's message box. So, the floor is yours, Dan.

I'm going to rant for a minute, so I'm going to apologize to everyone in advance, but the look, we talk all the time. I write all the time about the declining relevance of legacy media institutions and how the economics of of big media have gotten so hard. And so like some of feels the things like this should not feel like unexpected. But I think this is an absolute tragedy. It did not need to happen. There are the on the day in which the post announced these layoffs in the New York Times announced that they had gained more than a million sub digital subscribers in 2025 and their revenue was up 10% year-over-year. The Wall Street Journal is uh remain strong.

They've been growing. They've been adding subscribers. The Post is is our other national newspaper. They could have had a very similar path and maybe they couldn't be the New York Times, the Wall Street Journal who have very specific business models, but they absolutely could succeeded and they didn't succeed for two reasons. The first is that Jeff Bezos hired Will Lewis who is an absolute doofus from he worked came from the British tabloids. He immediately showed up. He was inshed in the phone hacking scandal in in the UK. Lied about it. Lost the newsroom.

Never had a plan. Didn't seem particularly interested in executing a plan. had no real attempt to actually save the paper. Did not seem to care about the paper. But the biggest reason is Jeff Bezos because when he bought it in 2013 for $250 million, which is uh couch couch cushion money for him, he was heralded as like a savior of a great journalistic institution. He put money into it. that he be, you know, was sort of like he was treated as a savior and someone who like one of the old media baronss like who would through their generosity was supporting this important institution in the for state and all of that. And then around 2024 he realized that the owning the Washington Post a paper that Donald Trump hated was now going to be bad for business for him. It was going to make him less filthy rich, slightly less filthy rich.

It would make his companies huge successful companies slightly less successful. And so he made a couple of decisions that basically torpedoed the paper. The first was he canled personally cancelled the papers planned endorsement of Kla Harris in 2024 that caused thousands and thousands and tens of thousands of people to uh cancel their subscriptions. And then in 2025 he announced that the Washington Post editorial page was no longer was going to change in a way to make it less likely to anger Trump. It was going to stop doing politics. The whole thing was just ridiculous. It was a naked ploy. And in doing those things, they lost hundreds of thousands of subscribers they could not afford to lose. And it just completely lit on fire the trust the paper had built over many many decades with their audience. And it is it is absolutely a tragedy. I like I care about this a lot because I went to

college in DC. I've read the Post forever. It is not just a great political newspaper that covers Washington, although they do a great job of that. It has one of had one of the all-time great sports sections in any paper ever. Right. Tony Cornheiser, Michael Wilbond, Sally Jenkins wrote there. It covered everything. The metro section, people don't remember this, but that uh Watergate started as a metro section story like the the way that because I lived in DC for for a very long time. There is the town of DC had to mark which is the political stuff.

There's the city, right? But everything else that's happening there, what's happening in the government, what's happening in the suburbs, and the metro section covered that the style section was incredible. uh you remember the profiles done of politicians by our friend Mark Lieovich and Dana Milbank and others uh who wrote those the you know there were great columnists the political reporters there like Dan Balls and David Broder and people like that and that was all destroyed because a man worth a quarter trillion dollars couldn't be bothered to try to save the paper and thought it would be better to for himself to let it die on a vine and what's left like maybe they can bring it back in some way shape or form But right now, what's left is the rotting husk of a great journalistic institution. And everyone in DC and in the country are poor because of it. Everyone except Jeff Bezos.

And look, like some of it definitely is just, you know, I don't want to piss Trump off and, you know, Amazon has contracts with the government and if the government, you know, if Trump turns on Bezos, what's going to happen? All that Some of it's also I think with Jeff Bezos is like he's just another rich guy that thinks uh his niche political views and the views of the people he surrounds himself with are the views of uh most Americans. And so you get this sort of like center right wall streety Silicon Valley kind of sensibility that sort of took over the paper uh at least in the editorial section. Um, and it's just, you know, these billionaires. They're they just they think that they're told yes.

They're surrounded by people who share their views. They all about this and that and politics and and they just they they they are rich enough to buy these toys and then treat them like toys and break them and not really care. Um, and I saw some people say like, well, you know, all these subscribers that quit uh after the canceled editorial uh uh endorsement of Kla Harris like bear some responsibility as well. Like why do you why do you uh stop your subscription when there's so much other great reporting? Who cares about the editorial board? I'm like, I get that, but it's also like at the end of the day, um, you're selling a product to the customer and if the c and if you piss the customer off and they don't buy the product anymore, that's your fault.

Like you can blame the customer for sure. Um, but like that's your you're the one who you're the one who caused them to leave with your decision. I think to the extent there is a larger lesson here it is you know we have talked for a long time about the absolute essential need of building up a progressive pro-democracy media ecosystem and over the many years and I have been to one gazillion meetings uh you know fundraising meetings pitches about this with everyone in the Democratic party and a lot of what you hear is we need our billionaires to come in and support progressive media and you do need that like you need support to do it but the but what a billionaire can give they can also take away. And so the the what you need here is that we're not going to be able to build up a competing ecosystem to Fox News and Breitbart and Daily Wire and all the rest simply by a handful of Democratic billionaires

giving money to progressive content creators and media people. You have to build sustainable businesses. That's the only way that independent media will work. And like that is and you know this, you are running a large media company in Message Box. I'm running a much smaller little media company. But like that is it is that if you are depending on the what are equivalently charitable donations from foundations and individuals that can last you for a while but one day that's going to go away either because the billionaire changes their mind the economy changes or whatever it is. And so it has to be a sustainable business which is why the beginning of this podcast you made the request that people subscribe to friends of the pod because that is one of the ways in which we make crooked media a sustainable business. is one of the reasons why I'm constantly bothering people to subscribe to messagebox

because it's one of the ways in which continue to do it because I'm not depending on anything other I'm building we're trying to build products that people want and will pay for so that we can make more of those products which we believe is good for democracy and good for our messaging.

That's exactly right. It's because it's not it's not just to sustain us now but it's to grow is because we want to we want to make sure how many journalists are out of a job right now, right? And like we desperately need more reporting. And I'm not even like just it's not even about like opinion reporting at this point or opinion journalism or or punditry or analysis. Like we just need people out there doing reporting. Uh I mean some of the the people that were laid off from the post. They were in war zones in Ukraine.

They fired a they fired the post reporter while she was in a war zone. I mean it's like we are we are heading into this

by email. They fired her by email. Be very clear. we've been dealing with um you know misinformation and this like difficulty in figuring out like a shared reality. We are now it's going to be supercharged by artificial intelligence and it is if it is not the time to have less reporting you know because pretty pretty soon people aren't going to know what to believe at all. Um and and reporting helps us do that. So I you know I I I know that some people are like that you see some and a lot of right-wingers and and MAGA people and just like annoying pundits are like oh it's a business and a business failed and you know you don't need to cry over it blah blah blah. It's like fine whatever but like you you need journalism is valuable for a democracy.

Reporting is valuable for a democracy. If we want to live in a world where we have good information, where we know what's going on and we can make decisions based on good information about how we live together, like you need journalism for that. So it is it is true that some media businesses are doomed to fail because of changing economics and we can talk for a long time about what has happened with social media platforms and advertising and now AI, but the Washington Post was not one of those. The Washington Post had a clear path to sustainability and they did not go down that path because Jeff Bezos did not take them down that path.

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Thank you. Good to see you. Thank you for doing this. Um, there has been in recent weeks so much attention, understandably so, on what's been happening with ice in Minnesota, but at the same time, my ice has been in your state. Um, and I've seen some of the videos and they seem quite terrifying to lots of your residents. Can you tell us what that experience was like with ice in your state and what's happening with ice right now in Maine?

Sure. Thanks for the question. Listen, um, we heard three weeks ago that ICE was looking for a staging area. So we got word they might be coming, the cavalry coming and we started preparing and I said I made a public announcement that listen if they were sending ICE agents with those provocative and violent uh uh behaviors that they they showed us in Minneapolis and elsewhere that they weren't welcome here. Um well they came and we kept an eye on things. We worked with local law enforcement and state law enforcement and with local organizations to keep track of what they were doing and where they were doing it.

And so for about a full week um they began well first of all they announced they were making this operation and calling it catch of the day operation catch of the day which is about as insulting as you get. I mean it was not a fishing derby. It involved real human beings being taken violently from their cars taken from workplaces and schools and from their families and homes and taken god knows where. one state to another state to another state and they said they had a target of 1,400 people they wanted to take into custody. 1400 people well these aren't the worst of the worst let me tell you right now and what we saw happening on the streets of Portland and Louison and Bitterhood Maine was not anything to do with the worst of the worst. We saw people with no criminal backgrounds, no criminal charges, being hauled from cars, being hauled from their homes and taken into custody and kind of disappearing,

disappearing. And that included a civil engineer who was here on a construction job. It included two law enforcement agents, two corrections officers in two different counties who were snatched from their cars and their cars left running in the streets. So that our the local sheriff said this is a this is a botched operation. This is bush league policing, bush league law enforcement. So that's what we saw. Has it subsided? Well, we've heard a couple more reports yesterday of people being taken uh and by unidentified officers, unidentified people. That's disturbing. Um Susan Collins made an announcement that the enhanced ICE operation had ceased. We have yet to have confirmed the confirmation of that. But the point is why did it happen in the first place?

Seriously, catch of the day. Why did she not know it was coming in the first place? Why didn't she stop it in the first place? Stop people with no criminal charges being taken from their families, snatched from the state of Maine. And so now I'm working with local authorities and organizations to identify exactly who has been disappeared. They claim they took three 206 people. Who are they? Where are they now? Under what legal status are they now? What warrants were used? We haven't seen any yet. And identify how how people can be reunited with their families and get back to work and contribute to their communities. As you point out, Susan Collins announced on Twitter, I think, that the operation was over um and claimed credit for it. This is, I imagine, sort of how she's going to run for re-election in the state to try to show independence of some kind from Trump or show influence with Trump.

But you say you have no evidence that the operation has that that these extra ICE officers have left or anything like that. Is that correct?

Yeah. Fewer reports of kidnappings and whatnot. Fewer reports of people disappearing from their cars and and homes. That's true, but who knows? Would it restart tomorrow? Um, they gave us very little warning that it was happening in the first place. And we've demanded answers. The attorney general and I wrote a letter last Friday to Christine M and insisted on answers about who the people are and where they are and uh and their legal status and whatnot. So, Susan Collins has the ability to control this behavior if she wanted to. She has that ability, but she's been playing these political games for a long time. And she has voted with Trump, as you know, like 94% of the time. 94% of She's not fooling anybody here by claiming a victory lap. It's like they came in. Why did they come in in the first place? Why didn't you stop them if you had that power? And she's a person who, you know, supported voted to

confirm Christine Nome. Christino who has no law enforcement ability or experience who shouldn't be heading up this agency to begin with and um you know where did the orders come from where do they get these 1400 targets how we need answers

there's a larger conversation about what's going to happen with ICE and I think there's two parts of that conversation there's what can be done right now short term while Trump is president and then there's a question of what happens when a Democrat is president and hopefully has a Senate congressional majority let's start with the first part here So over the next week or so, Congress is negotiating over the funding for the Department of Homeland Security Bill. Democrats want some set of guard rails in exchange for their votes to fund the Department.

You're running for Senate. Um, seems like a fair question to ask. What What would it take if you were in the Senate right now? What sort of guardrails would you need for your vote to keep the department funded? Well, first of all, there shouldn't be $1 more additional funding for ICE and for DHS without concrete controls, substantive controls, reforms to account for the behavior they've already conducted, already engaged in, and to prevent such behavior in the future. Basic training would be a good thing. Sure, body cams, they've been talking about body cams, but you got to tell them to turn them on and save the tapes, for instance. You know, our police officers in Maine, they know how to do that. They've been trained.

It's sort of simple, stupid. Deescalation techniques. Of course, it sounds like this group has been trained to escalate, not to deescalate. And of course, there's no need to be anonymous and unidentified. If you're a trained police officer under basic standards, you shouldn't have any problem identifying yourself before you make an arrest, stop somebody on the street, or tear into somebody's home or car. It's basic police procedure. Identify yourself and so um there are a lot of other concrete things you could do but not a dollar more in funding until you account for what's happened and have independent investigations into what's already happened. We the people have no confidence in the suggestion that there might be a an investigation into the killing of Alex Prey or um or Renee Good. This is not happening. There should be a transparent and independent investigation. We know how to do that. I

was attorney general for eight years in Maine. We did independent investigations into the police use of deadly force. It's by law and by good good public policy in our state and most every state. We we know good law enforcement in this state. We train them up for 18 weeks minimum in Maine. And I help teach the courses on constitutional law, Fourth Amendment, and such. They know better than to do what the ICE agents have been doing in Maine and other states in recent months. And our law enforcement agents, they don't have to wear masks. They know better. And they don't go out and do a sweep of whole communities based on some artificial quota set from set by some political figurehead for no good reason.

Would you would you require a ban on masks in exchange for your vote? Sure. I mean, it's sort of simple, fundamental. Why would any law why would any law enforcement agency need to wear masks for fear of retaliation? Well, what would there be retaliation about if you weren't doing some bad stuff, right?

I mean, that's sort of the point, right? That's the point of the accountability.

Don't do it in the first place. You won't worry about retaliation. All right, let's talk long term. Uh, or medium-term, I guess. Your primary opponent, Graham Platner, has called for abolishing ICE. Um, in a CNN interview, you didn't go that far. Can you tell me what you would how what would you want to see if you were in the Senate? How to change ICE if we're not if if I'm correcting that you you're not for abolishing it. What does a new reformed ICE look like?

It could end up you being abolished, but first of all going to account have accountability. As I mentioned, investigations into what's gone on so far and how do you prevent that from happening again? And for goodness sakes, when bad things do happen, you have to coordinate with local and state officials to investigate bad stuff like the killings of two people in Min in Minneapolis. We investigate killings here in Maine. We know how to do that. And you don't just abscond with the car, the body, the evidence, and not let local enforce enforcement who know what they're doing investigate bad behavior like that and and and violent acts by uh ICE. So require independent investigations into these actions and prepare for investigations coordinated with state and local officials if things continue to happen like that. That's sort of basics. basic retraining the people who've been hired with these amazing

recruitment bonuses from the the big bad bill of last summer. Retrain them if they've been trained in the first place. Teach them deescalation. It seems like these people have been trained in escalation, not deescalation. Make sure they're accountable and obviously um identifying themselves. a lot of lot of lot of nitty-gritty things that would have to be reworked to uh to hold ICE accountable for what they've done and uh let them continue operating in any sense of the word, but not $1 more in funding. And look, then there's the money they've gotten from last summer to build these detention centers in states across the country. That's pretty scary, too. And that ought to stop.

At the beginning of your answer, you said it could be abolished. Uh what do you mean by that? Well, if they can't make these basic concrete reforms, these these changes, they can't let them go on doing what they're doing, terrorizing neighborhoods and communities and whole cities. Terrorizing the public safety and people's fundamental constitutional rights, civil rights. So abolishing IC is on the table or moving or I sometimes I hesitate to just use the slogan but moving enforcement to a different part of the government.

But the problem is the problem is if you change the name, this administration will just create another agency with a different name with the same mission. A very dangerous violent mission. You have to stop the violence in whoever's name it's done. And it's the people giving the orders from above that are the threat to our country,

right? And theoretically under this scenario, it's a Democratic president doing this, right? Like I like I don't have any any hope that or idea that this would happen under Trump, but I'm sort of thinking of 2029. You're you're in the Senate in a Senate majority potentially. We have a Democratic House. We have President pick your your candidate of choice. Uh, and so it's like what can Democrats do there where it's not just Trump just not renaming it. It's a Democratic decision about how to enforce immigration law and whether ICE as currently constituted would be part of that.

That's a question. I guess I was just surprised to hear you say abolishing is on the table. So I just wanted to get to some clarity on that.

If there's no other way to change what's going on right now, but first and foremost, the Congress right this minute has the power to withhold further funding. And the Senate has the power to stand up to this administration and demand concrete answers, concrete reforms, changes, and accountability. And that's what must happen. I think the American people are insisting on that. Even the Republicans are hearing that voice back home that things have got to change. Things have got to change. They got to And you know what? It can't just be, oh, let's wait 10 days, another two weeks, kick the can down the road like Washington tends to do anyway. Look at the ACA. and let's say, oh, let's start a task force and look at this, a commission, a blue ribbon, pink ribbon, green ribbon commission. No, no way.

Okay, people know what's happened. We don't need to you don't need to reexamine things, but let's get answers to the questions that were raised just the other day in those hearings from this brothers of Renee Good, from other victims of the of the Minneapolis rampage. Get answers for what happened then and what how we can stop it from continuing first and foremost. And until that happens, not $1 more. But in the last couple days, Trump has said that he wants to federalize elections, had the federal government take over. He has doubled and tripled and now quadrupled down on that in recent days. Uh Steve Bannon uh said that I he declared that ICE would be showing up at polling places on election day. We have the director of national intelligence seizing ballots in Fulton County. Have you begun thinking about how to secure elections in Maine from federal interference this November?

Sure. I mean, these are dangerous, dangerous words, dangerous talk, dangerous thoughts, dangerous threats to our democracy. And as governor of this state, I will stand firm and as a state that has repeatedly large turnout, a large turnout of voters every election year, one of the highest turns turnouts in the country. We will protect every individual's right to vote this November and uh take every action necessary to secure the polls and secure absentee ballots. We just fought a battle with Republicans this past November where they tried to take away absentee ballots, put a measure on the ballot to take away balloting and we defeated it by a huge margin because people don't want to do that. They they hold dear their right to vote. It is sacrosanked not just in this state but every state and we will make every effort to make sure that the polls are not violated by some agency like ICE.

The constitution says the states have authority over elections and we will assert that authority under my governorship and uh in this state make sure that people are are able to vote safely without intimidation without um deprivation of of rights.

You when you announced that you were running for Senate it it it appeared they came after like significantly long deliberation. you thought long and hard about it and you decided that you were the best person to do it. This was the time to go. You know, my sort of I I intuited from that that you believe that you're the best person to beat uh Susan Collins. Uh do you think you're the only person to beat Susan Collins? Look, right now I am the issue is electability right now in this primary and we have run people against Susan Collins before, wonderful people, but we've run people who are not tested.

I have run and won two statewide elections. I had a seven-way primary the first time and I won. I had a four-way general election and I won. I have been up and down this state. People know me. Whether they agree with everything I say or not, they know me and they know that what you see is what you get. I'm the person in this primary who has done that, who's won two statewide elections by 13 points last time, increasing margins. I'm the only person in this primary who's delivered progress for main people when it comes to health care, reproductive rights, education, climate action, all those things. And I'm the only person in this primary who's actually stood up to Donald Trump and I'll do it again as a US senator. So I put my record up of electability.

This this is a crucial state as you well know. control of the US Senate, I believe, goes through Maine. And the Republican machinery has already promised they've already committed $42 million to an advertising campaign this coming fall. They've already had Susan Collins up on TV saturating the airwaves since last fall, saying all these good things about her and trying to build up her image and trying to get behind the fact that she voted. She gave the critical vote. She cast the critical vote to um confirm Brett Kavanaaugh. She cast votes for Robert F. Kennedy Jr. She cast the vote for Christy Gnome. She cast the votes for Linda McMahon. All these decisions and her 94% uh voting rights voting uh rate with Donald Trump. And this is the woman who said just a couple years ago, Donald Trump, I think he's learned his lesson, quote unquote, you know, I'll take her on. I'll take her on because it'll be a

hyper local campaign. What have you done for Maine? What have you done for Maine? And I can go toe-to-toe with Susan Collins on that basis and I can win. One of the concerns um as you know and it's been brought up in every interview that you've done um has been about uh about your age um and so you have you know I've appreciated that you've taken that on directly in a lot of ways but one way in which you took it on is that you have made a pledge to serve one term. Can you talk to me about why you made that pledge and whether some people's fears that this just means we're going to have another open seat race in in Maine in six years uh is a concern. What's really critical to me is the next couple years. The more I see what's happening in Washington, you brought up just a few minutes ago the threat to our elections this year, that's not going to stop. And if we don't take control of our country in the

next couple years, I worry we may not have a country. And that is why I'm running because we need to take back control of the US Senate. We need to stand up to Donald Trump. We need to push forward on things like universal health care. And I have the ability and the experience to start on day one getting stuff done, making these changes, standing up for the rights of people, standing up for a better economy affordability and progress for people and health care and education and otherwise. I have the ability to do that on day one. And I'm not going to start on day two dialing for dollars and running for reelection.

I want my whole focus and my whole focus will be on getting the job done as soon as I get there. We have a young bench be behind me and the uh office would be open another six years. God forbid. We still have a country. We still have elections. uh there will be other people behind me and I am uh always been pleased to mentor young people and younger uh Democratic party candidates and I'll continue to do that as well. But I'm giving it my all. I'm not running because I need a position or a platform or resume builder. I don't need that. I need to be down there. And I think people say, "Well, you won't have seniority." Really? If I'm part of taking back the US Senate, my voice will be heard and it will be heard loudly.

Last question for you. Um, you have said that you are undecided on how you would vote for Senator Schumer as leader. Um, my understanding at least is that Senator Schumer spent a lot of time and energy uh recruiting you to run for Senate. I've been on the other end of summer some of Senator some of Senator Schumer's phone calls over the years, so I can imagine what that was like. the DSC uh is supporting you. Is that an awkward position to be in? And what would and what how would you decide whether to support Senator Schumer or not? Like what is the what is making you undecided on that point?

Let me back up a second. Before I decided to run in midocctober, I had had exactly one conversation with Chuck Schumer. One

Oh, interesting. Okay, that's good to know. In January or February of last year, he was not pushy. He said, he simply said, "We think you're the you you're the candidate who can win, who can beat Susan Collins." And I gave it a lot of thought in the meantime. It was I who decided to run. Nobody else. Anybody knows me knows that I'm not beholden to anybody. I have made no commitment to Chuck Schumer. Nobody in Washington, you know, pulls my chain, yanks my chain. Whether it's Chuck Schumer or Bernie Sanders or Donald Trump, people know that I stand up and speak my mind. And the question I will ask anybody running for majority leader next year, year from now, would be, what can you do to help me do the best job I can for Maine people? How can you help me help Maine people? And I've had conversations with other senators who well may be in the running for majority lead. I don't know.

But I've had held an open door to them as well and happy to hear from them uh on all accounts. So, you know, I have no commitment. Um, I appreciate that the DSC thinks I'm the best candidate. Uh, I think I'm the best candidate also. I happen to agree with that and that's why I'm running. And let me be clear, I would be running for this seat because I feel so strongly that we have got to stand up for our country, especially in the next few months, and the next few years. I would be running for this whether Chuck Schumer were in office or anybody else in that office. I chose to run and I am running with a commitment and the passion to help turn things around in a broken Washington DC in a in a government that is not simply not doing right the right things but is doing all the wrong things. a government that is, you know, taking taking a a wrecking ball not just to the White House, but to the Constitution, to our

economy, to the rights of American people. I can't stand for that anymore. My work isn't finished here. With everything I've done at the state level, I'm very anxious to go on to the federal level and continue the work I've done at the state level, but also stand up to an abuse of power the likes of which we have never seen before because I think these times are most urgent, most urgent, dangerous times that we've seen since the Civil War. That's what I feel and that's why I'm running.

Governor Mills, thank you so much for joining us. Good luck on the campaign trail and we will be we will talk to you again uh before your primary I hope.

Hope so. Thank you very much. That's our show for today. Thanks to Janet Mills for coming on. Tommy's going to be back on the feed on Super Bowl Sunday. He's going to be interviewing sports journalist Pablo Tore. Bye everyone.

Bye everyone.

Questions about this episode

Who speaks in "Democrats SLAM Trump Over Election Takeover Plot"?

John Favreau (Host), Dan Pfeiffer (Host), Janet Mills (Guest).

What is "Democrats SLAM Trump Over Election Takeover Plot" about?

Democrats are expressing alarm over Donald Trump's potential attempts to manipulate the upcoming midterm elections, highlighting concerns about election security and the implications of political interference. The discussion also covers various political issues, including immigration policy, media dynamics, and the changing landscape of major media outlets like the Washington Post.

What is mentioned in this Pod Save America episode?

27 people, works and ideas are mentioned, including Donald Trump, Pod Save America, ICE, Janet Mills, Minnesota, Department of Homeland Security. Each one on this page links to its own page with every episode that mentions it.

How long is "Democrats SLAM Trump Over Election Takeover Plot"?

The episode runs 1 h 37 min; the transcript is about 18,813 words in 213 timestamped sections.

More from Pod Save America

About this transcript: the episode's spoken words as captioned on YouTube, split into timestamped sections. Reclip.Me locates every person, work and idea in the text, keeps the time it is first named, and quotes the words around it verbatim. Last updated February 7, 2026.